War in Ukraine

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Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
I've seen dumber things for sure. How about war in Iraq for starters?

So, what do you propose instead, should USA pay Puting for each ukranian killed?

Just like we are doing something similar in middle east?


Iraq was all about protecting the petrodollar. Saddam wanted to sell his oil for Euros. I propose the U.S. leave Russia alone and let them invade Ukraine if they want to. Ukraine is not a vital interest and never was.
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Yes, it is..... it will only increase the resolve of Putin, and although folks here don't like to admit it (and never will) the people of Russia support their leader.

You see unlike the polyglot we have in the USA today,(our
country is NO LONGER a true nation), Russia IS a nation and they are united, they also realize that the west is almost totally within the grips of certain special interest groups that have monopolized the hold on power in western countries and their organizations (like the EW, NATO, and things like the CFR, IMF, and others).

I actually am pleased that the west is placing those sanctions as it will push Russia to act and move into the eastern half of the Ukraine. If it puts those "special interests" in the west reeling on their heels so much the better.


You're preaching to the choir.
56.gif
 
Probably this and putting a lightning rod in the middle east.

After all, park thousands of Americans in Iraq and the terrorist will think, no need to sneak into the US, we'll hit them on our front lawn.

I doubt there is any ONE reason, but a whole host of reasons we went to Iraq.

Some may have sounded good at the time. Others probably can't be spoken of, or the effect is lost.

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
I've seen dumber things for sure. How about war in Iraq for starters?

So, what do you propose instead, should USA pay Puting for each ukranian killed?

Just like we are doing something similar in middle east?


Iraq was all about protecting the petrodollar. Saddam wanted to sell his oil for Euros. I propose the U.S. leave Russia alone and let them invade Ukraine if they want to. Ukraine is not a vital interest and never was.
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I'll let our intelligent members research those nations I mentioned on their own, they will find that what you have posted with regards to them is clearly NOT accurate.

I agree that most other peoples in the world don't "hate"
the ordinary US citizen, and they shouldn't. What those folks do hate is the "interests" that control my goverment, and they are NOT interests that are conducting the business of government in OUR best interests (US Citizens = We The People) as referred to in the
US Constitution. On the contrary they are doing he bidding of
special interests that are detrimental to
We The People Of The United States Of America.


Your statements in the past have proven you do not have interest you do not believe in We The People.

Also the cult of the capitalist Alex Jones does not equal "intelligent members".

I still await to your response why your last fictitious youtube videos even the Russian government which is desperate for support has not even mentioned either video. Or are you unable to hear logical arguments from up there?
 
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
I've seen dumber things for sure. How about war in Iraq for starters?

So, what do you propose instead, should USA pay Puting for each ukranian killed?

Just like we are doing something similar in middle east?


Iraq was all about protecting the petrodollar. Saddam wanted to sell his oil for Euros. I propose the U.S. leave Russia alone and let them invade Ukraine if they want to. Ukraine is not a vital interest and never was.


Learn your history. Czechoslovakia was not that important when Hitler invaded it either.
The easier you make for putin to invade neighboring counties, the bigger appetite he will have.
You either have small (economic) war now, or big (military) war later.
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: dave1251
http://nypost.com/2014/07/31/soldiers-selfies-might-prove-russias-role-in-ukraine/

Russian soldier post selfie from Ukraine on Instagram.

Will Russia maintain there is no Russian involvement in Ukraine?


Sure! Later the solders said that their accounts were "hacked."


Then Russia should explain why the same individual that was photographed in Georgia in 2008 is photographed in Ukraine is wearing GRU Spetsnaz insignia.

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/ukraine-crisis/ukrainian-evidence-russian-involvement-east-n86076

Not to mention Russia has already confirmed deploying Spetsnaz to Crimea in March 2014.
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Learn your history. Czechoslovakia was not that important when Hitler invaded it either.
The easier you make for putin to invade neighboring counties, the bigger appetite he will have.
You either have small (economic) war now, or big (military) war later.


The economic sanctions is the last diplomatic tool in the toolbox. Putin has painted himself into an corner. Putin rallied Pro-Russian nationalism into a fever in Russia for over a decade and has promised to restore Russia's pride and Russia's standing as an Superpower again. For 15 years the Russian people have been told to trust Putin and he will restore their standing in the world. Russia invaded Georgia unopposed by the west despite Georgia being a NATO member. Russia was able to invade Crimea with little opposition. Thus sending Putin the message the west is weak and he can do what he pleases. This has ramped Russian citizen nationalism even more. Since March Russian propaganda has being telling the Russian people the annexation of Ukraine is imminent.

