12K on some M1 5w30 lots of Iron with Mobile 1

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I tried to go a year on this oil and a Honda filter with top offs. 2004 Honda Accord 2.4 I4, mostly driven in the city, but had at least 7k of road trips on this oil. The last top off quart of oil was M1 10w30 because I didn't have anything else laying around. My goal was to just change my oil once a year in the Spring.

Blackstone said:

was a much longer oil run than you've used in the past and it might have been a little much for your Honda's engine. Iron (steel parts) read higher than we would expect, even after considering the long oil run. It should be closer to 15-20 ppm, but iron was a little elevated last time, so we're not ready to call this a problem. Your engine may
make more iron than average and that's okay. Maybe you did more idling over the winter, and since that's engine use that doesn't log miles, it could explain iron. The TBN was good at 3.2, but use 10K miles next.

Oil: M1 5w30
Unit Miles: 125,772 118,145 This oil was left in until the UAO at 125,772
Oil Miles: 12,244 4,613

Aluminum(Al): 4 3
Chromium(Cr): 1 1
Iron(Fe): 25 15
Copper(Cu): 1 1
Lead(Pb): 3 3
Tin(Sn): 3 1
Moly(Mo): 77 87
Nickel(Ni): 0 0
Manganese 1 0
Silver(Ag): 0 0
Titanium(Ti): 0 0
Potassium(K): 5 0
Boron(B): 44 52
Silicon(Si): 8 8
Sodium(Na): 43 52
Calcium:(Ca) 1170 1212
Magnesium(Mg): 836 820
Phosphorus(P): 722 750
Zinc(Zn) 846 918
Barium(Ba): 0 0

SUS Vis @210F: 59.0 57.2
cSt Vis @100C: 9.94 9.41
Flashpoint F: 420 395
Fuel %: Antifreeze: 0.0 ?
Water: 0.0 0.0
Insolubles % 0.4 0.4
TBN 3.2 3.1
 
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Iron tracks with mileage, so if the mileage listed is correct, you have less Fe PPM per 1K miles than you did on your last run, 0.002 vs 0.003.

In fact the thread directly below yours, a run of PP 10w-30:

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30 5K mile UOA

Has iron at 0.003 PPM per 1K miles, higher than your current run.

And another recent thread:

PP 5w-30 UOA

Has iron at 0.004 PPM per 1K miles, double your current run.

The difference is that these runs are significantly lower than yours so the iron doesn't look as "bad".
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Iron tracks with mileage, so if the mileage listed is correct, you have less Fe PPM per 1K miles than you did on your last run, 0.002 vs 0.003.

In fact the thread directly below yours, a run of PP 10w-30:

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30 5K mile UOA

Has iron at 0.003 PPM per 1K miles, higher than your current run.

And another recent thread:

PP 5w-30 UOA

Has iron at 0.004 PPM per 1K miles, double your current run.

The difference is that these runs are significantly lower than yours so the iron doesn't look as "bad".


Your units should be PPM(Fe)/MILE, not /kmiles.
 
Looks fine. Notice that in the first 4,600 your iron was 15ppm, as you added another 7,600 miles the iron only increased by 10ppm for a total of 25ppm. Everything else remained under control.

No problem with what you did. I'm curious, how many quarts were added along the way?
 
Make up oil: 1 quart at 4,600 mi, at least 3 more by 12,000.
Thanks OVERKILL for the Fe mileage comment.
 
Originally Posted By: gathermewool
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Iron tracks with mileage, so if the mileage listed is correct, you have less Fe PPM per 1K miles than you did on your last run, 0.002 vs 0.003.

In fact the thread directly below yours, a run of PP 10w-30:

Pennzoil Platinum 10w-30 5K mile UOA

Has iron at 0.003 PPM per 1K miles, higher than your current run.

And another recent thread:

PP 5w-30 UOA

Has iron at 0.004 PPM per 1K miles, double your current run.

The difference is that these runs are significantly lower than yours so the iron doesn't look as "bad".


Your units should be PPM(Fe)/MILE, not /kmiles.



