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#3395433 - 06/12/14 08:26 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: badtlc]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 20991
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: badtlc
I have read them. Have you? Lots of concerned people with very few actual incidents.


Actually I did read up on it, a lot. I also discussed it with an expert in the field, Trav. That's why I feel the way I do about the system. It is still evolving and maybe in another few years will be as problem free as EFI currently is with regard to valve deposits, etc. I will say some DI engines are much better than others.


So you are giving up on your claim about threads on this forum with people having all these problems? That is progress.


Why not read what I said, I was pretty clear. Or challenge the expert on the topic Trav, he posted links, read them. Then let us know if the technology is ready for prime time.
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#3395441 - 06/12/14 08:34 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: badtlc]
Trav Offline


Registered: 11/20/06
Posts: 9522
Loc: MA, Mittelfranken.de
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Those that get the deposits can easily burn them off if they choose to.

Not true in all cases. Way too broad a brush with that statement IMO.
Look at this then tell me how running the engine at 3K for 20 min is going to clean this mess up.
If that had even the most remote chance of working i think VW/Audi and others would be recommending it as preventive maintenance.

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php/336352-Audi-FSI-Engine-Carbon-Build-up-Megathread

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2012/05/ask-an-engineer-gdi-problems-in-a-nutshell

http://www.dailytech.com/Direct+Injected...rticle21962.htm

http://www.munichmotorsport.com/wordpress/?page_id=601

I have a few Di injectors from hi revving marine engines that are damaged beyond repair and they see 5,000 RPM for extended period.
Because your car isn't having the issue yet you cant claim anything will work on all engines.


3k doesn't cut. VW specifically stated 4,500+ RPMs. And yes, it does work, has been documented with photos to work.


Why are they still cleaning with walnut shells then?
Why are the cars that see these RPM's for longer than 20 minutes on a regular basis still having problems?
Is there a TSB that says no blasting needed just take it out and drive it at this RPM for this many minutes?
How do you bring the rear of a sodium filled valve up to those kind of temperatures when it is designed to dissipate heat?

If you need to do this sort of nonsense to any any engine to keep it running properly its poor design.
As i said before you cannot claim this will work with all engines. If that were really the case this would not be as big an issue for the manufacturers as it is.
Can you post some VW/Audi documentation to substantiate your claim.

Another point is its just not the rear of the valve that accumulates deposits its the area in the intake channel around the valve. You cannot get the head up the sort of temp you would need to burn it off, its liquid cooled.

Even in Germany where 4500+ RPM for 20 min and much longer is done on a daily basis in many cases they are still having problems.

Threads like this one are common.

http://www.1erforum.de/bmw-135i/reinigun...ung-113320.html

Sorry badtlc your casual easy approach to this issue is not realistic.
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Those that get the deposits can easily burn them off if they choose to.
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#3396348 - 06/13/14 08:15 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
I have a 2012 Hyundai veloster. It has a gamma di engine. At about 40,000 miles I noticed the engine was knocking bad. I took the car to Hyundai and they did a bg44 intake cleaning. It worked for about 2 days then I noticed the car making that sound again. ps I had to pay for that service. Even though the tech told me that the di engines have an issue I still had to pay. So I took the car back to them and the Hyundai service manager said sorry but theres nothing they can do , they tried with bg44 and it didn't work , I was like [censored] did I pay for then. Also I use shell or exxon gas 90 percent of the time with a tectron cleaning hear and there. So top tier fuel isn't the answer like they tell you it is. After I left Hyundai I stopped at autozone and picked up two bottles of tectron and put one of them in the tank and filled up. ran the tank empty. Then I did it again the next fill up. Seems to be working now just fine. The cars got 45,000 miles now and im running another batch of tectron and all is fine. my plan is too use tectron 2 times per oci and hopefully I wont have to get scammed my dealer anymore.

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#3396350 - 06/13/14 08:17 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
I plan on changing the pcv valve this weekend so hopefully that helps too.

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#3396358 - 06/13/14 08:23 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: waltywalt]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 20991
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: waltywalt
I have a 2012 Hyundai veloster. It has a gamma di engine. At about 40,000 miles I noticed the engine was knocking bad. I took the car to Hyundai and they did a bg44 intake cleaning. It worked for about 2 days then I noticed the car making that sound again. ps I had to pay for that service. Even though the tech told me that the di engines have an issue I still had to pay. So I took the car back to them and the Hyundai service manager said sorry but theres nothing they can do , they tried with bg44 and it didn't work , I was like [censored] did I pay for then. Also I use shell or exxon gas 90 percent of the time with a tectron cleaning hear and there. So top tier fuel isn't the answer like they tell you it is. After I left Hyundai I stopped at autozone and picked up two bottles of tectron and put one of them in the tank and filled up. ran the tank empty. Then I did it again the next fill up. Seems to be working now just fine. The cars got 45,000 miles now and im running another batch of tectron and all is fine. my plan is too use tectron 2 times per oci and hopefully I wont have to get scammed my dealer anymore.


Posts like this, reading on the www. and speaking with people who know is why I feel the way I do about DI. The technology is still evolving, and will eventually be as reliable or even more reliable than EFI. It's not there yet that's all I'm saying.

