Oil additives
- Thread starter minis
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Engine restore is simply thick oil.
Cera tec is high pressure gear oil. It lubercates well but there is a reason not many oil manufactures use it (in large doses). It produces ash and helps with build up of engine sludge.
Does it work?
Yes, as a lubercant.
Would I use it?
No, the added risk of sludge for slightly better lubrication isn't justifable to me.
Cera tec is high pressure gear oil. It lubercates well but there is a reason not many oil manufactures use it (in large doses). It produces ash and helps with build up of engine sludge.
Does it work?
Yes, as a lubercant.
Would I use it?
No, the added risk of sludge for slightly better lubrication isn't justifable to me.
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
Originally Posted By: minis
Which would you say is better?
None. What issue do you want to solve?
Which would you say is better?
None. What issue do you want to solve?
I just bought a 2014 Toyota Tacoma and the dealer offers 2 years of free maintenance, including oil changes. The oil change includes the additive Krex which I've declined and will continue to decline. Just stick with oil and leave out the additives as the previous poster said, may produce ash and sludge.
To be clear, not all additives will produce ash and/or sludge. Don't think anyone has implied that but I thought it'd be good to be sure.
Here's what the calculus should be:
IF you KNOW your engine has a problem that you KNOW the additive can fix...
and, IF you KNOW that you can't solve the problem by switching to a different oil...
then go ahead and give the additive a shot.
Otherwise, just pick the best oil and oil change regimen you can, and roll with that. All else equal, you will always be better off with a fully formulated lubricant with no third-party stuff added in.
Here's what the calculus should be:
IF you KNOW your engine has a problem that you KNOW the additive can fix...
and, IF you KNOW that you can't solve the problem by switching to a different oil...
then go ahead and give the additive a shot.
Otherwise, just pick the best oil and oil change regimen you can, and roll with that. All else equal, you will always be better off with a fully formulated lubricant with no third-party stuff added in.
Originally Posted By: BobsArmory
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
Engine Restorer is NOT simply "thick oil" I don't know the cSt but its not very thick compared to a lot of additives.
http://www.restore.fr/wa_files/s0400.pdf
http://s7d9.scene7.com/is/content/GenuinePartsCompany/1788627pdf?$PDF$
Severely Hydrotreated Heavy Naphthenic Distillate 064742-52-5 70-95
Refined Petroleum Blend 999999-88-8 5-15
Proprietary Additives 000000-00-8
The Proprietary blend is Copper silver and lead powder. I have used it in several old worn out engines and it has reduced oil consumption and increased gas mileage. I never did a compression test so I can't comment but you can find several favorable independent compression tests on message boards and some on youtube. The engines I used it on did feel slightly more powerful as one would expect.
http://www.restore.fr/wa_files/s0400.pdf
http://s7d9.scene7.com/is/content/GenuinePartsCompany/1788627pdf?$PDF$
Severely Hydrotreated Heavy Naphthenic Distillate 064742-52-5 70-95
Refined Petroleum Blend 999999-88-8 5-15
Proprietary Additives 000000-00-8
The Proprietary blend is Copper silver and lead powder. I have used it in several old worn out engines and it has reduced oil consumption and increased gas mileage. I never did a compression test so I can't comment but you can find several favorable independent compression tests on message boards and some on youtube. The engines I used it on did feel slightly more powerful as one would expect.
MolaKule
Staff member
Cera Tec by LiquiMoly is Boron Nitride in an oil carrier.
Boron type components are already included in most motor oils.
LiquiMoly Oil Additive by LiquiMoly is a suspension of SOLID MoS2 powders in an oil carrier.
Better moly chemistries are already included in most motor oil PI additive packages.
RESTORE Engine Restorer,
Quote:
RESTORE repairs worn out areas in the cylinder walls to improve the seal between piston rings and cylinder walls.
This stuff contains small particles of copper, silver, and lead.
NOW, do you really want any of this stuff in your motor oil, a motor oil that has had thousands of dollars of Research and Development behind it to yield a "balanced" lubricant verses some company that does not?
Boron type components are already included in most motor oils.
LiquiMoly Oil Additive by LiquiMoly is a suspension of SOLID MoS2 powders in an oil carrier.
Better moly chemistries are already included in most motor oil PI additive packages.
RESTORE Engine Restorer,
Quote:
RESTORE repairs worn out areas in the cylinder walls to improve the seal between piston rings and cylinder walls.
