WWII Servicing of Jeeps, Tanks etc.

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Is there anybody here that worked on or serviced the military vehicles, Jeeps, Tanks etc, back in WWII? Did they change oil? Did they change (have) oil filters. Servicing the transmissions, transfer cases, front/rear differentials??? Did they have any special tricks to keep'em rolling in frigid temps? Was antifreeze used??? Did they have service areas to work on and keep running??? I don't know if this posted in right place, if not please move post.
Thanks In Advance
oldhp
 
The war ended 69 years ago, so anyone working on vehicles would be at least 85 years old. I doubt there are many 85 year olds on the internet, let alone on Bitog. But if there are, I would love to hear some stories.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Kind of related.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geFxqVj3AAw

Some of these manual might have maintenance details, etc.
http://www.delbertsscalemodels.com/DSM/i...vehicle-manuals


Excellent.
Thankyou for posting that.

I personally have an active interest in these things, as my father was in WW II and grew up with people of that era.
As a generation, they were naturally resourceful.
Add to that the mechanical nature of things in the main weren't complicated for land based forces.
The Air force and Navy had more complex and larger scale systems to deal with.

A lot had to do with the resources available
Obviously if you were loosing the war, it was not a high priority to keep things in tip top condition.
If you were winning the war, then it depended upon how well established the forces were in the area.

With regard to the army. I don't think anything other that water was used as coolant.(It was cost effective)
They did some of their own maintenance in the field as required, and there was some training in that regard.
There were basic tools provided with the vehicles, in order to keep them going In the event of a breakdown, also for routine maintenance if the facilities and resources were available. (Time permitting, otherwise it just didn't get done at all)
Everything was mobile and had to be kept in that state to be effective, and that's all.
Everything had a basic manual. Even for how to hang toilet paper.

In forward areas they mostly drove the vehicles until they were US (unserviceable) for what ever reason.
Remember everything wasn't necessarily made to last as it was expendable and expected to be destroyed in action. Also it made it cheaper to produce.
Naturally It did depend upon the size and cost and role of the vehicle.
Small vehicles like a GP (Jeep) obviously were more expendable than a larger truck or tank.

In the rear areas there were mechanical workshops dedicated to all manner of repairs.
A generals jeep would be superbly maintained by mechanics, and a jeep in the front line probably only get running repairs as required to just keep it going.
Then there was everything in between including the mobile w/shops.


The Air force was different, and unlike the Army it depended upon the size and location of the air field. Maintenance was only performed by qualified personnel.
General maintenance at the bigger bomber bases, which were located by necessity in the rearward areas. Was mostly performed out on the hardstand regardless of the weather. The ground crews really earned their pay in winter in England.
They also had large hangers for heavy maintenance/extensive repairs, but the bulk of the work on all the aircraft was done outside on the hardstand.
They would also cannibalize US aircraft in the outer areas of the airfields, where the written off aircraft were kept.

Airfields dedicated to fighter Aircraft had similar capabilities, unless they were in a forward area.
Then things were more rudimentary.

REGARDING COOLANT.
Ethylene Glycol was deemed to be a top secret by the Allied forces during the war.
It was added to the water in aircraft to prevent freezing in the winter and help provide stable coolant temps at high altitude and under a wide range of operating conditions.
I think from memory, some aircraft even had coolant pumped out to the guns in the wings to prevent the guns from freezing at high altitude.

The Navy was in a similar situation to the Air Force.
It all depended upon the size and complexity of the ship.
Maintenance and repairs were only performed by qualified personnel.

Smaller ships had at least a fully qualified engineer, and there were small workshops on board for running maintenance.
Larger ships like Battle ships obviously had entire teams of engineers.
Air Craft carriers naturally had a mixture of Marine Engineers and Aircraft Engineers with dedicated w/shops.

Boats like PT/MTB boats had a qualified engineer on board.
Submarines were and are deemed to be a boat, and had an engineer with support crew.

There were small facilities in the rearward areas.
And larger dry docks at the nearest country that could provide them.

The navy didn't use special coolant.
Everything was either raw water cooled or keel cooled.
Some smaller boats like PT boats, were perhaps cooled by a heat exchanger with fresh water.
I don't think anything special like Ethylene Glycol would be added due to cost, and it wasn't necessary for effective operation. Also they wouldn't want the secret to fall into enemy hands in the event of capture of the vessel.

At the end of the day everything, absolutely everything came down to cost.