The Techron might help because you probably have carbon in the combustion chambers. You might be better off with the 3M kit [3M08963] to keep it at bay. It will be cheaper than going to the dealer. Check it out at Amazon and watch the how to video. HTH
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#3396367 - 06/13/14 08:32 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
Also when I spoke to the tech that actually did the bg44 cleaning on my veloster he said don't baby the car. Get it out on the highway and drive it hard once in awhile. Get the rpms up atleast to 3000 for 20 minutes . My v has the dct tranny so I can put the car in 4th or 5th gear and set the cruise and do that no problem. I looked at him and said sorry man but im not running my car like that. So for me its use the tectron stuff alot and pray it works. I figured it will cost the same to do the in tank method then if I just bring it to them every 40,000 miles. I was thinking about getting in touch with Hyundai corp and complaining about it but im sure ill get the answer im not looking for.

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#3396369 - 06/13/14 08:35 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: waltywalt]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 25287
Loc: Illinoistan
Originally Posted By: waltywalt
Get the rpms up atleast to 3000 for 20 minutes. My v has the dct tranny so I can put the car in 4th or 5th gear and set the cruise and do that no problem. I looked at him and said sorry man but im not running my car like that.

Why not?
_________________________
'02 530i (PU 5W-40)
'08 C300 4Matic (M1 0W-40)
'13 F700 GS (Spectro 15W-50)

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#3396373 - 06/13/14 08:40 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
A lot of people I talk to say they run a maintenance dose of tectron at each fill up. To me that's a pain in the rear end so im just gonna do the twice per oci method.

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#3396405 - 06/13/14 09:32 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: Quattro Pete]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
Pete why would I wanna put any more stress on my car. Im sure its not good for the car to do that. Theres a reason why the car has 5th and 6th gear. Why would I wanna run it in 4th gear and get [censored] gas mileage and make the engine and tranny run hotter then need be. I know they say it will help with the carbon issue but no thanks. Ill keep babying my car. I just don't think its smart to abuse other aspects of the car for a issue that Hyundai needs to figure out. Now if Hyundai puts it in writing that its okay to do this then I might think different.

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#3396409 - 06/13/14 09:34 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: waltywalt]
Turk Offline


Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 8017
Loc: MN
Holy cow, wallywalt, that thing is carboning up FAST!!

Have you tried Shell V-Power or BP Invigorate gas yet??

Keep us informed...
_________________________
03 GMC Sierra 4x4 200k, M1 TDT
00 Saturn SL2 89 YO Lady Car. 79k Miles! PU
98 Saturn SC2 "Red Hot" PYB + LubeGard + Kreen
97 Camry 207k Maxlife


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#3396410 - 06/13/14 09:35 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
I might even try that 3m kit that demarpaint wrote about. I saw it on the web and it seems simple to do.

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#3396419 - 06/13/14 09:47 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
turk I use shell gas 85 percent of the time. and mobil or exxon 5 percent of the time. Sunoco and citco the other ten percent id say. But since the car was new I also used tectron not every other oil change but atleast every ten thousand miles. I only did that because of the use of non top tier Sunoco and citco gas. Which I know now is a bunch of nonsence. Like I said now im gonna use tectron a lot more. hopefully it does the trick. PS I used only top synthectic in this car and always change my oil at the severe service too. 3,750 miles oci. I was told that can help. It didn't.

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#3396421 - 06/13/14 09:50 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: nicholas]
waltywalt Offline


Registered: 02/10/14
Posts: 265
Loc: ny
In the velosters manual it says to use tectron fuel system cleaner every oil change if you don't use top tier fuel. That's why I didn't use the tectron every oil change. I used mostly top tier for the life of the car so idk what to really think anymore.

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#3396427 - 06/13/14 09:57 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: waltywalt]
demarpaint Offline


Registered: 07/03/05
Posts: 20991
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: waltywalt
Pete why would I wanna put any more stress on my car. Im sure its not good for the car to do that. Theres a reason why the car has 5th and 6th gear. Why would I wanna run it in 4th gear and get [censored] gas mileage and make the engine and tranny run hotter then need be. I know they say it will help with the carbon issue but no thanks. Ill keep babying my car. I just don't think its smart to abuse other aspects of the car for a issue that Hyundai needs to figure out. Now if Hyundai puts it in writing that its okay to do this then I might think different.


I hear ya, but 3,000 rpms isn't bad, its a heck of a lot better than 4,500 rpms that has been suggested in the past. Good luck getting Hyundai putting anything in writing. I'd use the 3M kit and a maint dose of Red Line FI cleaner or Techron and hope for the best.
_________________________
GOD Bless our Troops!


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#3396447 - 06/13/14 10:23 AM Re: In tank additives for DI [Re: waltywalt]
Quattro Pete Offline


Registered: 10/30/02
Posts: 25287
Loc: Illinoistan
Originally Posted By: waltywalt
Pete why would I wanna put any more stress on my car. Im sure its not good for the car to do that.

3000 rpm is stress?

You bought a sports/sporty car just so you can drive it like a grandma?

Alas, it's your car, so the choice is certainly yours.
_________________________
'02 530i (PU 5W-40)
'08 C300 4Matic (M1 0W-40)
'13 F700 GS (Spectro 15W-50)

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