2013 F350 21900mi LE 1605
- Thread starter BeerCan
- Start date
- Status
So, you sampled the factory fill at 21k miles and its already destroyed? That add pack looks like a weak motor oil.
If this is the very first change, the brake in wear could account for alot of that iron, but hopefully you didnt toast your sterling, they do make those GVWRs for a reason...
Is it howling at you? Maybe it will be ok with a good flush and use of a proven gear oil like severe gear, along with modest oci to match your severe use.
I see this sterling is behind a diesel as well.
If this is the very first change, the brake in wear could account for alot of that iron, but hopefully you didnt toast your sterling, they do make those GVWRs for a reason...
Is it howling at you? Maybe it will be ok with a good flush and use of a proven gear oil like severe gear, along with modest oci to match your severe use.
I see this sterling is behind a diesel as well.
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
So, you sampled the factory fill at 21k miles and its already destroyed? That add pack looks like a weak motor oil.
If this is the very first change, the brake in wear could account for alot of that iron, but hopefully you didnt toast your sterling, they do make those GVWRs for a reason...
Is it howling at you? Maybe it will be ok with a good flush and use of a proven gear oil like severe gear, along with modest oci to match your severe use.
I see this sterling is behind a diesel as well.
The add pack looks pretty good compared to most regular gear oils. Its also LE1605, which is not factory gear oil.
So, you sampled the factory fill at 21k miles and its already destroyed? That add pack looks like a weak motor oil.
If this is the very first change, the brake in wear could account for alot of that iron, but hopefully you didnt toast your sterling, they do make those GVWRs for a reason...
Is it howling at you? Maybe it will be ok with a good flush and use of a proven gear oil like severe gear, along with modest oci to match your severe use.
I see this sterling is behind a diesel as well.
The add pack looks pretty good compared to most regular gear oils. Its also LE1605, which is not factory gear oil.
If I go over GVWR it is not by much and not often, I mis-characterized that in the initial post. All my weights are legal per cat scales when I do check them.
Diff makes no noise that I can hear and has no slop or banging. I don't think the iron numbers are out of line considering the newness of the unit. Titanium numbers are a little puzzling to me so I am going to sample again in about 15k miles.
EDIT: I do have 1 weight ticket showing my rear weight over by 100 lbs (7100) That is still under the Sterling axle real max, but its on my truck sticker so its what counts.
Diff makes no noise that I can hear and has no slop or banging. I don't think the iron numbers are out of line considering the newness of the unit. Titanium numbers are a little puzzling to me so I am going to sample again in about 15k miles.
EDIT: I do have 1 weight ticket showing my rear weight over by 100 lbs (7100) That is still under the Sterling axle real max, but its on my truck sticker so its what counts.
Last edited:
Looks like your diff is wearing in nicely Beercan. Is the Ti an alloy for the gear teeth? I did not think it would be a bearing alloy. Thanks for posting. I think you'll be even happier with your next UOA.
dnewton3
Staff member
If this truck tows heavy then that will account for the Fe. All other metals are low, indicating this is generally normal lube performance.
What concerns me is the following statement:
Quote:
... and also basically towed straight off the dealer lot.
There is a general consensus among most folks in the diff industry that the VAST majority of wear occurs in the first 500 miles of diff gear life. Care should be taken during this time as the gears mesh and mate, establishing their wear pattern. If you towed heavily during this time period, you may have caused a bit of excess wear that is either still leaving some residual Fe in the unit, or even damaged the ring/pinion gears by forcing them into heavy service too soon. This may explain the high Fe count for such a short OCI.
Upon the next OCI, take the opportunity to remove the cover and look over the gears to make sure they have a good pattern and exhibit no signs of abnormal wear.
What concerns me is the following statement:
Quote:
... and also basically towed straight off the dealer lot.
There is a general consensus among most folks in the diff industry that the VAST majority of wear occurs in the first 500 miles of diff gear life. Care should be taken during this time as the gears mesh and mate, establishing their wear pattern. If you towed heavily during this time period, you may have caused a bit of excess wear that is either still leaving some residual Fe in the unit, or even damaged the ring/pinion gears by forcing them into heavy service too soon. This may explain the high Fe count for such a short OCI.
Upon the next OCI, take the opportunity to remove the cover and look over the gears to make sure they have a good pattern and exhibit no signs of abnormal wear.
