One coolant for EVERYTHING

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msmoke00

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This weekend I got back to the family farm and my father was bragging how their new oil supplier got them bulk coolant to use in everything as they had been going to Walmart and buying coolant before. I go to look at the barrels and the coolant clearly has G05 on the side. They run all sorts of different equipment, however they rarely flush coolant. Usually it is top offs and when a radiator or water pump is changed is the most new the equipment will see.

The equipment in question ranges from a couple CAT wheel loaders, a Doosan wheel loader, Case IH tractors (from an old H and 656 to newer MX230), multiple Chevy and Ford trucks, International semi trucks, stationary engines, etc. The CAT's run a yellow coolant, the tractors are/were all green coolant new, and the Chevy and Ford trucks vary on age.

It makes me hesitant to recommend them a universal (no phos, silicate, and nitrate) coolant, where the old diesels all run green. I know the jack of all trade, master of none coolants will probably be fine but want reassurance before I have them flush all the systems they put G05 into already.
 
If there were such a thing as a universal coolant (there's not), G-05 might be it. Its got no 2-EHA, it has silicates, it has nitrites (for cavitation protection in wet-liner diesels). It carries OEM recommendations for all-aluminum engines, for iron/aluminum engines, and for some diesels.

Some will worry about silicates in cars OEM spec'd for silicate-free coolants, and while there is a legitimate concern for shortening water pump seal life if you leave it in a really long time. But IMO that takes a REALLY long time. We weren't changing water pumps all the time with IAT green coolants in the 80s and 90s, after all, and people would sometimes run those coolants WAY beyond the 2 year recommendation.

I'm definitely not a believer in a "one for everything" coolant, but I do find it interesting that G-05 is such a much better choice than the coolants that actually ARE marketed as "one for everything," most of which are 2-EHA based and silicate/nitrite free which makes them a bad choice for diesels and mixed-metallurgy engines.
 
The need for flushing and issues mixing old and new is my concern if we do stay G05. Getting them to do a full flush (never in their years have they done a full flush), is my big concern with any combating chemistry with the G05 and other coolants in place.
 
Originally Posted By: msmoke00
The need for flushing and issues mixing old and new is my concern if we do stay G05. Getting them to do a full flush (never in their years have they done a full flush), is my big concern with any combating chemistry with the G05 and other coolants in place.


Even then, I'd say its a better choice for every piece of equipment you listed than an "all makes/models" type such as Prestone. With those older diesels, you NEED nitrites and probably silicates too, so Prestone "all makes," Peak Global Lifetime, etc. are not even in the running. G-05 is certainly no worse than conventional "green" in terms of how it breaks down if neglected. In fact its probably quite a lot better since the OEMs recommend 50k/5years and never recommended more than 2 years for older conventionals.

It would certainly be best if they did a complete drain and fill the first time around with G-05, but I don't think it would be a disaster if they didn't. I'd be a lot more worried about putting a DexClone in the older diesels.
 
I think G-05 is a good choice for coolant especially where wet liner diesels are involved. JD CG II might be slightly better and more $$.

However if I did have GM vehicles that came with Dexcool from the factory and still had in Dexcool, I would continue to use Dexcool.
 
G-05 is one of the failure points on the 6.0L diesel in Fords. The silicates fall out in the oil cooler and clog up the passages in that and the EGR cooler. Adding a coolant filter should be mod 1 on any of those vehicles, and ideally getting every last bit of G-05 out of the system and replaced with EC-1 coolant.
 
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
G-05 is one of the failure points on the 6.0L diesel in Fords. The silicates fall out in the oil cooler and clog up the passages in that and the EGR cooler. Adding a coolant filter should be mod 1 on any of those vehicles, and ideally getting every last bit of G-05 out of the system and replaced with EC-1 coolant.


G-05 doesn't thrill me as coolant for everything for this reason. Every Ford Ive seen factory filled with G-05 has alarming amounts of silicate drop out.

I agree that Final Charge would be a good solution for a one coolant fits all. Its an OAT, diesel rated and doesn't contain 2EHA.
 
Originally Posted By: CDX825
G-05 doesn't thrill me as coolant for everything for this reason. Every Ford Ive seen factory filled with G-05 has alarming amounts of silicate drop out.


I have never seen silicate drop-out with G-05.

MB has used it and its cousin G-48 for decades and never had a problem with drop-out. In fact MB adds a gel pak to the overflow tank to "replenish" silicate.

If a system is flushed and filled with G-05 and distilled water in the proper proportions, it will provide better protection recovery than DexCool and its clones from a low coolant incident, provides close to the same life, and meets low abrasive requirements of modern vehicles.

It has been used with great success as a universal coolant in mixed fleets which include Asian automobiles and American and European diesels.

I would suggest, though, that flushing and full coolant replacement would be the preferred implementation.
 
It is well documented that G-05 is one of the causes of EGR and oil cooler failure on the 6.0 and 6.4L diesels. I have seen them personally where the silicate sludge is blocking all the passages in the coolers.
 
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
It is well documented that G-05 is one of the causes of EGR and oil cooler failure on the 6.0 and 6.4L diesels. I have seen them personally where the silicate sludge is blocking all the passages in the coolers.

Thanks.

