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#3378596 - 05/22/14 06:17 PM graphene please!
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
Any do graphene ?i know this is awsome in all the ways,the issue?oh where oh where are you graphene additive creator(oil)
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#3378633 - 05/22/14 06:59 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
I would take say mobil delvac 1 le 5w30 reciepe ,replace pretty much every thickner and zink (equal measure)with graphene ,and voila a nice good oil
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#3378641 - 05/22/14 07:10 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
expat Offline


Registered: 05/12/09
Posts: 3838
Loc: Canada
Graphene is pure carbon in the form of a very thin, nearly transparent sheet, one atom thick. It is remarkably strong for its very low weight and it conducts heat and electricity with great efficiency. Wikipedia

What is your Question?

Or do you mean Graphite?

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#3378705 - 05/22/14 08:27 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
gathermewool Offline


Registered: 01/09/09
Posts: 3613
Loc: New England
Two non-sensical posts in a row...
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#3378715 - 05/22/14 08:33 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
andyd Offline


Registered: 09/25/04
Posts: 3800
Loc: Marshfield , MA
I never heard of graphene, is it real? I have heard of graphite in oil. IRRC, an oil with graphite was sold back in the 70s
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#3378718 - 05/22/14 08:38 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
dave5358 Offline


Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 669
Loc: North Bend
Originally Posted By: yvon_la
Any do graphene ?i know this is awsome in all the ways,the issue?oh where oh where are you graphene additive creator(oil)

I had never heard of graphene until you posted. Wikipedia describes graphene here and potential applications for graphene here. Most of these applications are in electronics and science, but, nowhere is mentioned using it as an additive or friction reducer in lubrication. And, if you were to apply it to lubricants, you might start with greases or paste applications - not motor oil

Graphite comes to mind, but it has not proven useful as an oil additive, at least for the reason that it cannot take high pressures.
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#3378823 - 05/22/14 10:47 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
Not sure about graphite it is size dependant !wasnt there issue with graphite a few years back.graphene is suposedly a nice natural lubricant (graphite also but quality control about size in the past were issue (or so the urban legend goes)
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#3378825 - 05/22/14 10:52 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
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#3378973 - 05/23/14 06:56 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
dave5358 Offline


Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 669
Loc: North Bend
Originally Posted By: yvon_la

No, you read correctly, at least as far as it went. But you might also check this forum or the net for "graphite in motor oil". ARCO Graphite was such a product. ARCO Graphite suffered from serious agglomeration issues, clogged filters and a series of other woes. Worse, graphite simply doesn't withstand pressure, although it is frequently used in low-pressure applications such as lubricating lock mechanisms. From Wikipedia:

"The use of graphite is limited by its tendency to facilitate pitting corrosion in some stainless steel, and to promote galvanic corrosion between dissimilar metals (due to its electrical conductivity). It is also corrosive to aluminium in the presence of moisture. For this reason, the US Air Force banned its use as a lubricant in aluminium aircraft, and discouraged its use in aluminium-containing automatic weapons. Even graphite pencil marks on aluminium parts may facilitate corrosion."

Sources are cited in the Wikipedia article. Graphite is a good lubricant for certain applications, but internal engine use applications or even assembly use applications has been very limited. Molybdenum Disulfide is normally used instead - it can withstand extreme pressure and suffers from none of the limitations of graphite.

It is not clear that graphene overcomes these issues, but the proposed uses cited by Argonne Laboratories sound a lot like the existing uses for graphite.
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#3379078 - 05/23/14 09:05 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
camelCase Offline


Registered: 07/11/13
Posts: 168
Loc: Southeastern, USA
Graphene is simply a single layer of graphite.





Graphite is a great lube because the vanderwalls bonds slip easily when a shear is acted on it.

Graphene is extremely strong because you're applying stress directly to the ionic/covalent bonds that make up the crystal structure.

Carbon nanotubes are simply the single layer of graphite rolled into a tube.

Graphene as an antiwear material is still in early research stages, but there is potential to use it as a spray in coating for things like cylinder linings and such.

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#3379376 - 05/23/14 03:54 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
alternety Offline


Registered: 01/15/09
Posts: 148
Loc: Pacific NW
Use IF WS2 instead. It is in the form of Bucky Baal made up of WS2 molecules. It also fractures and forms even smaller particles. It has characteristics better than pretty much any other metal lubricant (e.g, Moly).

Search this forum for more info.

There is also a Graphene like form of WS2, but I believe it is quite rare if you try to find some. There are indications it may be as good or better than IF WS2.


Edited by alternety (05/23/14 03:55 PM)

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#3379482 - 05/23/14 06:28 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
Graphene is anti-corrosion,graphite is corrosive
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#3379483 - 05/23/14 06:30 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
You better hope mobil doesnt sell this without certification because i will put this in my oil and not sweat one iota .
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#3383503 - 05/28/14 08:40 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
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#3383506 - 05/28/14 08:43 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
Joe_Power Offline


Registered: 04/18/13
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#3386910 - 06/02/14 11:16 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
ironman_gq Offline


Registered: 04/30/14
Posts: 134
Loc: MN
Gonna be some spendy oil, they're still working on making lab test quantities of graphene with any type of consistency and quality control.