To put things into perspective.
The US Navy even pushed scores of perfectly good aircraft over the side of Air Craft Carriers off the east coast of Australia, simply because it was deemed to be cheaper to dump them overboard, than to take them home to the USA.
 
Back in the 70s, when I was in school, the school maintenance people bought a US Army surplus Jeep. Got it cheap through a State purchase. I don't think it was a WW2 Jeep, but it was certainly a Korean era Jeep.

I was the gear-head on campus. The maintenance crew let me use the school workshop to store my tools and garage my motorcycle there. They called and asked me to help get the old Jeep running.

I do remember that the engine, spark plugs, oil drain and all the related bits were near impossible to service. The spark plug wires were cables and you needed two wrenches (one wrench may have to have a angle on it too) to remove the cables from the distributor cap and spark plugs. The cables were very tough to loosen. I don't recall exactly..but the distributor cap was a bear to remove too.

It took a lot of time to get everything to the point where we could check for spark..replace the points/condenser, change the spark plugs and engine oil..at least a day.

We did get it running..and the engine was very worn. I doubt the oil had been changed very often. No surprise..it was a real pain to work on.

I have to agree with the observation that these old military vehicles were meant to be used and discarded..they did not anticipate running the engines for years and years. They were tough to service.
 
The sealed mil spec drivetrains could be a challenge, but I have worded on everything from MB's/GPW's (WWII Jeeps) to 2A's thru Wranglers, my own '59 F-head CJ5, and modern engines.

IMO, Jeep has had some of the easiest engines and drivetrains to service up until the JK. I'm a Jeep guy though, so it's more of a lifestyle/art than a science.

One exception was the rear two-piece shaft AMC 20 axle if you had to change backing plates. Had one in my 1975 Matador too. Yuk.
 
my dad fell out of a jeep in ww2! he was teaching a philippino girl how to drive. she popped the clutch and he fell out.

ill assume that the jeeps did not get huge miles so axle and trans oils were not a problem unless it got dunked. lubes would have been sent with the food and drained into the dirt. most jeeps were used to cart big wigs around and only got a few miles a day. unfortunately my father is in the last stages of Alzheimer's and would not remember things like oil changes
 
My grandfather was a B-17 mechanic, stationed in England. I was very young when he died years ago. I wish he was still around today. I'd love to hear about these things.
 
I've read that allies and especially the US, had a significant advantage over the germans with tanks and vehicles, because many of the service men grew up around car and tractors, and could do much better field repairs than the average german tank crew.
 
Originally Posted By: Chris142
my dad fell out of a jeep in ww2! he was teaching a philippino girl how to drive. she popped the clutch and he fell out.

ill assume that the jeeps did not get huge miles so axle and trans oils were not a problem unless it got dunked. lubes would have been sent with the food and drained into the dirt. most jeeps were used to cart big wigs around and only got a few miles a day. unfortunately my father is in the last stages of Alzheimer's and would not remember things like oil changes


I remember folks dumping oil in the dirt back in the 70's/80's.

Sucks about your Dad. My Babcia dealt with ten years of Alzheimer's. It was tough on the entire family. God bless you guys.
 
Interesting replies!!! Never thought of drive it until it quits and get another one. My Dad was a tailgunner in a B-24. He said there were tool kits on board for some fixable things but not much else.
 
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I don't remember where I found this link (maybe here on BITOG), but supposedly it's for a translated VW technical manual, ca. 1944
http://www.allworldwars.com/German Volkswagen 1944 Technical Manual.html

Another tidbyte:
A few weeks ago, I was able to tour the Littlefield military vehicle collection, before its transition to the Collings Foundation:
http://www.masslive.com/news/boston/index.ssf/2013/11/silicon_valley_tank_collection.html. Many more tanks and ultra large artifacts like a Scud missle launcher than tanks but there were certainly large trucks as well as jeeps. I saw a lot of O'Reilly's 15W-40 HD oil...

anyway, FYI
Kevin
 
Originally Posted By: oldhp
Interesting replies!!! Never thought of drive it until it quits and get another one. My Dad was a tailgunner in a B-24. He said there were tool kits on board for some fixable things but not much else.


My dad was in the RAAF, and was assigned to an RAF squadron as a Wireless Operator/Air Gunner in Lancasters based in Lincolnshire, England.
The older I get, thinking about him and what I learnt from him, the more my dad knew about mechanical things. He knew way more, and could do more things mechanical than most people from his professional background, which was computer programming back in the 60's and 70's.
He never failed to surprise me.

