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#3395818 - 06/12/14 03:39 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
901Memphis Offline


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 5498
Loc: Northern Kentucky
The AC Delco filter I took out of an ecotech looked just as Wavy but no hole. Replaced with Fram Ultra, hoping it holds up better. It seems typical for the ecotech to abuse the filter, with possible link to over torque on the housing causing the extra compression. Apparently torque wrenches are a good idea for these housings. I did not torque the new Ultra cartridge filter but tried mybbest not to strong arm it.
_________________________
1999 Ford Taurus 145k (Vulcan v6) - M1 High Mileage 5w30 | Fram Ultra XG 3600
2002 Buick Century 102k - PU 5w30 / Fram Ultra XG 3980 / Filter mag

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#3395848 - 06/12/14 04:22 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: 901Memphis]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 7132
Loc: PNW
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
The AC Delco filter I took out of an ecotech looked just as Wavy but no hole. Replaced with Fram Ultra, hoping it holds up better. It seems typical for the ecotech to abuse the filter, with possible link to over torque on the housing causing the extra compression. Apparently torque wrenches are a good idea for these housings. I did not torque the new Ultra cartridge filter but tried mybbest not to strong arm it.


I don't think over torquing the filter housing cap is going to crush the filter, as once that cap seats on the engine, adding additional torque really isn't going to make it turn much more at all.

If the cartridge oil filter is getting crushed vertically when installed, then the filter was designed to be too long for the application IMO.

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#3395867 - 06/12/14 04:39 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
HTSS_TR Offline


Registered: 04/17/06
Posts: 12901
Loc: Irvine, CA
Agreed. Cartridge filter in my E430 never had any wavy pleats after in used for up to 12-13k miles, last one was 23k miles(changed oil without changing filter) and looks perfect without any tear nor any debris I can see between pleats.
_________________________
'94 LS400
'00 E430
'04 S2000
"Consumerism has accustomed us to waste. But throwing food away is like stealing it from the poor and hungry" Pop Francis

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#3395871 - 06/12/14 04:43 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
sayjac Offline


Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 8098
Loc: The Old North State
I'll stand by what I posted previously in this thread. Many ecotec cartridges posted here exhibit a compressed and/or twisted appearance upon removal. The twisting compression could well be responsible for the eventual weaken of the media in the pleats, and a breach. Something is going on beyond this specific failure. If one looks a the OEM ecotech filter posted in my first link and first below that was run only 1100 miles and it had the beginnings of the common squished appearance. Imagine what it might have looked like after 4k miles. And this is NOT a Mann but OEM according ot the OP of that thread. Whatever the cause it's happened to many filter of this application, not just Mann.

The second one is also in the linked Sky forum showing a before and after.




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#3395903 - 06/12/14 05:20 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
ZeeOSix Offline


Registered: 07/22/10
Posts: 7132
Loc: PNW
^^^ So on that 2nd photo, I'm wondering if anyone accurately measured between the end caps on the new vs. used filter of the same model to see if there was some "crushing" going on. Or are the pleats just getting wavy from typical use.

If the cartridge is being crushed vertically, you should be able to see that by measuring between the edges of the two end caps and see the distance is less than on a new filter of the same brand/model.

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#3395919 - 06/12/14 05:46 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: HTSS_TR]
901Memphis Offline


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 5498
Loc: Northern Kentucky
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Agreed. Cartridge filter in my E430 never had any wavy pleats after in used for up to 12-13k miles, last one was 23k miles(changed oil without changing filter) and looks perfect without any tear nor any debris I can see between pleats.



The housing on your e430 is clearly a superior design. I think this is an ecotech problem not a cartridge problem.
_________________________
1999 Ford Taurus 145k (Vulcan v6) - M1 High Mileage 5w30 | Fram Ultra XG 3600
2002 Buick Century 102k - PU 5w30 / Fram Ultra XG 3980 / Filter mag

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#3395932 - 06/12/14 06:01 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: 901Memphis]
typ901 Offline


Registered: 07/13/08
Posts: 706
Loc: N. 'Burbs of Chicago, IL
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Agreed. Cartridge filter in my E430 never had any wavy pleats after in used for up to 12-13k miles, last one was 23k miles(changed oil without changing filter) and looks perfect without any tear nor any debris I can see between pleats.



The housing on your e430 is clearly a superior design. I think this is an ecotech problem not a cartridge problem.


Actually the filter is- I assume HTSS_TR is talking about MANN model HU7185x which has a very robust design when compared to most other cartridges.

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#3396203 - 06/13/14 02:26 AM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
HTSS_TR Offline


Registered: 04/17/06
Posts: 12901
Loc: Irvine, CA
I think the filter housing is not responsible for the crushed cartridge filter(s), the problem is the filter is too long for the housing.

The 23k miles cartridge filter was standard paper Hengst, not the fleece MANN HU7185X. I had MANN, Mahle, Bosch, Hengst ... in the E430, all of them are very good after more than 10k miles, no wavy whatsoever.

Until the previous oil change I always change filter at every oil change, and looking at the filter condition I had a thought about reuse it for one more OCI, but I didn't like that idea. Until last year I decided to try it and removed the holder to check the filter condition every 2-3 months. It was looking good every time so I left it in for the full second OCI.