I agree about towing off the lot but I basically had little choice.
I looked at the gears around 8k and everything looked ok to my untrained eye. I should have enough miles for another sample by summer so I can see how the metals are trending.
I looked at the gears around 8k and everything looked ok to my untrained eye. I should have enough miles for another sample by summer so I can see how the metals are trending.
It looks like the factory fill was changed/drained at 7K miles. That fluid would have taken the brunt of your earlier than usual/recommended towing. It would have been nice to see a UOA of that FF fluid. I suspect it did its job very well though based on the demand/stress you gave it.
Your LE1605 sample looks great. Extremely low wear and is still in great shape for further use. Maybe you could ask for a V100C instead of V40C from Polaris next time.
If the Ti is present on the next UOA, I would opt for the ferrography to determine where it is coming from. Maybe it's from the diff casing? Since I don't see Cu or Pb, I don't think it's bearing related.
Your LE1605 sample looks great. Extremely low wear and is still in great shape for further use. Maybe you could ask for a V100C instead of V40C from Polaris next time.
If the Ti is present on the next UOA, I would opt for the ferrography to determine where it is coming from. Maybe it's from the diff casing? Since I don't see Cu or Pb, I don't think it's bearing related.
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: volk06
A good dose of P. Does this use titanium as an additive or is that a wear metal in this differential?
volk poses a good question.
I have seen titanium coated gearing in some differentials.
I don't know of any changes in metallurgy that contained titanium.
Vanadium, chrome, and cobalt are the usual alloying metals.
If it shows up again, place a call to LE or have a virgin sample tested and then we will know for sure.
This is one reason I have always suggested a virgin sample be sent in before a UOA to determine the fluids baseline.
A good dose of P. Does this use titanium as an additive or is that a wear metal in this differential?
volk poses a good question.
I have seen titanium coated gearing in some differentials.
I don't know of any changes in metallurgy that contained titanium.
Vanadium, chrome, and cobalt are the usual alloying metals.
If it shows up again, place a call to LE or have a virgin sample tested and then we will know for sure.
This is one reason I have always suggested a virgin sample be sent in before a UOA to determine the fluids baseline.
Last edited:
I still have some of the oil on hand and could do a voa.
INDYMAC did a voa of his batch and it is here and there is no titanium present.
Of course I realize there could be differences in his batch to mine. I also changed out my rear diff cover to an aftermarket one. Mag-Hytec is what I used. Perhaps this had an influence on the sample.
INDYMAC did a voa of his batch and it is here and there is no titanium present.
Of course I realize there could be differences in his batch to mine. I also changed out my rear diff cover to an aftermarket one. Mag-Hytec is what I used. Perhaps this had an influence on the sample.
Last edited:
A few things you can do.
Ask Mag-Hytec if there is any Ti in there diff cover or other accessory parts. In an effort to make it lighter, it's possible.
Do a VOA on your batch. It's very likely that LE updated there formula from the VOA I did from a 2007 batch.
Call LE and ask them.
I look forward to seeing what you find out. I do have a more recent batch that I will be testing soon. That may help. I'll probably do another VOA at the same time.
Ask Mag-Hytec if there is any Ti in there diff cover or other accessory parts. In an effort to make it lighter, it's possible.
Do a VOA on your batch. It's very likely that LE updated there formula from the VOA I did from a 2007 batch.
Call LE and ask them.
I look forward to seeing what you find out. I do have a more recent batch that I will be testing soon. That may help. I'll probably do another VOA at the same time.
MolaKule
Staff member
INDY has the right idea.
Just to let you know, a lot of of gearing and components parts manf. are applying cobalt, titanium, and tungsten solid coatings to parts to reduce wear and especially break-in wear, which makes a VOA even more important today.
IF the lube does not have these components in them, then it is highly probable that the metals you are seeing are a result of THESE coatings.
Just to let you know, a lot of of gearing and components parts manf. are applying cobalt, titanium, and tungsten solid coatings to parts to reduce wear and especially break-in wear, which makes a VOA even more important today.
IF the lube does not have these components in them, then it is highly probable that the metals you are seeing are a result of THESE coatings.
So I did the VOA. No titanium.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3251424#Post3251424
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3251424#Post3251424
- Status
Similar threads
