As If Nitrogen Filling Is Special?

[Mr_Joe]

Yes I bought a new 2014 Sierra the other day. Besides wasting time trying to push extended warranties, the 'financial person' was acting like their 'free' nitrogen fill was something special. Yes, I'll take it if it's free, but for a guy who checks pressure routinely, plus we already get 78% nitrogen, it's more a gimmick. I let her go on a bit about it, but my mind could hardly take more.

Is there anyone out there who would pay for a nitrogen fill? Maybe there's something I don't know, it's happened before.

 

[Shannow]

yeah, they use it on airliners, nascar and formula1 seems to be the gist of those who want to hand their money over for next to no benefit.

 

[CharBaby]

I would never buy it because I've never had it(knowingly).

 

[Barkleymut]

I would pay for Argon or Helium, but not Nitrogen

 

[eljefino]

If they don't remove the wheels from the new vehicles, do they let the air out down to zero then refill with nitrogen? How is that good for the tire?

I can see nitrogen being an easy step in the filling of replacement tires, but...

 

[troberts]

That was my conclusion after evaluating the cost of equipment to produce it in a shop and the pricing for customers. Yes, pure (hard to produce)nitrogen creeps through tire bladders at a slower rate than plain old air, it is dry and potentially reduces corrosion inside alloy wheels, and doesn't expand and contract as much with temperature changes. Thus, its use on airliners and race cars. Bleh... Dealers didn't like my conclusion since they're constantly trying to get the last dollar out of a car deal or maximize the intake from each service visit. I'm glad to be out of that war.....

 

[Charlie1935]

Just tell them you want 78% nitrogen and see what they say.

 

[Barkleymut]

Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
Just tell them you want 78% nitrogen and see what they say.


now that is funny....bet you get a blank stare on that one.

 

[pcoxe]

Seems like Argon would be better than nitrogen for the reasons given. It's a denser atom and totally inert.

 

[gofast182]

My wife's MDX came with nitrogen-filled tires. Last year we had to patch the RR due to a nail. After this winter with the crazy cold temperatures the only tire that ever set off the TPMS was the RR which was patched and refilled with "air".

 

[mrsilv04]

Originally Posted By: gofast182
My wife's MDX came with nitrogen-filled tires. Last year we had to patch the RR due to a nail. After this winter with the crazy cold temperatures the only tire that ever set off the TPMS was the RR which was patched and refilled with "air".


You might have a leak around the patch, or a leak somewhere on the bead.

 

[901Memphis]

Nitrogen should theoretically have less corrosion issues.

 

[exranger06]

Do they pull a vacuum on the tires before filling with nitrogen? If not, there's always at least a little "regular air" in them.

 

[chainblu]

When I worked at an tire shop years ago, sometimes when a customer asked me if we could put nitrogen in tires, I would tell them that we have a blend that we put in all of the tires. I would say that we found it was more economical to use about an 80/20 nitro/oxy blend and we have a big green tank in the back room (the color of our air compressor).

They were usually pleased that they were getting a 'good' deal.

The best part was that I was telling the truth.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: chainblu
When I worked at an tire shop years ago, sometimes when a customer asked me if we could put nitrogen in tires, I would tell them that we have a blend that we put in all of the tires. I would say that we found it was more economical to use about an 80/20 nitro/oxy blend and we have a big green tank in the back room (the color of our air compressor).

They were usually pleased that they were getting a 'good' deal.

The best part was that I was telling the truth.


LOL! Good one!

The "membrane" units that tire shops use are basically a cartridge style molecular sieve that traps and vents most of the atmospheric gasses, and allows mostly N2 gas to pass through it. Depending on the pressure and flowrate, you're still getting several percent impurities with these systems anyway. Instead of ~78% N2, you might be getting mid-high 90%, then figure on the air, moisture that was in the tire anyway..

 

[A_Harman]

The only advantage of Nitrogen filling is the cylinders of Nitrogen will contain no moisture, which is what causes corrosion of the wheel inside the tire, and high variation in pressure depending on how much of the water is liquid or vapor. There is no difference between the change in pressure versus temperature if a tire is filled with dry Nitrogen or dry air. Some shops don't maintain their compressed air systems well, and that's how water gets into tires.

 

[Papa Bear]

Originally Posted By: Barkleymut
I would pay for Argon or Helium, but not Nitrogen


If I paid for Helium would that reduce my unsprung weight ??

I'd probably be spinning the tires all the time as they would hardly be touching the ground ....

 

[SHOZ]

About the only advantage N2 would have is it has no moisture in it.

 

[Roob]

I get it for free and I'll take the advantages it offers.
Here's some info from getnitrogen.org.


Fundamentally; air, oxygen and nitrogen will all behave exactly the same in terms of pressure change for each 10 degrees of temperature change. However temperature alone is not the whole story.

Ambient air contains moisture, nitrogen does not. If moisture is present it contributes to a greater change in pressure simply because at lower temperatures water condenses to become a liquid. The liquid form of water occupies very little volume and contributes only a negligible pressure to the tire. But at higher temperatures, such as those in a running tire, water evaporates inside the tire and becomes a gas which increases pressure in the tire.

Ambient air contains about 21% oxygen. Oxygen’s smaller molecular size allows it to permeate through the rubber of the tire. By inflating with nitrogen, which is much less permeable than oxygen, the pressure changes due to oxygen loss are greatly reduced.

The racing industry is correct; nitrogen is more predictable. Because nitrogen is dry it has no moisture to contribute extra pressure changes with temperature. Because nitrogen permeates out much slower than oxygen pressure changes due to that leakage are almost eliminated compared with ambient air.

-Use whichever, just as long as your tires are properly inflated...

 

[paulswagelock]

Was told once that air would leak out faster than nitrogen.
Told the guy that if that is the case, each time it leaked some out and I refilled, I was getting closer to pure nitrogen since obviously the nitrogen wouldn't leak out per his claim, just everything else. Also suggested he contact Praxair about his new invention for separating nitrogen - car tires.

He didn't get it.