Valvoline jumping on the titanium trend

[volk06]

I saw some new UOA containing titanium from valvoline mainly in premium blue around 30ppm, so I sent tech support an email.

Good morning, thank you for contacting Valvoline Product Support.

The titanium content in the Valvoline Premium Blue HDEO SAE 15W-40 is part of the additive package in our formulation. The content you have found is normal for our product.

If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact us via phone at 800 TEAM VAL or by email at [email protected] for assistance.

Thank you and have a great day.
Erik

 

[Ken2]

The Liquid Titanium does the same job as moly but at lower cost to the oil maker. Use it.

ZDDP puts a wear resistant high friction coating on the contact points of metal parts. ZDDP plus moly puts a wear resistant low friction coating on these points. ZDDP plus Afton Chemical's Liquid Titanium does the same job, according to Afton's patents, but costs less than moly.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Since Ti is cheaper,is it the oil companies' way of "cheapening out" a product and charging more for it?

 

[dparm]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Since Ti is cheaper,is it the oil companies' way of "cheapening out" a product and charging more for it?


Why do you associate lower cost with inferiority?

 

[volk06]

Originally Posted By: Ken2
The Liquid Titanium does the same job as moly but at lower cost to the oil maker. Use it.

I'm aware of what the titanium is and how it works as I use a lot of oils with titanium. I was sharing the information with others that now almost every major player has an oil with titanium, XOM, Castrol, Valvoline, and Conoco Phillips.

Titanium also works at lower temperatures than moly. Its a win-win for the manufacturer.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Since Ti is cheaper,is it the oil companies' way of "cheapening out" a product and charging more for it?


Why do you associate lower cost with inferiority?


Seems that's the way it always works,to produce more profit with less cost. Everything from foods to beauty products. If you compare ingredients old vs "new improved formulas",the new ones always leave out the expensive ingredients to substitute them for cheaper and inferior ingredients,while charging more for the finished product. They won't use a cheaper ingredient for the benefit of the consumer.

 

[volk06]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Originally Posted By: dparm
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Since Ti is cheaper,is it the oil companies' way of "cheapening out" a product and charging more for it?


Why do you associate lower cost with inferiority?


Seems that's the way it always works,to produce more profit with less cost. Everything from foods to beauty products. If you compare ingredients old vs "new improved formulas",the new ones always leave out the expensive ingredients to substitute them for cheaper and inferior ingredients,while charging more for the finished product. They won't use a cheaper ingredient for the benefit of the consumer.


To maximize profit with as little inputs as needed to achieve the required or desired results. Isn't that the purpose of a business? Just because titanium is cheaper does not mean it's inferior. If it does the same thing as moly and is just as effective if not more, how is that making an inferior product? Sounds like the company is meeting all its requirements and using its resources efficiently. Cost is driven up by other things besides the additives. R&D, Base lubes, packaging, advertising are all costs that cost quite a bit that people don't think about. If they can switch an additive with the same results for less money, doesn't it make sense too do that?

 

[aquariuscsm]

I guess it's like the pao/ester vs grp III thing. Pao/ester are expensive base stocks,BUT conventional base stocks can be "purified,etc" per se to make an oil that will provide and mimic the performance of the expensive pao/ester,allowing the co to make a cheaper product while charging the same/more for it thus fattening up their wallets more.

 

[yvon_la]

If it was graphene ?now that i would pay for it,but titanium or molybdenum?nhamagnesium is plenty.now where are those graphene additive ?

 

[MolaKule]

Quote:
... If you compare ingredients old vs "new improved formulas",the new ones always leave out the expensive ingredients to substitute them for cheaper and inferior ingredients,while charging more for the finished product. They won't use a cheaper ingredient for the benefit of the consumer.


What chemical compounds do they leave out today that they used in yesteryear?

 

[kschachn]

Since you take the time to make a post advocating one over the other, how about you explain to us the inherent disadvantages to a titanium and/or a molybdenum additive and the advantages to graphene?

Originally Posted By: yvon_la
If it was graphene ?now that i would pay for it,but titanium or molybdenum?nhamagnesium is plenty.now where are those graphene additive ?

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Since you take the time to make a post advocating one over the other, how about you explain to us the inherent disadvantages to a titanium and/or a molybdenum additive and the advantages to graphene?

Originally Posted By: yvon_la
If it was graphene ?now that i would pay for it,but titanium or molybdenum?nhamagnesium is plenty.now where are those graphene additive ?




Dude.

Do you really think you'll be able to understand his answer even if he does try to explain.
I can't decipher his posts at all. And I gave up trying.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Since Ti is cheaper,is it the oil companies' way of "cheapening out" a product and charging more for it?


How about using a lower cost alternative to moly, and charging the same price for the oil? The end product might be just as good with the alternative product too.

 

[ThirdeYe]

Just my 2 cents, but I didn't get the impression that aquariuscsm was saying it's inferior, he was just asking why it costs the same when they're cutting costs on the ingredients. Sadly, this happens all the time with many businesses.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: ThirdeYe
Just my 2 cents, but I didn't get the impression that aquariuscsm was saying it's inferior, he was just asking why it costs the same when they're cutting costs on the ingredients. Sadly, this happens all the time with many businesses.


Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
If you compare ingredients old vs "new improved formulas",the new ones always leave out the expensive ingredients to substitute them for cheaper and inferior ingredients


All of which being postulated with no evidence or knowledge whatsoever, just idle guessing.

 

[Food Scientist]

Two things - I read evidence supporting that moly still does a better job than titanium which would tie in what with aquariuscsm said (I work on cost savings projects all the time for a major food company so I know where he is coming from) as the oil company could* be advertising something that is different but not necessarily better (and cheaper) and charging me the same to make more profits.

*Without some sort of extended used oil analysis or other research methods I don't know personally which is better. All I know is what I read.

I thought graphene was an invention that is really compacted graphite that can be made into thin sheets to eventually be used to make bendable screens for smart phones?

 

[artificialist]

In Kendall oils, Titanium and Moly additives are used. Why would people say titanium additives replace moly if an oil has both?

 

[ThirdeYe]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Originally Posted By: ThirdeYe
Just my 2 cents, but I didn't get the impression that aquariuscsm was saying it's inferior, he was just asking why it costs the same when they're cutting costs on the ingredients. Sadly, this happens all the time with many businesses.


Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
If you compare ingredients old vs "new improved formulas",the new ones always leave out the expensive ingredients to substitute them for cheaper and inferior ingredients


All of which being postulated with no evidence or knowledge whatsoever, just idle guessing.


My bad, I didn't catch the word "inferior" in the original post.

 

[volk06]

Originally Posted By: artificialist
In Kendall oils, Titanium and Moly additives are used. Why would people say titanium additives replace moly if an oil has both?


Kendall was the only one using both. That has now charged as the moly has been cut and almost completely removed. Think of it like the calcium/magnesium variations and arguments in oils.

 

[KCJeep]

Castrol uses both Ti and Moly in their gold bottle Edge IIRC.