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#3400478 - 06/18/14 10:40 AM Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc
weebl Offline


Registered: 01/15/06
Posts: 538
Loc: Canada
A couple of days ago, a killed my 10 year old B&S by accidentally running over a stump. At first, I thought the only damage was a bent blade. I restarted it, it ran for a minute or so, before it stalled and it won't start again. I know I probably shouldn't have tried to restart it, but it's done.

I may be able to get my hands on the same engine, though used, at what looks like quite a good price. Problem is, this version of the engine is on a pressure washer (the pump of the washer is damaged, and I really have no interest in the pressure washer side of it anyway).

I understand different implementations of these engines means they may be equipped differently. What sort of issues, if any, would I see transplanting this engine onto my mower?

Hoping for as close to plug and play as possible, or at the worst, some easily obtainable and easily changeable parts to make it work.
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#3400488 - 06/18/14 10:51 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
Hokiefyd Offline


Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 11720
Loc: North Carolina
The biggest difference will be your blade driver/adapter. Different versions of the engines had different types of crankshafts to fit the OEM application, so the crankshaft snout diameter and shape (threaded, keyed, etc) is likely different. Additionally, if your mower is self-propelled, you'd have to make sure that the pulley will fit. A pressure washer engine will have a heavy steel flywheel instead of the light aluminum flywheel that the mower engine has...but this will be of no real consequence to you. It would be if you were going the other way, trying to put a mower engine on a pressure washer.

Honestly, the best bet, if this engine doesn't work out, is to find any mower engine complete with blade adapter and use that. It really doesn't matter the brand of engine. Mower engine bolt patterns are essentially universal, and flywheel brake cable connections are generally compatible as well. I've used a Honda engine on a Lawn-Boy deck where a Tecumseh engine once was. The flywheel brake cable worked just fine and it bolted to the deck just fine. Just this year, I went back to a different-year Tecumseh engine from a Craftsman mower...again, the Lawn-Boy's flywheel brake cable connects just fine and the Honda is on the shelf in the shed for another project.

I'd recommend finding a mower used with a rusted deck and a good engine. All you'd need to do then, for the most part, is freshen or replace the blade.

And if your current engine still ran after it hit the stump, even for a short while, it may not necessarily be a lost cause. You can pull the flywheel and check to see if the shear key has been damaged. If that was damaged, and the stress of running it one last time finally sheared it, the ignition timing would be off and it wouldn't run. So I wouldn't necessarily say that your engine is damaged beyond repair yet. If it ran without severe vibrations (which would indicate a bent crankshaft), it may still be good. Pull the spark plug and look underneath while someone pulls the starter cord and see if the crankshaft snout wobbles back and forth as it spins. If not, you may still have a usable motor there.
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#3400494 - 06/18/14 10:56 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
weebl Offline


Registered: 01/15/06
Posts: 538
Loc: Canada
Thanks. I may focus on other lawnmowers as potential donors then, though a small engine shop figures, without looking at it yet, they can get it going for $100. I can probably pull it apart to look at the flywheel and shear key, but honestly, I am so insanely busy with other stuff right now, I'd rather just pay that $100.

Though if I can find an alternative less than that, and it is basically plug and play, I am willing to do that (or even better, a ready to go used mower in good condition). Of course, all so long as it's cheaper than the repair, otherwise, I'd rather have my B&S engine up and running again.
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#3400507 - 06/18/14 11:15 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
bubbatime Offline


Registered: 03/18/08
Posts: 1495
Loc: South Florida
First (and most important) is the crankshaft has to be identical length. Most mower crankshafts are 3.156 inches long (3 5/32) Most pressure washers and mowers are 7/8 diameter, although some mowers are 25MM diameter(which is .98 inches, almost an inch) So if the length of the shafts are the same, you are getting close.

Next, pressure washers have a heavy flywheel. It will work fine on a mower, but would be better off swapping your lightweight aluminum flywheel. While the flywheel is off, you can swap the blade brake/kill switch components. Or you can use a kill switch.

Next, the carburetor on a pressure washer is adjustable to 3600 RPM for max power on a pressure washer. That is too fast (and dangerous) for a mower. Assuming the mowers are the same engine family, you can swap over your mower carb to the pressure washer engine so that your new engine runs at the same RPM for a mower. The primer bulb or auto choke are fairly easy to swap over too.

Basically, the swap can be done if you know what you are doing in about 30-45 minutes. For a novice/beginner, it could be a little too much...

Also, don't forget to re torque the head bolts. The head bolts on flat head Briggs engines are notorious for working there way loose on pressure washers.
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#3400509 - 06/18/14 11:16 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
bubbatime Offline


Registered: 03/18/08
Posts: 1495
Loc: South Florida
Yes it would be much easier to find a good used mower engine, or if so inclined, check eBay for new engines. There is a good selection of new engines there for $99 to $150 usually.
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#3400514 - 06/18/14 11:32 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
Quest Offline


Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 6549
Loc: beaver land EH?
I'm with hokiefyd on this:

it's not deemed "unserviceable" until you get things checked first:

Usually, when you hit a stump or similar, your flywheel key would have shifted or even sheared. Get that checked and replaced first (only 50c pc) and see if that works.

Q.
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#3400548 - 06/18/14 12:08 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 8095
Loc: Barberton,Ohio
around here the "check it" price would be about the same as a 79$ chonda lawnmower engine.

so its not really feasible to get it "checked out" unless its the -free checkout, the buddy 12pack hookup, or <25$.


Edited by Rand (06/18/14 12:10 PM)
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#3400551 - 06/18/14 12:09 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
440Magnum Offline


Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 6475
Loc: Texas
Two part reply: First, is it really dead? Hitting a stump *usually* just results in the flywheel key shearing off. That will eventually prevent it from running since the magneto won't be generating voltage at the instant the points open. So check the flywheel, re-key it, and see if it runs smoothly.

