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#3350815 - 04/23/14 07:04 AM 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles
SS1970chrysler Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 1346
Loc: PA
351M V8 2bbl/auto- 34,700 miles
Fill- QSGB 10w-30
Duration- 2800 miles (1 year)
qts added- 0

"We found a lot of fuel in the previous sample from this LTD, but that cleared up nicely this time; the flashpoint was high enough to show no significant fuel dilution. It's a bit surprising, then, that the viscosity stayed as low as it did in this report, since we thought last time that the fuel dilution was the most likely cause for the lower viscosity. This sample also saw an increase in iron, showing more wear at steel parts, although at least lead (from bearings) didn't go any higher. All in all, no real improvements, but not
that much worse either. Check back next oil."

Aluminum- 6
Chromium- 1
Iron- 78
Copper- 4
Lead- 24
Tin- 2
Molybdenum- 109
Nickel- 0
Manganese- 1
Silver- 0
Titanium- 0
Potassium- 7
Boron- 45
Silicon- 10
Sodium- 10
Calcium- 1979
Magnesium- 13
Phosphorus- 816
Zinc- 880
Barium- 1

SUS visc@ 210F- 53.8
CST visc@ 100C- 8.42
Flashpoint in F- 410
Fuel%- <0.5
Antifreeze%- 0
Water%- o
Insolubles%-0.2
_________________________
93 Towncar- PYB 5w-30+M.Craft
93 CrownVic- QSGB 10w-30+M.Craft
78 LTD- S.Pro XHD30+ProTec

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#3350884 - 04/23/14 08:40 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
Chris142 Offline


Registered: 06/05/03
Posts: 12754
Loc: apple valley, ca
you should start your own iron mine!im thinking that your losing a cam lobe,was pretty common in the late 70's from the big 3. have you tried a 15w40?
_________________________
02 Wrangler durablend 10w40
87 F250 Diesel Mystic 15w50
04 Tahoe super-s 5w30
Z400 Lucas 10w30
KLR250 Maxima 10w40
Polaris Trailblazer delo 5w40

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#3351195 - 04/23/14 03:01 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
snowflake Offline


Registered: 12/29/12
Posts: 101
Loc: New Mexico
aside from your wear metals the oil's actual additive package looks pretty good.

How is the car operated?

Thank you for posting, don't see a lot on the oldies smile


Edited by snowflake (04/23/14 03:03 PM)
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89 F150 5.0
89 Isuzu Amigo (complete overhaul this winter!)

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#3351438 - 04/23/14 08:28 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
salv Offline


Registered: 04/21/11
Posts: 1226
Loc: Morrisonville, NY
I think Delo 15w40 may be a nice choice for this vehicle. If you would like to stay with a PCMO, step up to a 10w40.
_________________________
2003 Trailblazer: Castrol GTX Magnatec 5w30 L25288
1999 Ford Taurus: Supertech HM 10w30 FL-910S

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#3351631 - 04/24/14 02:57 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
Merkava_4 Offline


Registered: 01/30/07
Posts: 11676
Loc: Clovis, CA
That engine desperately wants thicker oil.

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#3351703 - 04/24/14 06:43 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
SS1970chrysler Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 1346
Loc: PA
This one's my mother's car and she only drives it about 3 miles to work and back. I've used a 50/50 of leftover QS defy 10w-30 and Service Pro XHD30 for the new fill.
_________________________
93 Towncar- PYB 5w-30+M.Craft
93 CrownVic- QSGB 10w-30+M.Craft
78 LTD- S.Pro XHD30+ProTec

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#3352080 - 04/24/14 04:06 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
vintageant Offline


Registered: 10/27/06
Posts: 280
Loc: Florida, USA
Agree with others. Diesel 15/40, CI, if you can find, is preferable over CJ
_________________________
1925 Alvis HDEO 15W40
1937 Alvis Speed 25 HDEO 15W40
1970 VW Peking to Paris Rally Beetle HDEO 15W40 w LM Ceratec
2003 Honda Accord dino 5W20

