Oil recommendation - 2013 Dodge Dart

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Hootbro
Originally Posted By: demarpaint

IIRC Mobil 1 doesn't meet the Chrysler warranty approvals. Call it politics.


Mobil 1 will stand behind their oil in any Chrysler engine requiring MS-6395 specified oil. It is not so much that Mobil 1 could not meet that spec vs. them actually applying for certification and Chrysler approving.

You are correct in that their politics involved when it comes to Mobil 1 and Chrysler. During the bankruptcy reorganization, Mobil 1 would not extend product on credit to Chrysler and Chrysler took offense to this and switched over to Pennzoil Synthetic as their recommended factory fill synthetic.


No doubt in my mind that M1 will do just fine in a Chrysler engine. I was just bringing up a point that's all.

Still while under warranty it is always best to use an oil that is blessed by the vehicle mfg.

 

[RamAir5]

UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.

 

[Nickdfresh]

You're not getting better engine protection with a 5W-30, but either oil is fine. I'd use synthetic in any case in the Tigershark...

 

[kschachn]

What is being protected better?

Originally Posted By: RamAir5
UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted By: RamAir5
UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.


The 'research gathered' is all opinion. There is no empirical data that supports this. Use what is recommended in the OM.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: RamAir5
UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.


The 'research gathered' is all opinion. There is no empirical data that supports this. Use what is recommended in the OM.




I agree.

It's getting to the point that this whole argument is beyond stale.

People will believe what they choose to believe,regardless of what evidence stares them in the face.

 

[mikefxu]

I run 20w-50 in my 2013 Prius for extreme protection.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: earlyre
Originally Posted By: Hootbro

While another member here has eluded to FIAT having a relationship with Shell in Europe, I do not think that factored in with Mobil here in the USA and FIAT/Chrysler.


if it didn't, the timing was VERY coincidental.
Mobil 1 was the FF on SRT Vehicles up to the point where Fiat got involved. at which time it became a Pennzoil Product made Specifically for SRT engines.(Pennzoil Ultra 0w40 SRT)

Pennzoil Ultra is the FF/ Recommended oil for Ferrari.

SRT themselves claim the catalyst for the switch was the GF-5 Specification.
http://www.drivesrt.com/news/2013/12/pen...-oil-blend.html


M1 0W-40 is printed right on the oil cap of my car's engine. Built mid 05.

Seems pretty obvious that Fiat had something to do with it, as Shell is their oil all the way.

IMO based on mfgr specs the M1 is a better oil anyway for a ton of cars...

 

[RamAir5]

Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: RamAir5
UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.


The 'research gathered' is all opinion. There is no empirical data that supports this. Use what is recommended in the OM.




I agree.

It's getting to the point that this whole argument is beyond stale.

People will believe what they choose to believe,regardless of what evidence stares them in the face.


http://www.100percentsynthetic.com/artic...al%20Story.html

http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/518/motor-oils

 

[wemay]

http://www.valvolineeurope.com/english/products/engine_oils?CID=2269&cp=cp1

-Myth: Thicker motor oil is better for your engine and
increases engine life.

Fact: The main reason vehicle manufacturers recommend thinner or lighter viscosity grades of engine oil is because a gain in fuel economy may be achieved. Lower viscosity oils may help reduce internal engine friction. As a result, it takes less
energy to pump the thinner oil throughout the small passages inside an engine.
Thinner motor oil is also essential for easy starting, particularly in cold weather and for good lubrication once the engine starts. Thinner oils, such as SAE 5W-30, will flow faster than heavier motor oils during start-up and initial engine operation helping to protect the engine. The viscosity grade(s) recommended by the vehicle manufacturer depend somewhat on engine design. Engine manufacturers have spent considerable
time and expense experimenting with different viscosity grades. The owner’s manual indicates the grades they feel will best protect the engine at specific temperatures.
While one manufacturer’s engine may require an SAE 10W-40, another manufacturer’s engine may require a SAE 5W-30 viscosity grade. This is likely due to different
tolerances within the engine, field test experience or other engine design factors.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: wemay
http://www.valvolineeurope.com/english/products/engine_oils?CID=2269&cp=cp1

-Myth: Thicker motor oil is better for your engine and
increases engine life.

Fact: The main reason vehicle manufacturers recommend thinner or lighter viscosity grades of engine oil is because a gain in fuel economy may be achieved. Lower viscosity oils may help reduce internal engine friction. As a result, it takes less
energy to pump the thinner oil throughout the small passages inside an engine.
Thinner motor oil is also essential for easy starting, particularly in cold weather and for good lubrication once the engine starts. Thinner oils, such as SAE 5W-30, will flow faster than heavier motor oils during start-up and initial engine operation helping to protect the engine. The viscosity grade(s) recommended by the vehicle manufacturer depend somewhat on engine design. Engine manufacturers have spent considerable
time and expense experimenting with different viscosity grades. The owner’s manual indicates the grades they feel will best protect the engine at specific temperatures.
While one manufacturer’s engine may require an SAE 10W-40, another manufacturer’s engine may require a SAE 5W-30 viscosity grade. This is likely due to different
tolerances within the engine, field test experience or other engine design factors.