The only miscalculation of the situation Putin made is that "ethnic" Russians in eastern Ukraine may not like the government in Kiev, the "ethnic" Russians did not and do not want closer ties to Moscow and rather have closer ties to the E.U.. The Donetsk rebels commander, Igor Girkin, and their political leader, Alexander Borodai, are both from Moscow and citizens in Donetsk are openly calling for both men to return to Moscow. This reportedly has not made Putin happy at all. So Ukraine and eastern Ukraine in particular have been a torn in Putin's side.

If Putin does not deliver Ukraine the hardliners in Russia are likely to remove him from power. After 15 years of rule and slowly restructuring Russia's Constitution to gain powers and limit the powers of the other branches of the Russian government as the "President" of Russia Putin is not the kind of man that is willing to give up on gaining more power. Thus the ball is in Putin's court will he step away or will he with escalate his war further. Will the west take the Neville Chamberlain appeasement approach such as offer to lift sanctions if Putin takes Ukraine and "promises" not to take more?
 
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I'll let our intelligent members research those nations I mentioned on their own, they will find that what you have posted with regards to them is clearly NOT accurate.

...


You're points are basically silly and are echoic of the WWII Imperial Japanese arguments that it was alright for them to both (literally and figuratively) rape China because the U.S. committed genocide against the Indians a century before. What does that have anything to do with the price of tea (or blood) in China?
 
http://russkayavesna.ru/news/analytics/lia-akhedzhakova-stupidity-and-betrayal/

http://news2night.com/en/news/rossijskie-dejateli-kultury-podpisali-antivoennoe-pismo

This is an example of the position of the hardliners in Russia notice how the author tears this Ukrainian/Soviet actress to pieces because she condemns the annexation of Crimea and warns Russia is plunging itself back into a new cold war with the west.

Also on russkayavesna.ru there is an editor piece explaining why ethnic Russians in eastern Ukraine do not want to join the Russian Federation is due to the "fascist" west has polluted their minds with capitalism and religion.
 
Originally Posted By: Nickdfresh
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I'll let our intelligent members research those nations I mentioned on their own, they will find that what you have posted with regards to them is clearly NOT accurate.

...


You're points are basically silly and are echoic of the WWII Imperial Japanese arguments that it was alright for them to both (literally and figuratively) rape China because the U.S. committed genocide against the Indians a century before. What does that have anything to do with the price of tea (or blood) in China?


To say nothing of the following.

The Obersalzberg speech, 8/22/39

Our strength consists in our speed and in our brutality. Genghis Khan led millions of women and children to slaughter – with premeditation and a happy heart. History sees in him solely the founder of a state. It’s a matter of indifference to me what a weak western European civilization will say about me. I have issued the command – and I’ll have anybody who utters but one word of criticism executed by a firing squad – that our war aim does not consist in reaching certain lines, but in the physical destruction of the enemy. Accordingly, I have placed my death-head formation in readiness – for the present only in the East – with orders to them to send to death mercilessly and without compassion, men, women, and children of Polish derivation and language. Only thus shall we gain the living space (Lebensraum) which we need. Who, after all, speaks to-day of the annihilation of the Armenians
 
I smell "desperation".

Just saw Barry Soetoro on TV speaking about the Ukraine and how terrible Russia is for protecting it's sphere of influence, but noticed that he didn't speak of how the US illegally and deliberately attacked a sovereign nation without cause, Iraq, and literally destroyed a ancient nation throwing it into despair and chaos for decades to come. Hypocrite.

Regarding why I mention that my country is no longer a "nation" and only a ployglot is because our own Founding Fathers spoke of
their "posterity" in the Preamble to the US Constitution.
Dave1251 you need to do some studying and look up what the
Founding Fathers intended when they spoke of "their posterity"
and it doesn't include those from any other tribe other than their own tribe. That fact is something that never becomes obsolete.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
I smell "desperation".

Just saw Barry Soetoro on TV speaking about the Ukraine and how terrible Russia is for protecting it's sphere of influence, but noticed that he didn't speak of how the US illegally and deliberately attacked a sovereign nation without cause, Iraq, and literally destroyed a ancient nation throwing it into despair and chaos for decades to come. Hypocrite.


I implore you to make this statement to the Iraqi men that lost their fathers under Saddam's dictatorship taken by members of the Ba'ath party and never seen alive again or simply never seen again. I recommend you are wearing your running shoes when you tell them this.

Also what does Iraq have to do with Ukraine. Are you a citizen of Iraq?
 
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