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#3352195 - 04/24/14 07:24 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 10937
Loc: OH
This doesn't look good, but we have nothing to compare it with.
It may be that all old Ford 351s (C,M or W) shed metals like this.
Good to see a post from you, though.
Haven't seen that much of you since the epic Granada thread.
_________________________
12 Accord LX 36K PP 0W-20
09 Forester 67K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 144K GOil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 101K Meijer Syn 5W-20
95 BMW 318iC 150K Defy 10W-40

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#3352306 - 04/24/14 09:05 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
aquariuscsm Offline


Registered: 12/30/06
Posts: 11679
Loc: South Texas,USA
Wonder how well a classic car formula 20W50 would do?
_________________________
1996 Nissan 300ZX 5-speed,Arctic Pearl(#175 of 300)
Syntec 10W40/Fram Ultra
Amsoil MTG(tranny)
Amsoil 80W90 GL5(rear diff)
Mobil 1 ATF
Redline Water Wetter

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#3352376 - 04/24/14 10:20 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: aquariuscsm]
Merkava_4 Offline


Registered: 01/30/07
Posts: 11676
Loc: Clovis, CA
A 20W-50 would do wonders for that Ford. My 1978 Cadillac loved Exxon 20W-50.

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#3352517 - 04/25/14 07:17 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
bigt61 Offline


Registered: 02/12/13
Posts: 1788
Loc: Virginia
Haha - a 36 year old car with 30k miles and you guys freak over 78ppm iron? Man, at that rate, it may not make it another 36 years and 30k miles. Better switch to some Pure GTL Super Synthetic Hi Tri Nuclear Moly Wonder oil to keep this beast alive! Funny stuff - run a jug of SuperTech 10W-30 (or whatever else you have laying around for the last decade) in it every few years and call it a day.
_________________________
92 Suburban 2500 7.4L 58k M1_5w30 5yr OCI
99 Olds Aurora 4.0L 91K M1_5w30 5yr OCI
13 Dodge Dart 2.0L 29k PP 0w20 OLM OCI
70 Camaro 5.7L 59k

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#3352788 - 04/25/14 11:53 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Merkava_4]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 13624
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
A 20W-50 would do wonders for that Ford. My 1978 Cadillac loved Exxon 20W-50.

With his mom's short trips, 20w-50 would be pointless. The three mile trips are the biggest danger this engine is facing.
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 coupe - Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40, Wix 51358
1984 F-150 4.9L six - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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#3353291 - 04/25/14 08:11 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Garak]
Merkava_4 Offline


Registered: 01/30/07
Posts: 11676
Loc: Clovis, CA
Originally Posted By: Garak
With his mom's short trips, 20w-50 would be pointless. The three mile trips are the biggest danger this engine is facing.


That engine needs thicker oil at all temps; from startup all the way to whatever the oil temp is at the end of three miles. If there was a way to get engine assembly lube in there between the lifters and the cam lobes at every startup, that would be ideal. 20W-50 would be an excellent match for that old Detroit iron.

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#3353315 - 04/25/14 08:35 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Merkava_4]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 13624
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
But even a 0w-20 would be thicker in those three miles than a 20w-50 would be at operating temperature. wink 20w-50 isn't a good match for much of anything, unless something is worn out to high heaven.
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 coupe - Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40, Wix 51358
1984 F-150 4.9L six - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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#3353478 - 04/25/14 11:29 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Garak]
Merkava_4 Offline


Registered: 01/30/07
Posts: 11676
Loc: Clovis, CA
Originally Posted By: Garak
20w-50 isn't a good match for much of anything, unless something is worn out to high heaven.


It was an excellent match for my Dad's Cadillac DeVille with the 7.0L V8. The engine ran much smoother and quieter on Superflo 20W-50 than it did on VWB 10W-30. The engine wasn't worn out either, it only had 15K on it after a rebuild. It ran so quiet on 20W-50, all I could hear was the air being sucked into the carburetor and the fan belts going around. Add that sound with a very slight gurgle exhaust note from that beautiful V8 and it was music to my ears. The car would lay a patch of rubber 25ft long on the pavement ... and that was with stock 2:73 gears. I miss that car dearly.

