I changed the oil & filter in my 04 Altima yesterday (which is no big accomplishment) but the filter that I had on was a Fram Tough Guard 7317. After letting it drain overnight I cut it open today. This is only the second filter I have cut open, the first being a Nissan 15208-9E0000 which looked great to me, no signs of any damage. But the point here is so did this Fram filter. No pleats were torn. It was not squashed down or collasped like in photos I have seen on here. The anti drain back valve was still soft and when I removed the filter it was still filled with oil. And this with 5600 miles of service on it. I don't own a digital camera but I will be borrowing one from work to take photos of this filter and post them. Makes me wonder if people are intentionally damaging the filters they show to support their arguement. I purchased this Fram filter on sale at Advance Auto for less than $5.00 which is competetive with other filters of it's quality and $2.00 cheaper than the Nissan filter. I have no problem using this filter again.
Fram TG7317
- Thread starter Frank D
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The toughgard is a big improvement over the orange can.
My personal feeling is that the toughgard should be the entry level filter.
But, Fram has the market share and sells all kinds of filters(extra, tough, double, extended, high mileage, racing, fleetcare).
I also wonder "how abusive" some people are when dissecting oil filters.
My personal feeling is that the toughgard should be the entry level filter.
But, Fram has the market share and sells all kinds of filters(extra, tough, double, extended, high mileage, racing, fleetcare).
I also wonder "how abusive" some people are when dissecting oil filters.
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There are very few Fram failures reported here. The main objection to them is because of the cheaper construction ..for a somewhat premium price. They are probably the #1 selling filter ..yet are inferior to many in terms of contruction. I've cut open the HP versions at a friends shop. Even in a money class bracket racer, with his block bypass plugged, there was nothing wrong with it. There is nothing special about the HP line ..it has the same cardboard internals as the standard orange can. I briefly used a PZ filter (rebadged Fram) on my wife's Jeep. It's ADBV failed at about 3k. It was replaced with a Supertech ..no problems.
I don't think that anyone here intentionally messes up a filter to prove their point. OTOH, you can't take everything you see at face value either. So, keep cutting your filters open and, if possible, post the images with all your details.
I don't think that anyone here intentionally messes up a filter to prove their point. OTOH, you can't take everything you see at face value either. So, keep cutting your filters open and, if possible, post the images with all your details.
Why spend $5 on a filter that is made with substandard parts when a better filter is out there for the same price (Wix, Pure One, ect)?
If Fram's were priced @ $2.50 or less, then you get what you pay for. Is there anything wrong with them quality wise, not really.
If Fram's were priced @ $2.50 or less, then you get what you pay for. Is there anything wrong with them quality wise, not really.
The original Russ Knize filter study didn't mind the TG if memory serves me right. Thought it was acceptable despite the cardboard end caps.
Although I use ST's, Knize's first efforts were attacked by attorneys, not from Fram, but Champion Labs. Think Knize was knocking their media as being too thin.
Where is Knize? He used to come onto these boards, insult people and disappear.
Although I use ST's, Knize's first efforts were attacked by attorneys, not from Fram, but Champion Labs. Think Knize was knocking their media as being too thin.
Where is Knize? He used to come onto these boards, insult people and disappear.
I think he just changed his name to Filter Guy...
I'm trying to post photos but don't know how to attach them. Can anyone help me? Thanks.
Examining this filter I don't see any substandard parts. Whatever these end caps are made of (if indeed it is cardboard) they are not soft and squishy like any cardbord I ever got wet. It is rigid and hard and is not pulling apart. The antidrain back valve is still soft and pliable and the bypass valve fit into its end of the filter tightly and the center tube had plenty of holes in it to allow oil flow. I might add that the adbv was functioning when I removed the filter because it was holding oil and did not drain it out until I punctured the can. I have seen Knize's filter study. I had never heard a bad word about Fram oil filters before that, only high praise. Since then they are the worst filters in the world just like that. I'll bet that if Knize had never posted his study not a bad word would be being said about them. I recall reading somewhere that Fram said it has always used these endcaps even in its hayday. Well seeing is believing (for me anyway) and I did not see any of the damage that other posters have shown. In the future I'll try the regular Fram Extraguard and disect it to satisfy myself.
The pics of used Frams with small holes blown through the media into the center tube around the web are a very real phenomenon. I have cut open about 50 used Frams at the shop and wee this quite often. Especially on vehicles that run higher oil pressures. The best way to see this is to cut a Fram apart and shine a flashlight into the center tube. You will see pits of stringy media protruding through the center tube holes, then look on the outside of the filter and you will see the light coming through the hole. LesabreT has a great pic of this on his website.
Lubeowner, I just conducted your test, even put new batteries in the flashlight so it would be nice and bright. It passed the test, no stringy media coming through the center tube and no light coming through the filter. I must have gotten the only good filter Fram ever made.
When did I ever say that all Frams's had holes in them???? When did I ever say that all Champs were bad??? All I have ever said concerning oil filters is that these two brands have an exceedingly higher failure rate run under the same conditions as competitors. If you like the Frams use them, I don't care. All I am posting is real world data under real world conditions.
[ June 25, 2005, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Gary Allan ]
[ June 25, 2005, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Gary Allan ]
I think lubeowner was talking about the regular orange can Fram filter(Extra Guard).
The filter you have here is somewhat of an upscale version of the regular Fram.
Go to:
www.Fram.com
and click on products.
You can read about the extras the Tough Guard has above the regular Extra Guard.
The regular Extra Guard filters are not the best filter a person can get,especially for the money.
You can also go to:
www.http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/oilfilterstudy.html
This is a little old but should be of valuable information.
The Tough Guard and Doubleguard is built exactly the same as the orange can, it does have a screen over the bypass "to catch debris" and a silicone ADBV. Other than that, same cardboard construction. The only good Fram filter (I would use one) is the Extended guard (X2). These seem to be well built. Similar media construcion as Fleetguard stratapore, or Wix XE.
From the comments that are on the board,it seems no one is talking about the X2 filter.
The discussion has been on the Tough Guard and Extra Guard filters.
The X2 is mentioned in a post but it seems it was only done so as to say that it is the only Fram oil filter that is good.
Lets not get excited here and get something started.
I think maybe that BlazerLT's comments were toward the Tough Guard and Extra Guard filters,not the X2.
The X2 was not really being discussed,it seems it was used more or less as a referance.
I think the big concern about the ADBV in Frams is that in some models they're considerably thinner than in other brands. I've cut open a couple, and it was a rather thin piece what seemed to be rubber flap connected to a metal ring. The typical ADBV failure in a Fram seems to be rubber simply folding over and staying that way. This page has a picture:
http://www.lesabret.com/filters/filter.html
y, this is the first Fram I have disected. It may not be a fair comparison to the regular Extra Guard but this TG7317 at least to me greatly exceeds everything I have read and seen about the orange Frams on this forum. Whatever the endcaps are made of, they feel more like gasket material than cardboard. The center tube has plenty of holes for flow and this filter survived 5600 miles of use without any of the damage others have shown. I recall one photo showing the filter media from a Fram with what was described as a rupture hole but to me looked more like a puncture hole. It was perfectly round whereas a rupture would be a jaggedly torn rip from excess pressure pushing it in or out. Finally the photos I took may yet appear but with no help from me.
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