Oversized Version of PH3593A (Purolator L14459)

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I just purchased a 2004 Chrysler Sebring Coupe with the 3.0L V6 Engine. The applications indexes that I've looked at to date call for a Fram PH3593A/Purolator L14459 or equivalent filter. This filter is roughly the size of a Campbell's soup can. Can anybody give me part number for an oversized version of this filter? Patman do still have that Purolator catalog?
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Thanks in advance!
 
quote:

Scott_in_WI:
I just purchased a 2004 Chrysler Sebring Coupe with the 3.0L V6 Engine. The applications indexes that I've looked at to date call for a Fram PH3593A/Purolator L14459 or equivalent filter. This filter is roughly the size of a Campbell's soup can. Can anybody give me part number for an oversized version of this filter?


Its thread is M20 x 1.5 and it bypasses at 11-14 psi. It depends on how much room you have and the size of the mating surface as to how large you can go. *Slightly* larger ones include AC PF1230 and Purolator L24458.
 
Other filters that may work without modifcation are the Purolator various models ending in "14619", or WIX & NAPA models ending in "1626", or other brands adhering to the Fram numbering system that carry the number "3985". These filters, too, bypass in the 11-13psi range, but are the same physical size as PH16s - the "short" version of the PH8A/FL-1A. However, though the exit port diameter and thread pitch are identical to the 3593A's, the gasket is slightly greater in diameter. You'd have to test fit one on your engine with the mounting base oiled lightly and the gasket dry to verify weather there's sufficient contact width to seal. (Where the gasket wets with oil indicates the contact footprint. If at least half the gasket cross-section width makes contact, it would probably be safe to use.) They work great on my Hyundai 2.7L V6, but the oil filter mounting base cross section on that motor is generous.

[ August 08, 2004, 07:14 PM: Message edited by: Ray H ]
 
I have the 2002 version of your car and engine, Scott. The PureOne PL24458 is the way to go, and works well. It is simply a 1" longer version of the L/PL14459, with identical internals. The PureOne media was also the finest filtering in Grease's Mercruiser study, capturing down to 11 microns. Media areas in square inches:

L14459: 113
PL14459: 116
L24458: 174
PL24458: 198

The "stock" Wix/Napa Gold #51064 filter isn't bad either, at 150 sq in. In comparison, the Bosch #3312 has a pathetic 81 sq in. For what it's worth, these are also common Honda applications.
 
OK, I did some digging today. Here's what I found. First Baldwin has some great documents on their website, one which lists the weight and (more importantly) the volume of all their filters, and another which is basically a "master list" of their gaskets, o-rings, and filters by thread size. The Baldwin B7042 has the following specs and will fit my new Sebring perfectly without any modifications (the filter "landing" on the Sebring is 3 1/8" in dia).

Canister OD: 3.69"
Canister Ht: 5.38"
Thread: M20X1.5
Gasket OD: 2.81"
Gasket ID: 2.45"
Filter Vol: 1.53qts
ADV: Yes
BPV: 14psi

Other than physical size, the specs are identical to the OEM filter. This engine has a 4.5qt sump, so the nearly full quart of additional capacity will be very welcome.

Other equivalent filters include:
-Purolator L34480
-Wix 51324
-Fram PH2921

What do you think, any downsides to this?
 
Cool! Excellent detective work, Scott. This may be a great find in that it would apply to many Hondas as well. Interestingly, the Baldwin mainly fits Peugeots from the 1980s, while the applications for the Wix 51324 are for various domestic pickup trucks and cars. The thread is correct, an ADBV is present, 14 psi bypass is fine, and it's made for a gasoline automotive engine, so all that falls into place. Plus, the Baldwin had one of the finer filtering medias in Grease's Mercruiser study. The Wix is 3.663" dia x 4.354 length, which isn't vastly bigger than a Purolator 24458 at approximately 3.13" dia x 3.94" length, so I'd just assume stick with the PureOne PL24458 than try that particular Wix. But the Baldwin is 5.4" long! The Purolator L34480 (no PureOne version available) is 3.5" dia x 5.45" length, 15 psi bypass, no gasket size info available.

You stated "The Baldwin will fit my new Sebring perfectly without any modifications..." Did you actually spin it onto the engine stud, or is this just going by catalog spec's? That's the ultimate test of course, but I don't see any obvious issues with the paper spec's unless the B7042 has an especially convex or concave base plate, creating unforeseen problems. For what it's worth, here's the Baldwin gasket spec's (provided by you) and same for two "stock" replacement filters (~ = approximate, my measurements):

Oversize Baldwin B7042: 2.45" ID x 2.81" OD
Stock Purolator 14459: ~2.27" ID x ~2.55" OD
Stock Wix 51064: 2.173" ID x 2.475" OD

Most folks have thought that, at about 198 sq in, the PureOne 24458 has about the biggest filter media for both this car and Hondas (when using the stock block stud), but here's an AWESOME comparison:

PureOne 24458 overall can volume: 30 cu in
Baldwin B7042 overall can volume: 58 cu in

About twice the volume! Might be good news for Honda racer types. Can't wait to hear from Baldwin about the B7042's total media area, a more relevant spec. I'll send 'em an e-mail query. Hopefully this isn't a "paper tiger," an average-sized cartridge inside a big can. Another possibility is to search filter catalogs for Peugeot filters, including Euro brands such as Mann, such as for the 1987-89 Peugeot 505 with the 2.8L fuel-injected V-6 (a B7042 application). I'll get back to ya. GOOD HOMEWORK ON YOUR PART, SCOTT!!!

