Car and Driver Lightning Lap VIII!

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Ford's 650HP Mustang can't get close to matching a 500HP Corvette on a road course.


Why would it? The Mustang competes with the Camaro, not the Corvette. Ford doesn't produce a car to compete with the 'vette, only Chrysler does, with the Viper.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Originally Posted By: dailydriver

Prediction? The next generation Z/28 leaves the exotics with nothing to brag about besides body weight, LED lights, and fancy interiors.


Yes, can you imagine if that smaller lighter platform has all of the; power, handling dynamics, and passive aero benefits of the current Z28?!?! YIKES!

I'd better start saving for one, as I'd LOVE to be able to absolutely destroy all of the uppity/snooty M/AMG/P-car/Nismo GTR/etc. owners around here with a 'lowly' "mullet-mobile", and be PROUD of it.

Originally Posted By: A Harman
Why not spend your money on making your current Camaro as fast as a new Z28? Could it be done? I've been seeing new Z28's in the parking lot at work, but don't see myself buying one. Too big to be a Camaro, in my opinion. I prefer the sleek shape and trim size of the 4th-Gen Camaro. I'm thinking about doing an engine swap in mine. LS3 with a hot cam; 485 HP, and the car weighs 300 pounds less than a Z28. Then a lot of work on the chassis and brakes, and maybe I'd get close.


I was referencing a NEXT (6th) gen Z28, built on the smaller, lighter ATS platform (forgot the GM code name for it), NOT the current, weightier, available 5th gen version.

I am almost 1/3 of the way there now with this car, but I would have to drop about $15-20K into it to get ALL of the way there (LS7, or built LS3 swap, built T56, or Jerico 5 speed, MWC/salvage Sprint Cup, watts linked, lightweight, full floater 9" with a Platinum Trac, or Wavetrac diff, Penske 4 way adjustable reservoir dampers, some alloy bits and pieces, carbon fiber hood/body parts, lightweight glass/lexan, and composite seats to shed even more weight off of it's 3100 lb. heft).

Then a set of CCW C10 wheels, 18x11.5 all around, with 315/30-18 Hoosier R6es on them.
THAT should do it, but who knows??

Originally Posted By: A Harman
I'd like to see a matchup between the new Z28 and the Hellcat. I'd bet the Z28 wins.


On a road course, no doubt at all.

 

[ls1mike]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Ford's 650HP Mustang can't get close to matching a 500HP Corvette on a road course.


Why would it? The Mustang competes with the Camaro, not the Corvette. Ford doesn't produce a car to compete with the 'vette, only Chrysler does, with the Viper.

First Ford guy I have heard say that in years. Most of the ones I know think that the Mustang is better than the Corvette.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: ls1mike
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
Ford's 650HP Mustang can't get close to matching a 500HP Corvette on a road course.


Why would it? The Mustang competes with the Camaro, not the Corvette. Ford doesn't produce a car to compete with the 'vette, only Chrysler does, with the Viper.

First Ford guy I have heard say that in years. Most of the ones I know think that the Mustang is better than the Corvette.


I'm hoping that's a good thing?

The 'vette is in a whole other category from the Mustang. It is a dedicated sports car that is lighter and whose design goal is world class performance (as it clearly demonstrated) at an obtainable price. The Mustang and Camaro are both "pony" (though the horse has gotten quite plump....) cars which are designed to be fun, fast and still be able to cart kids/friends around. The high HP versions are still the same car and subsequently the performance will continue to be in-line with the compromises given to the design in order to check all the boxes on the design sheet. Purpose-built sports cars neither are. But they are a lot of fun

And the price/performance they offer is why we see so many of them on the road. They push the right buttons for people.

 

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver

I was referencing a NEXT (6th) gen Z28, built on the smaller, lighter ATS platform (forgot the GM code name for it), NOT the current, weightier, available 5th gen version.



Yes, I got that, and the ATS platform would be a good place to start. But they don't put V8's in the ATS. I'm thinking about skipping over the 5th Gen Camaro and getting a 6th gen, but with my 4th gen at 219K miles and counting, I really have to pace myself.

 

[SteveSRT8]

I don't think anyone will be crying over the lack of a V8 when they see what the General is cooking up in the ATS!

Hint: seen the 420 hp twin turbo V6? It fits!

 

[A_Harman]

I have looked at the ATS coupe as a possible replacement for the Camaro, but got turned off when I saw that a manual is only available with the 2.0L turbo I4. And 4wd is available only with the turbo I4 and an automatic trans. It would be pretty cool to have the 6th Gen Camaro based on the ATS platform with the twin-turbo V6. But the V6 needs to be pumped up to ~500HP and teamed with a 6-speed manual to make me drool over it. If they could keep the weight to 3300 pounds, I wouldn't even quibble about 2WD vs 4WD. If they provide the Horsepower, I'll provide the control.

 

[ls1mike]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I have looked at the ATS coupe as a possible replacement for the Camaro, but got turned off when I saw that a manual is only available with the 2.0L turbo I4. And 4wd is available only with the turbo I4 and an automatic trans. It would be pretty cool to have the 6th Gen Camaro based on the ATS platform with the twin-turbo V6. But the V6 needs to be pumped up to ~500HP and teamed with a 6-speed manual to make me drool over it. If they could keep the weight to 3300 pounds, I wouldn't even quibble about 2WD vs 4WD. If they provide the Horsepower, I'll provide the control.

No doubt. It is why I still have the WS6. I could not bring myself to buy a 5th gen, while it is a very different car and put togther better, there was not enough difference for me to justify the cost. A Camaro on an ATS platform. Yep I would like that. I don't need a V8, but I think a lot of diehard F-body guys like to have them.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Awfully sorry to re-state what we all already know, but there is likely to be no manual trans option in our new hot Camaro.

At least it will likely be 8 speeds and lightning fast, can't be all bad...

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
I'm thinking about skipping over the 5th Gen Camaro and getting a 6th gen, but with my 4th gen at 219K miles and counting, I really have to pace myself.


Yes, you have me beat by ~50K miles.

So much for those haters/import nameplate ONLY fanboyzz who claim that these cars literally "fall apart driving them off the dealer's lot".

 

[DoubleWasp]

I can't see GM doing away with either V8 or stickshift for the next Camaro. Granted, the ATS doesn't carry a V8, but that does not mean the chassis can't be modified for it to fit.

GM has never developed a technology for the Corvette that it didn't split as many ways as possible. They're not going to keep the new LT1 strictly for the Corvette. And if they'll put a stickshift in a Cadillac, I'll bet they're premier pony car gets one too. That new 7-speed is just itching to have its costs split as well.

 

[hattaresguy]

GM pretty much stated that as their company policy, they parts share to get costs down.

I expect the Corvettes drive train to find its way into a number of Cadillac models and the Camaro.

Same with the Corvettes Brembo carbon brakes, I bet they show up as options on the new V models.