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#3332808 - 04/03/14 09:56 PM Honda K series cam galling issue....
gregk24 Online   content


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 3656
Loc: FL, USA
I was just doing some research on this hoping to find an answer but didnt find one anywhere. Was this problem ever rectified? I know the early K24's had this problem, and even some J35's in the Pilots. Some said a thicker oil was needed, some said it was a problem from the factory. Has anybody experienced this issue? And did Honda FIX the issue or is it still going on as the miles add up.
_________________________
2006 Honda Accord 2.4 130K
TGMO 0w20
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2005 Chevy Uplander 3.5 124K
VML SB 5w30
Fram Ultra

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#3332821 - 04/03/14 10:12 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
Brule Offline


Registered: 11/12/12
Posts: 422
Loc: St. Louis, Mo
The cam galling was supposed to be an issue on the K20 of the '02-'05 civic si as well. I sold mine at 232K miles and although it was consuming about a quart per 1000 miles the cams were as good as one could expect at that mileage. I suspect some were getting the cam galling due to oil starvation by letting their oil run low...only my opinion, though.
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#3332826 - 04/03/14 10:16 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: Brule]
gregk24 Online   content


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 3656
Loc: FL, USA
Originally Posted By: Brule
The cam galling was supposed to be an issue on the K20 of the '02-'05 civic si as well. I sold mine at 232K miles and although it was consuming about a quart per 1000 miles the cams were as good as one could expect at that mileage. I suspect some were getting the cam galling due to oil starvation by letting their oil run low...only my opinion, though.


That seems like a lot of consumption, even for that mileage. How did you treat the car? And what weight of oil did you use through its life? Syn, dino?
_________________________
2006 Honda Accord 2.4 130K
TGMO 0w20
Fram Ultra

2005 Chevy Uplander 3.5 124K
VML SB 5w30
Fram Ultra

1991 Buick Park Avenue 3.8 116K
MSHM SB 10w30
Fram TG

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#3332837 - 04/03/14 10:25 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
JOD Offline


Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 3145
Loc: PNW/WA
I'm not sure I've ever actually seen or heard of this on a K24, but with UOA's every 3K I'd think you'd catch it... Otherwise, it will certainly be visible during a valve adjustment (which you should probably have done if you haven't already).

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#3332859 - 04/03/14 10:41 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: JOD]
gregk24 Online   content


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 3656
Loc: FL, USA
Originally Posted By: JOD
I'm not sure I've ever actually seen or heard of this on a K24, but with UOA's every 3K I'd think you'd catch it... Otherwise, it will certainly be visible during a valve adjustment (which you should probably have done if you haven't already).


Well, one was performed around 100K at the dealer. So I never saw anything. Im not necessarily concerned about my vehicle, although if its something that still exists I would take precautionary measures.
_________________________
2006 Honda Accord 2.4 130K
TGMO 0w20
Fram Ultra

2005 Chevy Uplander 3.5 124K
VML SB 5w30
Fram Ultra

1991 Buick Park Avenue 3.8 116K
MSHM SB 10w30
Fram TG

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#3332885 - 04/03/14 11:24 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
Brule Offline


Registered: 11/12/12
Posts: 422
Loc: St. Louis, Mo
Originally Posted By: gregk24

That seems like a lot of consumption, even for that mileage. How did you treat the car? And what weight of oil did you use through its life? Syn, dino?


I drove it not exactly gently for the last 112k miles. It was consuming from the start...1.5 qt/1000mi. to 1 qt/1000 by the end. Up to around 185k miles all I ever used was M1 or O'Reilly syn 5w20. After that I experimented with TropArtic, Castrol HM, and even Amsoil with the same results. I was generally running 5w30 at the end...but even that couldn't help with the consumption.
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#3332892 - 04/03/14 11:40 PM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: Brule]
01_celica_gt Offline


Registered: 07/29/13
Posts: 1289
Loc: St. Louis, MO
Originally Posted By: Brule
Originally Posted By: gregk24

That seems like a lot of consumption, even for that mileage. How did you treat the car? And what weight of oil did you use through its life? Syn, dino?


I drove it not exactly gently for the last 112k miles. It was consuming from the start...1.5 qt/1000mi. to 1 qt/1000 by the end. Up to around 185k miles all I ever used was M1 or O'Reilly syn 5w20. After that I experimented with TropArtic, Castrol HM, and even Amsoil with the same results. I was generally running 5w30 at the end...but even that couldn't help with the consumption.