I have taken the time to acquaint myself with these issues, which I was completely unaware of. Here are a few articles I found:

Engine Oil Cooler Issues

"EGR Cooler commonly fails due to overheating and boiling of the coolant inside it, rupturing it and causing coolant to leak into the exhaust manifold. This overheating in the cooler is sometimes caused by low coolant flow to the cooler, since coolant must pass first through the stock engine oil cooler before it is delivered to the EGR cooler. As the engine oil cooler begins to clog, the EGR cooler is starved for coolant. If the cooler leaks while the engine is not running, coolant can enter engine cylinders through open exhaust valves. Attempting to start the engine after coolant has entered a cylinder can lead to hydrolocking ...."

Power Stroke Cooler Failures

"Evidently sand particles from the casting of the 6.0L engine blocks can leach out of the metal and into the water jacket, according to the experts."

FORD 6.0L POWER STROKE PROBLEMS

"The Oil cooler is the cause of most the 6.0L’s problems. The Oil cooler cools the engine oil by heat transfer from / through the engine coolant, kind of like a small radiator. There are no warning signs for a clogged or restricted oil cooler but tests can be done to determine if a problem is there waiting to happen. The reason the Oil cooler gets restricted and clogs up is due to silicone sand in the coolant system. The sand is left over from the casting process of the engine block and because it was not thoroughly cleaned from the coolant passages before the engine was assembled and it gathers at the most restrictive point which is the Oil cooler."

Everything I read certainly supports the notion that a silicate sludge forms in many of these engines and blocks the coolant passages.

However, the indication is that the source of the silicate is the engine block itself as a result of Ford's design, casting procedures, and perhaps failure to perform proper cleaning of the coolant passages of the engine block casting of post-casting silica.

In addition the design overheats the motor oil by using it as a high-pressure hydraulic fluid in fuel injector operation, using it to cooling engine components such as pistons, and otherwise creating a high potential for localized overheating, something that would probably not be reflected on the temperature gauge until it was too late.

I cannot think of any process that would cause localized silicate dropout. It is hard to imagine that G-05 is the cause of the problems described.
 
One of the reasons GO-5 is linked to 6.0 failures is due to the use of performance tuners. When the power is turned up on a 6.0 it super-heated the coolant in the EGR cooler, which in turn caused the coolant to gel.

My vote for an all-around coolant is JD CoolGard II, I currently use it in approx. 20 different applications, including my 6.0, without issue.
 
Originally Posted By: roadrunner1
My vote for an all-around coolant is JD CoolGard II, I currently use it in approx. 20 different applications, including my 6.0, without issue.


John Deere is hardly forthcoming about the make-up of this coolant. Their website suggests that I call them for information.

Relying on non-John Deere secondary information Cool Guard II appears to be an Organic Acid extended life coolant.

Unlike G-05 and G-48 it lacks silicates, one of the reasons G-05 recovers from low coolant situations so rapidly.

Again relying on secondary source, it does seem to contain sodium tetraborate as a borate additive, which is intended to accomplish much the same thing as the silicate in G-05.

Unfortunately John Deere apparently considers the chemistry proprietary. I wonder who makes it for them?
 
Casting sand was part of the problem with the 6.0 powerstrokes but the silicate from coolant also played a big part in it.

Even in stock form the coolers were plugging. There is cutaway of a plugged oil cooler on the net and it shows the yellow goop from the coolant.

Ive seen it in both gas and diesel applications though with Fords.

Because of what Ive seen first hand with G-05, its not something I would recommend for heavy equipment and diesels.
 
Originally Posted By: CDX825
Casting sand was part of the problem with the 6.0 powerstrokes but the silicate from coolant also played a big part in it.


The silicate in G-05 is in the 200-250 ppm, that's parts per MILLION, range.

That's not enough to create the problem described. G-05 is not the old green coolant with massive amounts of silicate.

G-05 is not intended for over-the-road or heavy equipment diesels.

BMW and Mercedes-Benz continue to use a HOAT, currently G-05's successor G-48 which removed the nitrite to meet European clean water requirements.
 
I learned this years ago about the fallout with go5 few people on here disputed that..also, it was discovered that go5 conflicts with the metals in the heater core.final charge is the wave of the future this type of antifreeze will be used as the one and only type of coolant instead of many diff colors etc.
 
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I use HOAT universally, as I just posted in another thread, including years in 80+ CAT engines, plus several car brands in their dealers. It is also in my 2003 Ford 6.0 with no problems. From the additive maker's spec sheet.

Quote:
hybrid organic acid technology (HOAT) additive/inhibitor package formulated with a proprietary stabilization system to improve the durability of its carboxylate salt base and extend its range of compatibility with both conventional inorganic salts and OAT-type antifreezes. Virgin antifreeze made with ....... provides a service life up to 150,000 miles or 3000 hours. ......... contains no phosphates, borates, nitrates, or silicates. This extended life add pak possesses multiple complex carboxylic acid derivatives along with nitrite to protect all six standard metal alloys (brass, copper, steel, solder, cast iron and aluminum) . These low foaming carboxylates and ....... other proprietary ingredients not only provide broad-range metal protection but also guard the cooling system against corrosion and cavitation-erosion. In addition it contains additives to minimize hot surface scaling while also preventing heat transfer surface fouling due to minor oil leakage.
 
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