ATF

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I think the Copper Deactivator is used to protect the copper metals from corrosion due to the EP additives. How close am I?
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Porcupine73 is closest to the correct answer.

Consider the materials used in an AT. Most components, including the bearings, are made of steel and of course you have the band or clutch plate materials made of cellulose with binders, or made of composite materials; and then there is the case, made of aluminum. There may be a few sleeve bearings of brass or bronze for straight shafts and such (such as the gear selector shaft), but the majority materials are either aluminum or steel.

Now the cooler is usually a copper tank inside the radiator and many external coolers are made of either copper or aluminum as well.

Aluminum cases and coolers are an alloy of aluminum, copper, silicon, and a few other elements.

So one must have a soft metal deactivator to reduce interaction with the copper coolers and the aluminum case.

In addition, any metal that goes into solution in the oil will cause an acceleration in oxidation.

Hence, metal deactivators and anti-oxidants play an important role in the makeup of any AT fluid.

As decribed in the techincal papers in
"Science and Technology of Lubricating Oils and Additives," ATF fluids have Anti-Wear additives but do not contain EP additives.
 
Don't forget the solenoids and electrical components that are used in these things now. Lots of copper in that stuff.
 
But the solenoid windings for the most part are sealed.

You cant have almost pure copper windings exposed to phosphorus and sulfur very long before they short.
 
MolaKule. I have been using something called Militec( www.militec.com )in my transmission. I have been using it for the last 70000 miles. I put it in when the car had 13000 miles on. It immediately made the shifting softer and less noise was also another result. I also put a superchip in this car when it was new, so the strain on the transmission is some 25-30% higher than original. It still shifts perfect. Militec does not change the chemistry in the oil, but it make the metal surface 17 times stiffer(not harder). I have also seen this stuff being used in differentials and manual transmissions. I am very satisfied with this stuff, but I am surprised that so few are using it(or even know about it), because this is made in the US.
 
OK, well let's hope it doesn't change the dynamic friction coefficient or get imbedded in the clutch plate friction materials.
 
"Militec does not change the chemistry in the oil, but it make the metal surface 17 times stiffer(not harder)."

Chloro alkane (parrafin)
Will cause acid build up, Will lower TBN, Will cause corrosion.
bruce
 
MolaKule:

Should I change my ATF at 30k when the OLM/MMS is programmed to throw the code at 60k? The transmissions are sort of weak in the past for my vehicle in which 3 years ago about 10-15% failed due to insufficient lubrication. They put jet packs to shoot the oil in quicker/faster. A lot of people are changing ATF more frequently as cheap insurance. Like I mentioned, the manual and now the OLM/MMS is set at 60k but previous gens, although maybe a different engine, has had it as high as 100k if not more for tranny fluid changes. I guess an inherent question I have is how do I see if the ATF is losing its protective additives either via the dipstick or some operating observations. IS there any harm I can actually do my changing it out in half the perscribed time then the manufaturer recommends (from 60k to 30k)?
 
I would change out as much as possible at 30K regardless of the OLM/MMS. Changing out a bit every 5-10k is ok as well.

Only a UOA would show trends in wear or oil degradation.

Terry Dyson can help you there.
 
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I think poor enginering/materials is the main reason transmissions have failed.


Well Transmission are not made to last a lifetime.

They have many moving parts and sooner or later there is going to be wear.

For all the moving parts in a AT, Im surprised they last as long as they do.
 
Originally Posted By: David1
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I think poor enginering/materials is the main reason transmissions have failed.


Well Transmission are not made to last a lifetime.

They have many moving parts and sooner or later there is going to be wear.

For all the moving parts in a AT, Im surprised they last as long as they do.



True, what I was referring to was premature failures, or failures that occurred before the warranty period had expired.

What I should have said was, "I think poor enginering/materials is the main reason transmissions fail prematurely.'
 
Originally Posted By: T-Keith
Use for hydraulic purposes.
Lubrication for gears.
Cooling and heat trasnfer.
Transmiting power in TC.
Friction modification for clutch.

Basically the same as above.
 
Quote:
... and not from overheating the oil?


Most certainly and no one said it wouldn't.

ATF if a special hydraulic oil for the following purposes:
Lubrication for gears.
Cooling and heat trasnfer.
Transmiting torque via the TC.
Friction modification for clutch packs, bands, TCC.

If the oil is overheated, it oxidizes, chemical changes to additives occur, and the fluid won't protect the transmission.

If insufficient cooling prevails, clutch plates can overheat and distort, clutch material can break apart and disperse, and valves and clutch surfaces can be varnished.
 
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