Derp! Thanks for the correction, LOL!


OP, as noted that should be FE/Mile, not 1K miles.
 
I pour it in and have no idea where it goes.
I used Honda 5W20 for the first 70k, then started using MC5000 5w20. I wonder if those low wt oils didn't protect the engine enough. But I have and old UAO with MC5000 5w20 and 6Kmiles that looked great.
 
This is includes my only previou UOA on my Honda with MC5K vs M1 that I then kept in for 12K that you see above.
Code:




OIL M1 5w30 MC5K5w20

MILES IN USE 4.6k 6.5k

MILES 118.1k 91.5k

SAMPLE TAKEN 9/26/13 8/11/11



ALUMINUM 3 5

CHROMIUM 1 1

IRON 15 10

COPPER 1 1

LEAD 3 4

TIN 1 0

MOLYBDENUM 87 143

NICKEL 0 1

MANGANESE 0 0

SILVER 0 0

TITANIUM 0 0

POTASSIUM 0 1

BORON 52 34

SILICON 8 12

SODIUM 52 0

CALCIUM 1212 1987

MAGNESIUM 820 13

PHOSPHORUS 750 723

ZINC 918 879

BARIUM 0 0



SUS VIS 210ºF 57.2 51.3

cSt @ 212ºF 9.41 7.67

FLASHPOINT ºF 395 385

FUEL
ANTIFREEZE ? 0.0

WATER 0 0

INSOLUBLES 0.4 0.3

TBN 3.2 1.8
 
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If you want to continue the same oci, you could switch to the high mileage m1. Maybe at least slow the consumption a little.

At the rate you're adding oil you may be able to get by with less expensive oil and still maintain a good tbn/tan. Then again maybe the engine condition would diminish the tbn too rapidly.
 
I'm surprised TBN isn't higher than 3.2 considering 4 make up quarts were used.

You might consider the standard blend of Valvoline Maxlife. It has slowed consumption and leakage in some engines I have seen. I have seen in some particular engines depending on the problem, regular Mobil 1 (or any quality synthetic) can disappear faster.

In terms of wear on your engine, there doesn't seem to be any issue. 25 PPM isn't particularly high. Of course, you also lost some of the wear metal from leak or consumption.
 
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As overkill explained,iron tracks will miles/hours so it's not a big problem.
Yes we see that some used oil analysis show high iron with m1 however that's basically meaningless unless you can tell me how many ppm iron is equivalent to a micron of wear.
And 20 grade oils protect just fine unless you are heating the oil up excessively which may affect film strength to a degree.
Try a 5w-30 if your not under warranty,see if it holds up better.
And remember that a used oil analysis is in no way an accurate wear indicator,so don't make the mistake that many here do and compare used oil analysis with different brands and the one with less wear metals is the better oil.
We've seen stellar used oil analysis as far as wear metals go and the engine lunched itself shortly thereafter.
A used oil analysis is meant to test the oils condition and how much life remains in the oil.
 
Just curious where the iron would come from, is it an iron block? I would guess alum with steel sleeves. Con Rods maybe?

My first ever UOA on my 1UZ-FE Lexus was 38ppm for 30k miles, just curious for comparison. I am new to doing my own UOAs
 
Originally Posted By: EyesofThunder
Just curious where the iron would come from, is it an iron block? I would guess alum with steel sleeves. Con Rods maybe?

My first ever UOA on my 1UZ-FE Lexus was 38ppm for 30k miles, just curious for comparison. I am new to doing my own UOAs



Camshaft lobes, rings, cylinder walls, lifters/HLA's...etc.
 
OP I ran away from Mobil-1 a long time ago.

Try another brand of oil---ANY other brand of oil and I will bet your UOA results and oil consumption will improve dramatically. Some engines just eat M-1 for lunch.
Many here with 2.4 Honda motors run Pennzoil products---try Pennzoil 5-30 in the yellow bottle. Give it a couple of 6K OCIs to settle in, and I think you will be very happy with the results What have you got to lose?
 
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