I may still have it in the garage, I will take a picture someday.
_________________________
'94 LS400
'00 E430
'04 S2000
"Consumerism has accustomed us to waste. But throwing food away is like stealing it from the poor and hungry" Pop Francis

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#3396217 - 06/13/14 04:52 AM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
dnewton3 Offline



Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 5590
Loc: Indianapolis, IN
Is there any possibility that the filters are counterfeit, and not up to real Mann standards?

I'd contact Rock Auto for any traceability of the product they may have. I'd contact Mann and ask for ways to ID real versus imposter products.

Start with the basics first; assure what you have is really what you believe it to be. No company is going to cover this until the authenticity can be established first. Then the finger pointing can begin thereafter.


Originally Posted By: schwarz633
I'd like to direct this to Mann, but it's impossible to find any technical/customer support contact information on the web site.

I'm going to say it's not "impossible to find"; you must not have looked very hard; it's on the bottom of nearly every webpage ...
here is the Mann contact page:
https://www.mann-hummel.com/en/mann-filter/footer-menu/contact/usa/


Just in case you need it, the Rock Auto contact is there, too:
email them at: service@rockauto.com



Edited by dnewton3 (06/13/14 05:05 AM)
_________________________
Conventionals vs. Synthetics isn't about which is "better"; it's about which lasts longer, while assuring safe operation, in relation to cost. Any product can be over or under utilized. The same applies to filters.
Make an informed decision; first consider your operating conditions, next determine your maintenance plan, and then pick your lube and filter. Don't do it the other way around ...

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#3399806 - 06/17/14 01:35 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: dnewton3]
schwarz633 Offline


Registered: 06/11/14
Posts: 3
Loc: SE Wisconsin
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Is there any possibility that the filters are counterfeit, and not up to real Mann standards?

I'd contact Rock Auto for any traceability of the product they may have. I'd contact Mann and ask for ways to ID real versus imposter products.

Start with the basics first; assure what you have is really what you believe it to be. No company is going to cover this until the authenticity can be established first. Then the finger pointing can begin thereafter.


Originally Posted By: schwarz633
I'd like to direct this to Mann, but it's impossible to find any technical/customer support contact information on the web site.

I'm going to say it's not "impossible to find"; you must not have looked very hard; it's on the bottom of nearly every webpage ...
here is the Mann contact page:
https://www.mann-hummel.com/en/mann-filter/footer-menu/contact/usa/


Just in case you need it, the Rock Auto contact is there, too:
email them at: service@rockauto.com


Emails sent to the address on that web page bounce.
Phone calls always go to voicemail and are not returned.
Rock Auto hasn't really been of any help.

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#3400228 - 06/17/14 11:39 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
The ods of an oil filter creating oil comsumption is almost inexistant.wrong oil tho can.
_________________________
Truck driver
Nissan versa note s 2014
Mechanicly inclined

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#3400432 - 06/18/14 09:24 AM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: yvon_la]
Dallas69 Offline


Registered: 02/11/14
Posts: 237
Loc: Texas
It looks to me like someone poked a hole in it,not a tear
Did you see this being removed?

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#3401014 - 06/18/14 09:46 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: Dallas69]
FetchFar Offline


Registered: 10/17/13
Posts: 831
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Dallas69
It looks to me like someone poked a hole in it,not a tear
Did you see this being removed?
Yes, that hole looks suspicious....(things not to say on a first date, BTW.).... Seriously it looks like sabotage, but why? Usually a dealer gets reimbursed for repairs and has no motive for that.
_________________________
'07 BMW 530xi N52 engine, E60 chassis, 255 hp
'11 Chevy Camaro LS, 3.6L V6, Zeta chassis, 312 hp
'40 Chevrolet Special Deluxe 2-Door Town Sedan

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#3401017 - 06/18/14 09:47 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: schwarz633]
FetchFar Offline


Registered: 10/17/13
Posts: 831
Loc: Colorado
A little waviness is always OK, tears/holes not OK.
_________________________
'07 BMW 530xi N52 engine, E60 chassis, 255 hp
'11 Chevy Camaro LS, 3.6L V6, Zeta chassis, 312 hp
'40 Chevrolet Special Deluxe 2-Door Town Sedan

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#3401018 - 06/18/14 09:49 PM Re: Mann ML-1015 (Equinox 2.4 I4 DI) problem [Re: Mike_dup1]
FetchFar Offline


Registered: 10/17/13
Posts: 831
Loc: Colorado
Originally Posted By: Mike_dup1
Here is an AC Delco from my CTS, same hour glass shape. While not the same filter model, distorting seems to be the norm. Every filter I have changed in the 3.6 comes out looking like this.
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb222/Z15_34396/New%20Auto%20Related/MVC-005X.jpg
Same here, my GM 3.6L V6, 11 Camaro, uses that TG8765 cartridge, and they might be wavy a little, no problem.
_________________________
'07 BMW 530xi N52 engine, E60 chassis, 255 hp
'11 Chevy Camaro LS, 3.6L V6, Zeta chassis, 312 hp
'40 Chevrolet Special Deluxe 2-Door Town Sedan

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