This stuff contains small particles of copper, silver, and lead.
NOW, do you really want any of this stuff in your motor oil, a motor oil that has had thousands of dollars of Research and Development behind it to yield a "balanced" lubricant verses some company that does not?
Last edited:
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: 3800Series
Originally Posted By: BobsArmory
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
I don't get the connection.
What does this swipe from some unidentfied document about EP additives in gear oils have to do with Engine Restorer and Cera Tec?
Originally Posted By: BobsArmory
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
I don't get the connection.
What does this swipe from some unidentfied document about EP additives in gear oils have to do with Engine Restorer and Cera Tec?
I know some VW community love cera tec and I know people who swear by the stuff so I was wonder which is better or are they pretty much do the same thing
I use mobile 1 EX 0w-20 with 30,000 on the clock
And just want my insight to last a long time
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to feria fair assessment
Thank you
I use mobile 1 EX 0w-20 with 30,000 on the clock
And just want my insight to last a long time
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to feria fair assessment
Thank you
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: minis
I know some VW community love cera tec and I know people who swear by the stuff so I was wonder which is better or are they pretty much do the same thing
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to feria fair assessment
Thank you
Engine Restorer as stated, is primarily for engines with bore polishing or engines with worn rings, I.E., engines that need a serious rebuild. One might extend the time to rebuild with this stuff but it is not a permanent fix.
Cera Tec as stated is a Boron Nitride friction reducer and anti-wear OTC additive that is already included in the vast majority of engine oils.
Assessment: What would a fair assessment include?
I would think that proof of efficacy would be part of a fair assessment.
I know some VW community love cera tec and I know people who swear by the stuff so I was wonder which is better or are they pretty much do the same thing
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to feria fair assessment
Thank you
Engine Restorer as stated, is primarily for engines with bore polishing or engines with worn rings, I.E., engines that need a serious rebuild. One might extend the time to rebuild with this stuff but it is not a permanent fix.
Cera Tec as stated is a Boron Nitride friction reducer and anti-wear OTC additive that is already included in the vast majority of engine oils.
Assessment: What would a fair assessment include?
I would think that proof of efficacy would be part of a fair assessment.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Originally Posted By: 3800Series
Originally Posted By: BobsArmory
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
I don't get the connection.
What does this swipe from some unidentfied document about EP additives in gear oils have to do with Engine Restorer and Cera Tec?
Its the wiki. A little research on extreme pressure gear oils and liquid moly will show anyone that the main additives in liquid moly is the main additives in gear oil.
Virtually they are the same thing.
Originally Posted By: 3800Series
Originally Posted By: BobsArmory
I have no real Idea what is in Restore but I am sure Ceratec isn't gear oil.
Liqui Moly (the makers of Ceratec) is a respectable German oil company that actually make products that work.
Cera Tec
Cera Tec is a high-tech ceramic wear protection and can be mixed with all commercially available oils. Cera Tec reduces friction and wear by using chemically and thermally extremely high-resilient ceramic compounds. Prevents direct metal/metal contact, increasing the service life of the aggregate. The smooth-running effect reduces fuel consumption in petrol and diesel engines.
EP gear oils perform well over a range of temperatures, speeds and gear sizes to help prevent damage to the gears during starting and stopping of the engine. Unlike AW additives, EP additives are rarely used in motor oils. The sulfur or chlorine compounds contained in them can react with water and combustion byproducts, forming acids that facilitate corrosion of the engine parts and bearings.[1]
EP additives typically contain organic sulfur, phosphorus or chlorine compounds, including sulfur-phosphorus and sulfur-phosphorus-boron compounds, which chemically react with the metal surface under high pressure conditions. Under such conditions, small irregularities on the sliding surfaces cause localized flashes of high temperature (300-1000 °C), without significant increase of the average surface temperature. The chemical reaction between the additives and the surface is confined to this area.
Molybdenum compounds decompose under high pressure to form an in-situ deposited layer of molybdenum disulfide. Molybdenum dithiocarbamates are used as additives for greases.
I don't get the connection.
What does this swipe from some unidentfied document about EP additives in gear oils have to do with Engine Restorer and Cera Tec?
Its the wiki. A little research on extreme pressure gear oils and liquid moly will show anyone that the main additives in liquid moly is the main additives in gear oil.
Virtually they are the same thing.