The fact they used tolerances instead of clearances seems to indicate that it was written by the marketing department and not somebody intimately familiar with engine design.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: RamAir5
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: wemay
Originally Posted By: RamAir5
UPDATE. The local Dodge dealer advised a good synthetic 5w30 was acceptable in the Dart even though 0w20 is suggested. They have been substituting 5w30 occasionally without issues. From the research I've gathered it seems 20w oils are for CAFE ratings, only. Auto manufacturers are being pushed to squeeze as much MPG out of a car as they can, regardless of the consequences. I'll take a little better engine protection over a 1 MPG increase any day.


The 'research gathered' is all opinion. There is no empirical data that supports this. Use what is recommended in the OM.




I agree.

It's getting to the point that this whole argument is beyond stale.

People will believe what they choose to believe,regardless of what evidence stares them in the face.


http://www.100percentsynthetic.com/artic...al%20Story.html

http://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/518/motor-oils

Both those opinions are way out of date and have proven to be unwarranted.

 

[wemay]

Good catch OVERKILL. I was just playing devil's advocate. This thin vs thick argument has become overly dramatisized. I say run what's recommended by the mfr., but I also don't think that the use of one viscosity up will change the earth's rotation.

I also doubt CAFE has a hidden agenda to lessen the durability of our engines.

 

[Noey]

Gratz on the Dart. It is an Alfa Romeo, let's hear it for globalization. To save money, they're making platforms and then adapting them to the requirements of each individual market, but it's really an Alfa, the engine is from FIAT, made in Michigan. They say the stick is especially sweet.

I find it hard to believe that Chrysler is recommending a full syn, it's like mandating Super gas, the cost is a bit off putting to many potential customers. You're free to use it, but I'd only use the viscosity Chrysler recommends, not something that is "just OK". As an aside, I'd like to know of anyone's experience with engine failure or excessive engine wear on tear down attributable to a dino that has the proper viscosity, a good filter changed at every OCI, and an OCI that's maybe 1/2 the manufacturers rec, or 7500 whichever is less.

 

[ThirdeYe]

Originally Posted By: Noey
Gratz on the Dart. It is an Alfa Romeo, let's hear it for globalization. To save money, they're making platforms and then adapting them to the requirements of each individual market, but it's really an Alfa, the engine is from FIAT, made in Michigan. They say the stick is especially sweet.

I find it hard to believe that Chrysler is recommending a full syn, it's like mandating Super gas, the cost is a bit off putting to many potential customers. You're free to use it, but I'd only use the viscosity Chrysler recommends, not something that is "just OK". As an aside, I'd like to know of anyone's experience with engine failure or excessive engine wear on tear down attributable to a dino that has the proper viscosity, a good filter changed at every OCI, and an OCI that's maybe 1/2 the manufacturers rec, or 7500 whichever is less.


I wouldn't be that surprised that they're recommending a full synthetic. Even my mom's lowly 2013 Honda Fit recommends 0W-20, which as far as I know only comes in synthetic.

 

[Hootbro]

My wife's Fiat 500 has the same engine as that Dart. The owners manual calls out only 5W-30 in either dino or synthetic so long as it meets the MS-6395 spec.

 

[Whimsey]

Originally Posted By: Hootbro
My wife's Fiat 500 has the same engine as that Dart. The owners manual calls out only 5W-30 in either dino or synthetic so long as it meets the MS-6395 spec.


I guess that the MS-6395 spec is not viscosity limited like Ford's spec's. I'm using Havoline Synthetic 5W-20 and it's spec'd for MS-6395.

Whimsey

 

[Hootbro]

Originally Posted By: Whimsey

I guess that the MS-6395 spec is not viscosity limited like Ford's spec's. I'm using Havoline Synthetic 5W-20 and it's spec'd for MS-6395.

Whimsey


Does not appear to be viscosity limited for MS-6395. If anything, it seems to not be a stringent spec to get certified to as Valvoline conventional meets it without any apparent change to formulation. Nor does it appear to require it to be synthetic.

 

[kschachn]

Here's a discussion on it from a while back, and specifics about M1:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3174751

Originally Posted By: Hootbro
Does not appear to be viscosity limited for MS-6395. If anything, it seems to not be a stringent spec to get certified to as Valvoline conventional meets it without any apparent change to formulation. Nor does it appear to require it to be synthetic.

 

[cp3]

Good info here on MS-6395. Part way down is a letter outlining the spec.