ADDENDUM: Searches of Autozone.com and Kragen/Checkers for an '88 Peugeot 505 V-6 oil filter brought up the following: Fram PH2849A, STP PH2852, Motorcraft FL306, and Beck/Arnley 0410732.

[ August 13, 2004, 07:17 PM: Message edited by: TC ]
 
You may want to take a look at the B202 as well, other that a 20psi BPV, same specs as the 7042. It's a lot easier to find than the 7042 as well.
 
I'd be a little leery about the difference in gasket size myself without first checking the dimensions of the gasket surface of the mounting flange.
I'm not sure if the risk of a gasket blowing out is worth a bit more capacity.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Scott_in_WI:
OK, I did some digging today. Here's what I found. First Baldwin has some great documents on their website, one which lists the weight and (more importantly) the volume of all their filters, and another which is basically a "master list" of their gaskets, o-rings, and filters by thread size. The Baldwin B7042 has the following specs and will fit my new Sebring perfectly without any modifications (the filter "landing" on the Sebring is 3 1/8" in dia).

Canister OD: 3.69"
Canister Ht: 5.38"
Thread: M20X1.5
Gasket OD: 2.81"
Gasket ID: 2.45"
Filter Vol: 1.53qts
ADV: Yes
BPV: 14psi

Other than physical size, the specs are identical to the OEM filter. This engine has a 4.5qt sump, so the nearly full quart of additional capacity will be very welcome.

Other equivalent filters include:
-Purolator L34480
-Wix 51324
-Fram PH2921

What do you think, any downsides to this?


Be careful trying this on a Honda. Mine has a step on the mounting flange. The stock size gasket seats on the inside landing. I don't know if it's safe to seat the gasket on the outside landing. Someone adventurous want to try?
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"Mine has a step on the mounting flange. The stock size gasket seats on the inside landing. I don't know if it's safe to seat the gasket on the outside landing."

Interesting. Most filter landings I've seen are simple and flat (such as the Mopar), and not stepped. One has to wonder why Honda did that. I might be hesitant to go "big gasket" on a Honda as well...
 
On my 02 Accord, I forgot the filter number I'm using now (PL14459) and had Advanced Auto look it up for me. Any way, they gave me the L14610, which is an 03 filter. Anyway, the filter didn't cover all the landing area as it does with the the 14459. It was also noticebly smaller. So, what I'm reading here is that no one thinks that us Honda guys can use the L24458 on our V6's? Does that filters' gasket not seat on the landing? Too large in diameter or not enough expansion room? One other thing about a longer filter on the Honda V6, at least mine, it would appear that a longer filter would stick out a little further and may be more subjective to road debris and possibly damaging the filter.
 
The Honda enthusiasts should be able to answer your question (I've got a Mopar). But here's the Purolators' gasket diameter:

Purolator 14459/24458: ~2.27" ID x ~2.55" OD

Using a compass or string you could cut a faux "Purolator" gasket out of cereal box cardboard and then place it against the landing and see how it interfaces. I'd also compare the baseplates of the various filters to make sure there's no obvious issues, such as flow holes being blocked or overly concave/convex plates. I'm not familiar with Accord V-6's, but have doubts that adding another inch would substantially expose the filter to debris -- perhaps others could confirm.

*****ADDENDUM*****
For a 2002 Accord V-6, PartsAmerica.com (Kragen, Checker) lists the Purolator 14459 and Fram PH3593A as stock replacement filters (the 14610 isn't listed). Assuming they're correct, by definition you can use the longer 24458, assuming you have clearance for the extra 1" length.
 
Geez Louise! I just got an e-mail back from Baldwin Customer Service, and the B7042 has 476.4 sq in of media area!!! This is a MONSTER 20mm x 1.5mm thread filter, with over twice the area of the Purolator 24458, and SIX times that of the Bosch 3312.
 
quote:

Originally posted by TC:
Geez Louise! I just got an e-mail back from Baldwin Customer Service, and the B7042 has 476.4 sq in of media area!!! This is a MONSTER 20mm x 1.5mm thread filter, with over twice the area of the Purolator 24458, and SIX times that of the Bosch 3312.

If you go to the Baldwin site, plug in that number and do a "Baldwin" search, it'll list quite a few "equivalents".
 
The stock WIX/Purolator gasket size for most Hondas is:

Gasket Diameters
O.D. I.D. Thk.
2.475 2.173 0.233

So AC PF1230, Purolator L24458, WIX 51344 will work with no problems as long as you have the clearance for them.

This size gasket will ride on the inner landing of the Honda mounting surface. I imagine that the Baldwin B7042 with gasket dimensions 2.45" ID x 2.81" OD may may work if it sits on the outer landing "ONLY". Hopefully the outer landing has a enough metal behind it and won't flex/crack or something. This is the part that concerns me.

Best way to see this stepped surface on a Honda V6 filter mounting, is to remove the right front tire with the filter removed.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Scott_in_WI:

Baldwin B7042
Canister OD: 3.69"
Canister Ht: 5.38"
Thread: M20X1.5
Gasket OD: 2.81"
Gasket ID: 2.45"
Filter Vol: 1.53qts
ADV: Yes
BPV: 14psi


I'm pretty sure this size filter will hit the anti-roll bar on a '98-'02 V6 Honda. If not, it'll be awefully close.
shocked.gif
 
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