Toyota brand cartridge filters OK?

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Well, it seems like it to me too of course, but considering none of the filters have a 100% rating, that means that none of the filters catch all of the particles all of the time. And conversely none of the filters let all the particles through all the time either, so really my question was about the efficiency rating. Is 50% really statistically or significantly worse than 98%? Eventually all the filters will catch all the particles.

This graph comes up a lot and so does discussion about the Honda and Toyota ratings. I just haven't ever seen anything that says it is important.

Originally Posted By: jonnythan
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Can you explain why that is bad?


Seems to me that having more 20 micron particles in your oil would, at the very least, not be beneficial.
 
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Eventually all the filters will catch all the particles.


I don't think that's at all true. It might not be important, but if you've got to choose, it makes sense to choose the one that has better filtering efficiency all else being equal.
 
I haven't read the 4548-12 spec - is that multipass? None of my cars have liked an ultra high efficiency filter - and I cant explain why.
Logically If its got a Bypass and you are a frisky diver the ultra high efficiency may not protect you against "flotsam washout" during bypass events - which will cause bearing streaking. Doe this happened moreso than with a med efficiency filter. I have not seen any comprehensive tests that positively ABSOLUTELY drop a marker when a bypass event is occurring.
 
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Here's another thought, wouldn't the particles that the filter catches every time the oil cycles through create an extra layer to prevent more particles of same or larger size from entering the engine again. Hence, increasing the filtering efficiency of the filter over time.
 
As long as the efficiency is greater than zero it will, right? It's a statistical rating that is averaged over time.

It really comes down to the time factor and the number of particles present, plus what size does damage and how quickly. In other words, how damaging is a particular particle size and how quickly do you need to sequester it in the filter? I have never seen that data presented anywhere.

Originally Posted By: jonnythan
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Eventually all the filters will catch all the particles.


I don't think that's at all true. It might not be important, but if you've got to choose, it makes sense to choose the one that has better filtering efficiency all else being equal.
 
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I haven't read the 4548-12 spec - is that multipass?


From FRAM's website in thier FAQ section:
http://fram.com/learn_more/frequently_asked_questions


Q: How are filters tested?

A: Filter Engineering Measurements. Measuring efficiency must be based on the premise that the filter is present on the engine to remove harmful particles and thus protect the engine from wear. Filter efficiency is the measurement of the filter’s performance in preventing harmful particles from reaching the wearing surfaces of the engine. The most widely used method of measurement is Multi-Pass Efficiency test developed by the ISO (International Standards Organization). This and other standard industry tests used to evaluate filters are described below.

1.Multipass Efficiency. This procedure is specified in ISO 4548-12 and is the most recently developed. It involves a newer test technology in that automatic particle counters are used for analysis instead of simply weighing the dirt. The advantage of this is that the particle removal performance of the filter can be found for different size particles throughout the filter’s life. The efficiency determined in this test method is an "instantaneous" efficiency, because the number of particles before and after the filter are counted at the same instant. These numbers are then compared to generate an efficiency measurement.
2.Filter Capacity is also measured in a the ISO 4548-12 test method. To create a successful filter, a balance must be found between high efficiency and long life. Neither a long life filter with low efficiency nor a high efficiency filter with short life is useful in the field. The contaminant holding capacity as defined in ISO 4548-12 is the amount of contaminant removed and held by a filter from the oil during a constantly recirculating flow of contaminated oil. The test is terminated when a predetermined pressure drop across the filter is reached, typically at 8 psid. This pressure drop is associated with the setting of a filter by-pass valve.

3.Mechanical and Durability tests. Oil filters are also subjected to numerous tests to assure the integrity of the filter and its components during vehicle operating conditions. These tests include Burst Pressure, Impulse Fatigue, Vibration, Relief Valve and Anti-Drainback Valve operation, and Hot Oil Durability specified in other ISO and SAE test methods.
 
Originally Posted By: HKPolice
It's probably because of EPA mpg requirements. Better filtering media will always cause more back pressure which eats into mpg.
Dude, that's wack.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I haven't read the 4548-12 spec - is that multipass?


From FRAM's website in thier FAQ section:
http://fram.com/learn_more/frequently_asked_questions




1.Multipass Efficiency. This procedure is specified in ISO 4548-12 and is the most recently developed. It involves a newer test technology in that automatic particle counters ... The efficiency determined in this test method is an "instantaneous" efficiency, because the number of particles before and after the filter are counted at the same instant. These numbers are then compared to generate an efficiency measurement.


Maybe I'm brain dead this afternoon (due to work overload) but how is this multipass if its instantaneous pre/post count?

Ken
 
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
I haven't read the 4548-12 spec - is that multipass?


From FRAM's website in thier FAQ section:
http://fram.com/learn_more/frequently_asked_questions

1.Multipass Efficiency. This procedure is specified in ISO 4548-12 and is the most recently developed. It involves a newer test technology in that automatic particle counters ... The efficiency determined in this test method is an "instantaneous" efficiency, because the number of particles before and after the filter are counted at the same instant. These numbers are then compared to generate an efficiency measurement.


Maybe I'm brain dead this afternoon (due to work overload) but how is this multipass if its instantaneous pre/post count?

Ken


They simply mean they can look at the measurements and see "real-time" efficiency by seeing the "instantaneous" particle count data before and after the filter.
 
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