If it's really locked up or vibrates like crazy even with a new blade and you have to replace the engine: There are 4 variables among versions of that engine, all related to the shaft.

1) Shaft diameter
2) shaft length
3) Thread
4) "heavy" or "light" flywheel.

Never use a "heavy" flywheel engine on a mower, as that greatly increases the damage when you do hit a stump. My bet is that a pressure washer engine will be heavy flywheel. You could probably swap on your light flywheel and go, if the other parameters match.

Following that, matching the shaft diameter and length is most critical so your blade adapter will fit, and so that the blade will be at the correct height inside the shroud of the mower deck. You can buy a new Grade 8 bolt in the thread pitch the new engine uses.

You can pick up common versions of the 190cc Briggs for prices that are only 20% or more than the junk engines at Harbor Freight.

Check this site:
http://www.equipatron.com/small-engines/...ft-engines.html
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#3400556 - 06/18/14 12:13 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: 440Magnum]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 8095
Loc: Barberton,Ohio
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum


You can pick up common versions of the 190cc Briggs for prices that are only 20% or more than the junk engines at Harbor Freight.



that are only Double or more than the Chinese honda clones at Harbor Freight.


-Fixed that for you. grin2

If I was spending 160$ to 200$ for an engine I'd go craigslist diving first. The HF 173cc honda clone if it fits your application can be had for 79$ frequently... Alternatively a whole new craftman mower with a briggs 190cc starts at 229$.. that's without any kind of deal.


Edited by Rand (06/18/14 12:17 PM)
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#3400564 - 06/18/14 12:16 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: Rand]
440Magnum Offline


Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 6475
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum


You can pick up common versions of the 190cc Briggs for prices that are only 20% or more than the junk engines at Harbor Freight.



that are only Double or more than the Chinese honda clones at Harbor Freight.


-Fixed that for you. grin2


Harbor freight [censored]: $120
B&S 190cc at Equipatron: $150 plus shipping.

Win: B&S

Fixed it back for you. grin
_________________________
'66 Dodge Polara & '69 Dodge Coronet R/T both 440/727
'08 Ram 1500 4.7/545RFE
'12 Challenger SRT8 392/6-speed
'99 Cherokee 4.0, '11 Grand Cherokee 3.6

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#3400566 - 06/18/14 12:18 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: 440Magnum]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 8095
Loc: Barberton,Ohio
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum


Harbor freight [censored]: $120
B&S 190cc at Equipatron: $150 plus shipping.

Win: B&S

Fixed it back for you. grin



HF- 25% off coupons and frequent sales = 79$--often
--currently $106$-- last week 79$

Equipatron = 159.97$



updated. I see they just went off sale.


Edited by Rand (06/18/14 12:23 PM)
Edit Reason: cleaned up post
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#3400576 - 06/18/14 12:26 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: 440Magnum]
Hokiefyd Offline


Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 11720
Loc: North Carolina
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Never use a "heavy" flywheel engine on a mower, as that greatly increases the damage when you do hit a stump.


I think this is good advice. Many mower engines have heavy flywheels, like pressure washer engines, but they're usually used on mowers with blade brake clutches. My Honda HR215 and Lawn-Boy 8157 are such examples. The engine will sit there and idle all day long, without the blade turning. In fact, that's how you start them: without the blade turning.

But if a stump is hit and the blade does stop quick like, the blade clutch would probably soak up a lot of the momentum from the heavier flywheel. Without the blade clutch, I imagine that the crankshaft would be more prone to bending or twisting with the heavier flywheel's momentum.
_________________________
Cheers,
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2008 Honda CR-V EX-L (Peak 0W-20)
2005 Acura MDX Touring (VNG 5W-20)

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#3400693 - 06/18/14 03:12 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: Rand]
440Magnum Offline


Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 6475
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Rand
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum


Harbor freight [censored]: $120
B&S 190cc at Equipatron: $150 plus shipping.

Win: B&S

Fixed it back for you. grin



HF- 25% off coupons and frequent sales = 79$--often
--currently $106$-- last week 79$

Equipatron = 159.97$



updated. I see they just went off sale.


I'm sure that the Chondas do go on sale more often, I just think its more fair to compare standard prices against each other.

I know others have had OK luck with them, but personally until Hazard Fraught gets their "engine" down to $10 including tax and they pay me for my time installing that piece of slag, I'll pass. laugh
_________________________
'66 Dodge Polara & '69 Dodge Coronet R/T both 440/727
'08 Ram 1500 4.7/545RFE
'12 Challenger SRT8 392/6-speed
'99 Cherokee 4.0, '11 Grand Cherokee 3.6

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#3400964 - 06/18/14 09:06 PM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: 440Magnum]
Rand Offline


Registered: 08/20/03
Posts: 8095
Loc: Barberton,Ohio
I can respect your point of view.

However on a 10 year old mower in unknown condition paying 70% the price of a new mower

is IMO a bad idea

sears has a whole new mower with that engine for 229-249$ (depending on options)

and the OP needs at least a new motor.. maybe new blade also?

might as well buy a whole new mower at that point imo.

on the other hand waiting on the every month 79$ chonda sale at HF he would be in for 79-100$ or so.



Edited by Rand (06/18/14 09:07 PM)
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#3401963 - 06/20/14 04:38 AM Re: Exploring engine transplant - B&S 6.75hp / 190cc [Re: weebl]
Silverado12 Offline


Registered: 02/26/13
Posts: 860
Loc: Central Virginia
Is it really going to hurt anybody to spend the extra money on a B&S engine over cheap Chinese junk? We need to protect our industries and that happens through consumer patriotism.
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