"It was by design per honda" I read that consistently on all rsx forums, there was maybe 1 or 2 people who reported low consumption to none, everyone else was 1 qt every 1000 miles, I read about 30 pages on about 3 different forums when I was doing research before buying a car.
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#3332937 - 04/04/14 02:11 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
Tegger Online   content


Registered: 03/20/06
Posts: 1670
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: gregk24
I know the early K24's had this problem, and even some J35's in the Pilots.

How do you know that?

All I find in my extensive Honda documentation (which stops partway through 2010, unfortunately) is TSB 08-032. This TSB discusses a problem that affects only two dozen Canadian-built '08 Civic SI's with K20 engines. In that case, incorrect assembly led to insufficient lubrication, excessive heat buildup, and scoring of the camshaft.
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#3332998 - 04/04/14 06:31 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
Hokiefyd Offline


Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 12528
Loc: North Carolina
You can find a lot of anecdotal information on the internet about this in the K24s. It seems to affect the earlier ones...meaning prior to about 2004. I don't know if Honda made a design or materials change to the camshafts or not. I don't know if it was ever a real problem or not. I do know that mine look peachy. So there's some more anecdotal evidence.
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2008 Honda CR-V EX-L (Shell 5W-30)
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#3333047 - 04/04/14 07:32 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
Miller88 Offline


Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 8499
Loc: Onondaga County
Why would someone design an engine to burn oil?

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#3333087 - 04/04/14 08:14 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
propuckstopper Offline


Registered: 03/05/08
Posts: 54
Loc: MB, Canada
Here is a link to my story. To this day, the engine still ticks like a bugger but it hasn't died. It now has around 175,000 miles on the clock.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/1533554/1
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#3333119 - 04/04/14 09:01 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: gregk24]
ARCOgraphite Offline


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 9112
Loc: N.H, U.S.A.
So Honda engines aren't all made by the hand of the divine?
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#3333120 - 04/04/14 09:03 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: propuckstopper]
gregk24 Online   content


Registered: 04/13/13
Posts: 3656
Loc: FL, USA
Originally Posted By: propuckstopper
Here is a link to my story. To this day, the engine still ticks like a bugger but it hasn't died. It now has around 175,000 miles on the clock.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/1533554/1


So you never changed out the camshaft? What oil have you used since the issue started? And how long has it been galled? Also, I just listened to your recording of the sound, and it sounds a lot like piston slap. Does the noise go away when warm?


Edited by gregk24 (04/04/14 09:16 AM)
_________________________
2006 Honda Accord 2.4 130K
TGMO 0w20
Fram Ultra

2005 Chevy Uplander 3.5 124K
VML SB 5w30
Fram Ultra

1991 Buick Park Avenue 3.8 116K
MSHM SB 10w30
Fram TG

Top
#3333144 - 04/04/14 09:52 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: Miller88]
Hokiefyd Offline


Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 12528
Loc: North Carolina
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Why would someone design an engine to burn oil?


I think that was a probably a mischaracterization of an acceptable oil consumption specification. Most manufacturers' specification is less than 1 quart per 1,000 miles. I think someone misspoke if they claimed that Honda engines are designed to burn 1 quart per 1,000 miles.

If they are, then our two are way out of tolerance. Neither one uses a measurable amount of oil.
_________________________
Cheers,
Jason

2008 Honda CR-V EX-L (Shell 5W-30)
2005 Acura MDX Touring (VNG 5W-20)

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#3333184 - 04/04/14 10:45 AM Re: Honda K series cam galling issue.... [Re: Hokiefyd]
Miller88 Offline


Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 8499
Loc: Onondaga County
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: Miller88
Why would someone design an engine to burn oil?


I think that was a probably a mischaracterization of an acceptable oil consumption specification. Most manufacturers' specification is less than 1 quart per 1,000 miles. I think someone misspoke if they claimed that Honda engines are designed to burn 1 quart per 1,000 miles.

If they are, then our two are way out of tolerance. Neither one uses a measurable amount of oil.


In a post a few months back, I mentioned a friend of mine that went 11000 miles on valvoline nextgen oil in a 2005 J30. He never checked it and when I checked it for him, it was still at the full line.

Honda makes good engines. That's why I got a bit confused when it was said they designed it to burn oil.

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