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#3387738 - 06/03/14 10:28 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: ironman_gq]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
nha they found a way to make graphene ,it is like a jet engine thing but the end output is squeezed and it deposit it in film witch can then be used.
http://www.gizmag.com/spray-on-graphene/32315/
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#3387811 - 06/03/14 11:44 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 11644
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
I can understand the principle of a graphene coating. I can't see how it could be used as an ingredient in a finished motor oil, without it being pulverized into amorphous graphite, which, as others have already indicated, we do not want in our motor oil.
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#3387950 - 06/03/14 03:48 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
ironman_gq Offline


Registered: 04/30/14
Posts: 134
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: yvon_la
nha they found a way to make graphene ,it is like a jet engine thing but the end output is squeezed and it deposit it in film witch can then be used.
http://www.gizmag.com/spray-on-graphene/32315/


That sounds like a great way to treat a surface but not practical for large scale production of bulk product. Still a lot more expensive than other products that are well suited for use as an additive.

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#3388043 - 06/03/14 06:15 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
ya graphene is expensive ,but its properties are so uber that I highly doubt it will be ignored!
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#3388054 - 06/03/14 06:27 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 2660
Loc: Upper Midwest
Which of its properties do you think are relevant to motor oil?

Originally Posted By: yvon_la
ya graphene is expensive ,but its properties are so uber that I highly doubt it will be ignored!
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#3388503 - 06/04/14 09:28 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
yvon_la Offline


Registered: 05/20/14
Posts: 740
Loc: quebec canada
sidenote:any have ever had rotary engine?(aka wankel in the mazda or other car brand,wouldnt a graphene film be perfect for those troublesome leak prone engine?

I cannot list all the properties of graphene,the list is too long but it is very different from graphite (wich had troublesome problem like corrosion
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#3388536 - 06/04/14 10:10 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: yvon_la]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 2660
Loc: Upper Midwest
Actually yes I did, a very rusty 1984 model that burned a lot of oil. It was fun to drive though. They didn't "leak" oil as such, it was apex seal wear that was the problem. Oil consumption was a secondary problem, the primary issue was loss of compression.

If graphene is added to motor oil would it bond to surfaces?

Originally Posted By: yvon_la
sidenote:any have ever had rotary engine?(aka wankel in the mazda or other car brand,wouldnt a graphene film be perfect for those troublesome leak prone engine?

I cannot list all the properties of graphene,the list is too long but it is very different from graphite (wich had troublesome problem like corrosion
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#3388547 - 06/04/14 10:26 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: kschachn]
Clevy Offline


Registered: 11/11/10
Posts: 7387
Loc: Saskatoon canada
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Actually yes I did, a very rusty 1984 model that burned a lot of oil. It was fun to drive though. They didn't "leak" oil as such, it was apex seal wear that was the problem. Oil consumption was a secondary problem, the primary issue was loss of compression.

If graphene is added to motor oil would it bond to surfaces?

Originally Posted By: yvon_la
sidenote:any have ever had rotary engine?(aka wankel in the mazda or other car brand,wouldnt a graphene film be perfect for those troublesome leak prone engine?

I cannot list all the properties of graphene,the list is too long but it is very different from graphite (wich had troublesome problem like corrosion


From what I've read with google searches no it doesn't. It's like Teflon from what I understand and doesn't work like mos2 in relation to "plating" moving parts
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#3388623 - 06/04/14 12:06 PM Re: graphene please! [Re: kschachn]
dave5358 Offline


Registered: 04/25/13
Posts: 669
Loc: North Bend
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Actually yes I did, a very rusty 1984 model [Mazda Rotary] that burned a lot of oil. It was fun to drive though. They didn't "leak" oil as such, it was apex seal wear that was the problem. Oil consumption was a secondary problem, the primary issue was loss of compression.

If graphene is added to motor oil would it bond to surfaces?

Why not MoS2? It bonds to metal. It's available. I've never owned a Wankel engine, but problems with the apex seals are well known.
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#3389540 - 06/05/14 09:14 AM Re: graphene please! [Re: dave5358]
kschachn Offline


Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 2660
Loc: Upper Midwest
Well, actually I would if it had new apex and side seals, and I knew the compression was good.

Then again that particular car is now incorporated into a bunch of green bean cans, and even possibly my current cars smile

Originally Posted By: dave5358
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Actually yes I did, a very rusty 1984 model [Mazda Rotary] that burned a lot of oil. It was fun to drive though. They didn't "leak" oil as such, it was apex seal wear that was the problem. Oil consumption was a secondary problem, the primary issue was loss of compression.

If graphene is added to motor oil would it bond to surfaces?

Why not MoS2? It bonds to metal. It's available. I've never owned a Wankel engine, but problems with the apex seals are well known.
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