Back on topic.
The drive it till it drops Philosophy, was a necessity at times depending on hard they were pushing the resources, and how well the supply lines were able to keep up.
Supply lines are what can make or break the efforts of the armed forces.
And they couldn't always get another one due to lack of supplies.
That's why they cannibalized other machines that were US. If they could.
Some machinery was tied together with strands from the barbed fencing wire, or any wire they could find.
They had to be resourceful at all times.

Sometimes they didn't have the luxury of any mechanisation (at all).
like in the mountain range jungles of New Guinea, where if it wasn't for the natives helping the Aussie militia, they couldn't have taught the Japs a lesson about defeat for the first time during the war. Until then the Japs were undefeated on land.

It was a case of adapt, improvise and overcome or you were going to do it extra tough, or die trying to get "the job" done.

They were the most amazing generation.
Born in the depression, with parents that saw WW I, and forged in the only global/total war in history.
No wonder they were terrified of the possibility of an Atomic WW III.
 
Originally Posted By: DB_Cooper
Back in the 70s, when I was in school, the school maintenance people bought a US Army surplus Jeep. Got it cheap through a State purchase. I don't think it was a WW2 Jeep, but it was certainly a Korean era Jeep.

I was the gear-head on campus. The maintenance crew let me use the school workshop to store my tools and garage my motorcycle there. They called and asked me to help get the old Jeep running.

I do remember that the engine, spark plugs, oil drain and all the related bits were near impossible to service. The spark plug wires were cables and you needed two wrenches (one wrench may have to have a angle on it too) to remove the cables from the distributor cap and spark plugs. The cables were very tough to loosen. I don't recall exactly..but the distributor cap was a bear to remove too.

It took a lot of time to get everything to the point where we could check for spark..replace the points/condenser, change the spark plugs and engine oil..at least a day.

We did get it running..and the engine was very worn. I doubt the oil had been changed very often. No surprise..it was a real pain to work on.

I have to agree with the observation that these old military vehicles were meant to be used and discarded..they did not anticipate running the engines for years and years. They were tough to service.


Back in the early 80's I was nearly going to buy an old army surplus Jeep.
After checking it out, my impression was that it would be easy to work on.
Like most things of that era everything appeared to be accessible it was just the way they engineered things back then that made it a pain to work on.
Like you say about the ignition lead terminations at the plug.
But it was a necessity to prevent a failure in service.
They had to be "bulletproof".
 
During my service in the swedish army (1985!) as groupchief in an maintance plutoon (maintance and fuel ) i complained about the quantity of gas we had on our tankers, we could only fill
2 companys but we served 3...the ansver was that there wouldnt
be enough left after a battle to use our fuel.
We had 0w-20 engine oil that went into everything from
small generators to 14 litre scania turbo diesel v8´s, why 0w-20?
- For easy starting when cold, engine life wasent part of the idea.
 
Didn't Jesse James do a special where he went to Iraq to customize a Humvee?

I remember they had to improvise because the transfer case was so messed up it couldn't be serviced.

I may be wrong, but I also think that show was used as evidence to force the US government and DoD to pump up their funding towards better armored vehicles...
 
Methanol was the antifreeze used before ethylene glycol was common. In the '50s both were used. An antifreeze certainly was necessary for any water cooled vehicle in cold winter climates--northern Europe, Northern China, Korea, etc.

Oils were single weight. The SAE first published the winter (W) grade system in 1952, although the military may have had something earlier.
 
Methanol was the antifreeze used before ethylene glycol was common. In the '50s both were used. An antifreeze certainly was necessary for any water cooled vehicle in cold winter climates--northern Europe, Northern China, Korea, etc.

Oil were single weight. The SAE first published the winter (W) grade system in 1952, although the military may have had something earlier.
 
I like the Russian style antifreeze,

build a fire next to or under the engine...

Worked great under the nose of a fighter, unless it was leaking gasoline....
 
I think there are two ways to look at this.

During peace time the British Army vehicles are very well maintained.

And the British forces in Iraq and Afhgan used the same vehicles till the newer vehicles were introduced due to IEDs.

Many of the snatch land rovers were well over 10yrs old.

And the maintenance department at camp bastion was featured on Top Gear a while ago and it was state of the art.

British forces vehicles are rarely on their original engine when they come out of service though.

The recon engines are easily spotted as they paint them a light greeny colour.

I have relatives in the Army and maintenance is pretty by the book.

Cosmetics are less of an issue.


There are many people that buy ex forces vehicles in the UK.

Though obviously that is mostly people buying the Land Rovers.
 
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