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
To be clear, not all additives will produce ash and/or sludge. Don't think anyone has implied that but I thought it'd be good to be sure.
Here's what the calculus should be:
IF you KNOW your engine has a problem that you KNOW the additive can fix...
and, IF you KNOW that you can't solve the problem by switching to a different oil...
then go ahead and give the additive a shot.
Otherwise, just pick the best oil and oil change regimen you can, and roll with that. All else equal, you will always be better off with a fully formulated lubricant with no third-party stuff added in.
This.
To be clear, not all additives will produce ash and/or sludge. Don't think anyone has implied that but I thought it'd be good to be sure.
Here's what the calculus should be:
IF you KNOW your engine has a problem that you KNOW the additive can fix...
and, IF you KNOW that you can't solve the problem by switching to a different oil...
then go ahead and give the additive a shot.
Otherwise, just pick the best oil and oil change regimen you can, and roll with that. All else equal, you will always be better off with a fully formulated lubricant with no third-party stuff added in.
This.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Cera Tec by LiquiMoly is Boron Nitride in an oil carrier.
Boron type components are already included in most motor oils.
LiquiMoly Oil Additive by LiquiMoly is a suspension of SOLID MoS2 powders in an oil carrier.
Better moly chemistries are already included in most motor oil PI additive packages.
RESTORE Engine Restorer,
Quote:
RESTORE repairs worn out areas in the cylinder walls to improve the seal between piston rings and cylinder walls.
This stuff contains small particles of copper, silver, and lead.
NOW, do you really want any of this stuff in your motor oil, a motor oil that has had thousands of dollars of Research and Development behind it to yield a "balanced" lubricant verses some company that does not?
And this.
Cera Tec by LiquiMoly is Boron Nitride in an oil carrier.
Boron type components are already included in most motor oils.
LiquiMoly Oil Additive by LiquiMoly is a suspension of SOLID MoS2 powders in an oil carrier.
Better moly chemistries are already included in most motor oil PI additive packages.
RESTORE Engine Restorer,
Quote:
RESTORE repairs worn out areas in the cylinder walls to improve the seal between piston rings and cylinder walls.
This stuff contains small particles of copper, silver, and lead.
NOW, do you really want any of this stuff in your motor oil, a motor oil that has had thousands of dollars of Research and Development behind it to yield a "balanced" lubricant verses some company that does not?
And this.
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: 3800Series
...Its the wiki. A little research on extreme pressure gear oils and liquid moly will show anyone that the main additives in liquid moly is the main additives in gear oil.
Virtually they are the same thing...
The solids suspended in LiquiMoly Engine Additive is not the main additive in gear oils. Gear oils may contain two or more EP additives, normally designated as primary, secondary, and tertiary EP additives.
...Its the wiki. A little research on extreme pressure gear oils and liquid moly will show anyone that the main additives in liquid moly is the main additives in gear oil.
Virtually they are the same thing...
The solids suspended in LiquiMoly Engine Additive is not the main additive in gear oils. Gear oils may contain two or more EP additives, normally designated as primary, secondary, and tertiary EP additives.
Last edited:
I know some VW community love cera tec and I know people who swear by the stuff so I was wonder which is better or are they pretty much do the same thing
I use mobile 1 EX 0w-20 with 30,000 on the clock
And just want my insight to last a long time
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to get a fair assessment
Thank you
I use mobile 1 EX 0w-20 with 30,000 on the clock
And just want my insight to last a long time
I would like to hear from people who actually used the products to get a fair assessment
Thank you
If you like multi color oil drains, use the Restore. If you want your car to last a long time, maintain it. Regular oil changes with proper oil is part of that.
Using something just because other people love it is not part of that. But if that's what you want to do, feel free.
Fair assessments do not come from end users.
Using something just because other people love it is not part of that. But if that's what you want to do, feel free.
Fair assessments do not come from end users.
Yep I maintain my cars well
If you never use a product you cannot give a fair review of the product.
There are a few people at the local vw club that use cera tec in there new beetle and only good thing to say
While people who never used it only had bad things to say.
go figure
If you never use a product you cannot give a fair review of the product.
There are a few people at the local vw club that use cera tec in there new beetle and only good thing to say
While people who never used it only had bad things to say.
go figure
Have you ever heard of the placebo effect?
Restore might help a high mileage beater that needs a rebuild costing more than vehicles value.
Restore might help a high mileage beater that needs a rebuild costing more than vehicles value.
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