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#3353701 - 04/26/14 09:29 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Merkava_4]
jayg Offline


Registered: 10/04/12
Posts: 422
Loc: Acworth, GA
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Garak
20w-50 isn't a good match for much of anything, unless something is worn out to high heaven.


It was an excellent match for my Dad's Cadillac DeVille with the 7.0L V8. The engine ran much smoother and quieter on Superflo 20W-50 than it did on VWB 10W-30. The engine wasn't worn out either, it only had 15K on it after a rebuild. It ran so quiet on 20W-50, all I could hear was the air being sucked into the carburetor and the fan belts going around. Add that sound with a very slight gurgle exhaust note from that beautiful V8 and it was music to my ears. The car would lay a patch of rubber 25ft long on the pavement ... and that was with stock 2:73 gears. I miss that car dearly.


Pretty much all your advice includes "sounded better or ran smoother". No real data. Running a 20w50 will not make a a difference in a old car that is driven 3 miles. Fuel dilution from a carburetor is more prone to do the same thing to any oil that is ran. Any oil changed at 3k miles intervals would look pretty much the same. The key with this motor is run whatever you have laying around but change it often.
_________________________
'14 Jeep Wrangler Sport S 6sp 10k OCI PYB 5w20
'73 Datsun 240Z 4sp (AutoX) Vintage QS 10w40
'91 Honda CB250 Nighthawk (Cafe modded)VBB 20w50


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#3354199 - 04/26/14 09:27 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: fdcg27]
SS1970chrysler Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 1346
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
This doesn't look good, but we have nothing to compare it with.
It may be that all old Ford 351s (C,M or W) shed metals like this.
Good to see a post from you, though.
Haven't seen that much of you since the epic Granada thread.

yep, I'm still around. Haven't posted much as driving the Caddy and my new shorter commute isn't very exciting. I'll be doing one more UOA on the caddy as I'll be sticking with 5-6k OCI's on that one until it's dead or not worth running. I'll also add an upcoming treat: a UOA on my backup driver: 63 Chrysler. It's had the Family dollar 10w-40 I used for cleaning in for a year now.
As for this LTD, I'm slowly scaling up the oil grades until I find something it won't kill, but still able to start in winter. Cold starts are a factor on this car.
_________________________
93 Towncar- PYB 5w-30+M.Craft
93 CrownVic- QSGB 10w-30+M.Craft
78 LTD- S.Pro XHD30+ProTec

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#3355941 - 04/28/14 06:13 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: Merkava_4]
Garak Offline


Registered: 12/05/09
Posts: 13624
Loc: Regina, Saskatchewan, Canada
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
It was an excellent match for my Dad's Cadillac DeVille with the 7.0L V8. The engine ran much smoother and quieter on Superflo 20W-50 than it did on VWB 10W-30.

Unfortunately for the smoothness/sound tests, there are no sound or smoothness benchmarks in any API, ILSAC, ACEA, or manufacturers' specifications. wink
_________________________
Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 coupe - Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40, Wix 51358
1984 F-150 4.9L six - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515

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#3360544 - 05/03/14 09:14 AM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: SS1970chrysler]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 10937
Loc: OH
A 10W-40 might hold up a little better and would still allow for relatively easy winter starts.
I used that grade in a variety of engines back in the day and never had problems with winter starts.
_________________________
12 Accord LX 36K PP 0W-20
09 Forester 67K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 144K GOil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 101K Meijer Syn 5W-20
95 BMW 318iC 150K Defy 10W-40

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#3362902 - 05/05/14 09:23 PM Re: 1978 Ford LTD 351M QSGB 10w-30 2800 miles [Re: fdcg27]
SS1970chrysler Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 1346
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
A 10W-40 might hold up a little better and would still allow for relatively easy winter starts.
I used that grade in a variety of engines back in the day and never had problems with winter starts.

That may be next. This fill was 2 leftover qts of 10w-30 Defy, and the rest was my free XHD30. I also had to fill the car before results could come back. I'd thought about T5 for this one, but would it be a waste with no miles getting put on it really?
_________________________
93 Towncar- PYB 5w-30+M.Craft
93 CrownVic- QSGB 10w-30+M.Craft
78 LTD- S.Pro XHD30+ProTec

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