The ineffectiveness of MS Security Essentials

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OverK1ll, I agree with you in principle, MSSE is only mediocre at best. What few programs do is keep you from installing the spyware...if one says "yes" to installing something, side-ware/malware is often along for the ride from popular sites like CNET or download.com. Since the behavior was "Yes, I wan't this software", it's on there.

The better programs disallow it from running...beyond the human behavior. I've found Vipre to be crucial by keeping any of these processes from running, thus keeping the PC clean and avoiding the headache you're currently experiencing.

Not one of the nasties ever had the chance to infect the PC as Vipre caught them all from running, a safety-net approach if you will, and most times sweeps them off the PC after a sweep is invoked. After a sweep or two, sometimes using another freebie such as Eset/MWB/SAS/etc the PC has the garbage removed from the local disks.

Dunno how Vipre gets such low ratings, it's been a great Swiss Army Knife over the years, especially the uplevel Internet Security version, which adds more features and the slick Auto Patching mechanism to auto update all other non-MS software on the computer. Great for keeping Flash, Java, Firefox, Seamonkey, etc up to date.
 
Originally Posted By: TTK
You ran the quick scan with MSE and a full scan with ESET.(?) That is the way it appears to me, in which case the comparison is really not valid. The Quick scan with MSE will not pick many things that the Full Scan with MSE will show. MSE works fine for me, but I know to run the full scan.


Yes, I noted in the OP that I only ran the quick scan. A full scan had been run by the owner last week and it found nothing, I updated the definitions and just ran a quick scan to see if it would find anything before uninstalling the product just for kicks as it was obvious it likely wouldn't, given that it had allowed all that junk on the computer in the first place.

This is why it was amusing to see ESET seconds after install picking up all the malicious running processes that MSE was oblivious to, to the order of about 30 of them, as also noted in the OP. I hadn't even run a scan yet with ESET and it was already picking up all the junk MSE didn't. The scan results just added insult to injury there.
 
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: TTK
You ran the quick scan with MSE and a full scan with ESET.(?) That is the way it appears to me, in which case the comparison is really not valid. The Quick scan with MSE will not pick many things that the Full Scan with MSE will show. MSE works fine for me, but I know to run the full scan.


You weren't supposed to notice that....
wink.gif



Not so. I made it a point to mention that I only ran the quick scan. I didn't see a purpose in wasting an hour of my time on the product that had allowed that computer to get to the state it was in in the first place and had noted the owner had already done a full scan recently that yielded nothing.
 
Originally Posted By: ToyotaNSaturn
OverK1ll, I agree with you in principle, MSSE is only mediocre at best. What few programs do is keep you from installing the spyware...if one says "yes" to installing something, side-ware/malware is often along for the ride from popular sites like CNET or download.com. Since the behavior was "Yes, I wan't this software", it's on there.

The better programs disallow it from running...beyond the human behavior. I've found Vipre to be crucial by keeping any of these processes from running, thus keeping the PC clean and avoiding the headache you're currently experiencing.

Not one of the nasties ever had the chance to infect the PC as Vipre caught them all from running, a safety-net approach if you will, and most times sweeps them off the PC after a sweep is invoked. After a sweep or two, sometimes using another freebie such as Eset/MWB/SAS/etc the PC has the garbage removed from the local disks.

Dunno how Vipre gets such low ratings, it's been a great Swiss Army Knife over the years, especially the uplevel Internet Security version, which adds more features and the slick Auto Patching mechanism to auto update all other non-MS software on the computer. Great for keeping Flash, Java, Firefox, Seamonkey, etc up to date.


That's how the ESET program functions. It blocks download links that carry malicious payloads, blocks you from installing programs that carry additional payloads of adware....etc

It also warns you of windows, java, flash...etc aren't up to date.

It is a great product and very effective at preventing infections so that a computer doesn't get into the state this one is in. Obviously MSE is not.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL

It is a great product and very effective at preventing infections so that a computer doesn't get into the state this one is in. Obviously MSE is not.


I don't fault MS for offering an anti-malware for a protected out of the box experience, I fault them for making something so mediocre, it's not worth leaving on the machine.
 
How does ESET Endpoint compare with ESET NOD32 and ESET Smart Security? I have never run ESET Endpoint which is for business computers, right? Are the ESET consumer products as good?

Also, in Windows 8/8.1 Windows SmartScreen protects the entire computer instead of just IE. So a Windows 8/8.1 computer should be somewhat more secure. Is Windows Defender in Windows 8/8.1 any better than Microsoft Security Essentials?
 
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What is a good second program to make sure ESET stops and finds all malware? I assume ESET is not 100% effective and might miss some stuff. I use HitmanPro and Malwarebytes. And I sometimes run the ESET online scan. Are HitmanPro and Malwarebytes good backup insurance? I am talking of course about the free version of Malwarebytes because the paid program might interfere with the antivirus.

It is my understanding that HitmanPro currently uses Bitdefender and Kaspersky and one other program.

If Malwarebytes is useless I can get rid of it. But how about HitmanPro to back up ESET? Or would ESET Samrt Security and the ESET online scan be good enough?
 
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I usually do a periodic scan with MWB (free) just as a check-up/back-up. If I am dealing with an actual issue I will also run Hitman Pro.

That said, NOD32 is extremely effective by itself, but I will leverage other products as part of a clean-up effort to make sure I get it all, as they will all miss something and I find those three products complement each other well.
 
I use all three and I also do backup scans with the ESET online scan.

Malwarebytes scans fast nowadays and HitmanPro is pretty fast. I run both every day plus I run ESET at the end of the day and have it shut off the computer after the scan is done. I will occasionally run the ESET online scan. I run ESET with a complete scan under admin and I run HitmanPro as admin. And I sometimes run HitmanPro and Malwarebytes in Safe Mode. ESET can be run in Safe Mode also.

If I thought there was anything on the computer I would download the Kaspersky Rescue CD software, put it on a CD, and run Kaspersky in a Linux O/S off the CD.
 
Originally Posted By: Rand
But you only used half the best combo ever, If you ran 2 different protection programs... ie if you had PAID MWB it would be 0 infections

/sarcasm.

I too see this frequently. as mentioned MSE is almost worst than nothing because people think they do have protection.

Careful, I was called an idiot here for saying this.
 
What are some of you people doing that generates that level of infection?

I've had MSE on my system for a couple years now. Just for kicks, after seeing this post last night I ran an online scan with ESET. I guess it just takes a little common sense to keep a system free from malware and viruses.

I also have Malwarebytes installed on my system, and the few times I've run it I've never had any infections.



 
My experience was similar to Pop_Rivit. I ran MSE for over 2 years (along with MWB and occasional ESET online scans) and had none of the serious infections mentioned in this thread. Proof that safe computing habits trump almost everything else. Am now using free Avast on 2 desktops...seems to run okay.

GrtArtiste
 
There must be a lot of questionable and 'adult' sites being visited. I can't say Ive ever had a virus, even on my MS boxes.
 
The main problem is the computer operator. If somebody insists on going to questionable websites, viewing a lot of pornography online, and visiting sites where black hat hackers go, you are going to get infected. If somebody was careless enough and downloaded enough worthless junk they could probably get a computer infected even if they were using ESET or Kaspersky. You have to be careful about junk in email also.

We had a guy at work who was a nice guy but on his own personal computers away from work he was constantly going to pornography websites. His computers always were bricked up by malware sooner or later. And then he would buy a new computer.

I know a woman who managed to get her computer bricked up by malware also. I talked her into using the Kaspersky AV for her new computer. So far she has not had problems with her new computer.

A person has to have good passwords, use common sense on the internet, don't download stuff from the internet you know nothing about, don't visit strange, questionable websites, and keep all of your software updated.

If a person is careful enough on the internet they could probably get by with Microsoft Security Essentials (or Windows Defender for Windows 8/8.1), Malwarebytes, and occasional scans with the ESET online scanner. But no matter how careful a person is online I don't think it hurts at all to have a good antivirus. If a person owns only one computer you can get ESET NOD32 for one computer for about thirty bucks and you can get free antivirus programs like Bitdefender or Panda. Thirty bucks should not break the bank and free is free so what is the excuse for using inferior protection? At the Microsoft.com website where Microsoft lists antivirus software that is acceptable for Windows there is a free antivirus (Bitdefender) that is endorsed by Microsoft. It is free!

No matter how careful somebody may be on the internet it is possible to get malware even from legit major websites. You could go to some major website and click on an ad and get some sort of drive by download of malware. And some people insist on downloading every bit of trash there is in emails and online. Think twice before you open a attachment in an email and think twice and three times before downloading some silly registry cleaner or screensaver on the internet. Microsoft says that registry cleaners are useless (makes you wonder why even some antivirus companies still mess around with stuff like that) and you already have screensavers on your computer.
 
I've haven't used an AV for 2 years on my personal computer and yes it comes down to common sense when browsing on the internet, downloading from well known sources, not clicking any random pop-ups, etc. I ran the eset online scanner and showed up no infected files or stuff.

And I get slightly better performance in games.

And mid-2000's versions of Norton Antivirus are disgustingly horrible.
 
I've used MSE for a long time until recently. Also very carefull what I click on. I rely on AdBlock + and NoScript to increase the S/N ratio on pages I do visit. Based on your report OK, I decided to scan my own system...except it won't post here! I'll have to convert to .jpg.

It did find that Ask.com tried to install the stupid taskbar ap 10/12 of the 12 things it found. No viruses though.
 
Originally Posted By: 97tbird
Originally Posted By: ToyotaNSaturn
Bottom line: Don't click on stupid stuff.

or keep and old beater laptop to click on stupid stuff.
smile.gif



or sandboxed virtual machine.

I agree 100% with some people saying they have no problems.. I havent had anything but some PUP personally in over 5 years.

And that's detected before I even try to install it (the kind of PUP where you uncheck the box to not install it)

Although eset did save me from some adware some scuzwad injected into coretemp that I downloaded from a legit site for overclocking temp monitoring.

Basically MSE or nothing should be fine for computer smart people.

if you want real protection there are products that actually work out there

One of my coworkers on the other hand.. had 300 infections .. fixed it.. did a backup of it to ext. hdd.. and 2 days later he managed to re-crud up his computer with MWB pro AND avira running on it.

Switched him to ESET.. and so far no issues..

also made some suggestions about his web browsing habits and safer websites
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