Battery dying, is it worth saving? hard to start

[ziggy]

Hi all! Have a 98 toyota corolla. Past few days, the temp outside has oliterally gone to between 34 F day, and 17 F at night. Yesterday, did my annual oil change. Used pennzoil platinum, 5w30, and a PP1 filter. Today especially, noticed the car would start then immediatly shut down. did it a few times, same thing. what got it going..was keeping my foot on the gas pedal. Going to work, home started no problem..its when it sits overnight it seems.
its a battery my old roomate about a year or 2 ago gave me ot use. dunno the name..I did check the water level in it, needs some, but not alot of distilled water. Could that be cuasing it? I went too advance auto, and they tested it, the alternator for me..he siad it was teh battery...the alternator is just fine.
Im thinking to add some more distilled water, and shouold be good to go?
New battery at advance, cheapest, is 530 CCA//$94.
New valucraft at autozone..630CCA...$94..but $84 when old battery is returned. is eem to remember avance auto batterys not being as good..i do know thier gold n red top series are awesome..used em in my old neon.

 

[Chris142]

The battery is telling you to replace it now. If you dont it will leave you stranded at the worst possible time and place.

 

[ziggy]

sure it is? i was under the impresion by adding water, you can sustain the life of the battery..as long as the 8 little holes ontop are full, a battery can last years, decades even...
the guy at advance auto said the battery is holding the chage, 12.6 votls where its supposed to be
sure the battery is dying? just wanna make sure...
and would the silver ones at advacne atuo be better, than the valuecraft ones?

 

[djb]

From the description it sounds as if the car cranked fine, but then wouldn't continue to run.

That doesn't necessarily suggest a battery problem. It suggests a fuel atomization problem or a spark problem. If your injectors are producing a irregular stream rather than a fine mist you'll have a combustion problem that is only obvious during cold weather.

 

[xfactor9]

If the car starts then immediately dies, the battery isn't the cause of that problem. Stalling in cold weather is a problem w/ the fuel delivery system or idle control. Sounds like your idle speed is too low for starters.

 

[ziggy]

i see. well i do run tcw3 2 ozs per 10 gallons...so assumign it shold be clean in thier* changed spark plugs this year, only a few thousand miles on them.
what happens is the car is trying to crank.* but dosnt. lemme clarify* turned key a few more times, same prob. just dosnt wanna start. had to press down on the gas pedal all teh way for a few seconds it seemed, and turn the key to get it started. went to work, no prob. car parked outside at work for 7 hours started just fine. seems past 2 days, is when it sits overnight in the upper teen temps the hradest is starting it.
i did notice also, the dash lights, seem to go dim, at a light, just a little, and when i step on gas pedal..they retrun to normla brightness.
as for ide speed. i had noticed when it got cold out, starting the car, the engine seems to idle really faster than normal..alot actually. this i had thought was becaue of the 10w 30 supertech dino i still had in thier. the oil was turning too molases in the pan.that i know.
so idel air control, battery? both"?

 

[Quest]

(1)carb'ed or EFI?
(2) have you load-tested the battery yet?
(3) what's the voltage reading when the engine is @ idle? (that would indicate the general health of your alternator).

Q.

 

[ziggy]

like said testing at advace atuo..he seems to think its the battery*
i was under the impression making sure the water levels are full lengthend, rejuvinated the life of batterys*

 

[ziggy]

He used a biggiesh blue square shaped computer looking device, neg and post cable to battery posts..and a clamp that went onto a hose or soemthing near the battery.. had me turn the lights on, highbeams, off, took readings,...idel the car fast at 1,500 rpm then left off, ect...
his, whatever that thing is called..took the readings and gave him his feedback. testd the alternator(without removing) and battery seperatly with it.

 

[Quest]

sorry, nothing you can do to "revive" a battery that is on it's way out, regardless of water level.

Fact is: internal resistance will rise over time, compounded with sulphation, the battery will eventually become useless.

I still recommend you to do the full testing of both battery and alternator.

What good is it to you if you install a fresh new battery, only to realise that your alternator isn't charging, afterall?

Q.

 

[Warstud]

I'd start with removing and cleaning both the battery cables and terminals with a wire brush. Also need your fuel system... pressure tested...sounds like the fuel pump is bad.

 

[ziggy]

i see, interesting..
so how do i test te alternator? something witht he B+ pin if i remember right..

 

[ziggy]

ok watched youtbube vid how to test a possible failing battery and alternator..he said and demonstarted...start he car, let it run a few minutes. pull the negative cable off the battery..if it runs, the alternator is ok..if it stops, its prob the alternator.
good way to test?

 

[Wolf359]

Sounds like you have other problems in addition to the battery. Advance has a 30 off $75 code and a $40 off $100, so that $94 could be $64 or add another $6 and take off an extra $10. It's not a good idea to pull the negative battery cable off while running. That used to be ok in the old days, but you do run the risk of frying electronics if you do it. I had a mechanic load test my alternator, voltage regulator turned out to be bad, wasn't working all the time so was intermittent. I'm also not a big fan of additives. When you have problems like these, it's hard to know if it's the additive or not.

 

[Dufus2]

A sulfated battery can cause your alternator to burn up and the computer will do strange things when there are voltage spikes from the A/C waveform coming across the charge wire.

I usually buy the economy battery at Wal-Mart and have had better luck with them than any other brand out there.. Sears, Exide, Advance, Autozone. Sometimes you can get one for around $50-70 just depends on the BCI number (34?)

This Corolla is nearly identical to the 91 Tercel I have and it has a reduction starter, requires very little power to start. In fact, I boosted it off with my lawnmower when it was completely dead after leaving the key on for 2 days

The only way to help a failing battery is to take it to a dedicated battery shop and run it on a machine that pulsates power much like the PWM signal on your fuel injectors. It helps to clean the plates to extend the life of the battery.

 

[eljefino]

The midtronics tester will test the alternator in "advanced mode". Basically it instructs the user to turn on the blower motor, high beams, etc for the load and rev it up. It checks for AC ripple and general output voltage.

I suspect your alt is good but your battery is not only dead but a large sink sucking away your system power when running. Get a "silver" one from advance with a coupon code.

 

[901Memphis]

Autkcraft Silver from advance auto with coupon code is the best bang for the buck. If for some reason you can't order online I would get the Walmart battery. Both the advance auto and Walmart battery should be JCI, which is more desirable over exide.

 

[CharBaby]

Originally Posted By: djb
From the description it sounds as if the car cranked fine, but then wouldn't continue to run.

That doesn't necessarily suggest a battery problem. It suggests a fuel atomization problem or a spark problem. If your injectors are producing a irregular stream rather than a fine mist you'll have a combustion problem that is only obvious during cold weather.
Originally Posted By: xfactor9
If the car starts then immediately dies, the battery isn't the cause of that problem. Stalling in cold weather is a problem w/ the fuel delivery system or idle control. Sounds like your idle speed is too low for starters.



It still sounds to me as if the starter is still turning over the engine but, the engine just isn't catching right away! And when the engine does finaly fire up, it sometimes stalls and needs once again, to be restarted.

Am I missing something?

Also seems to me as if the fuel system needs some extra cleaning from maybe, Techron or SL-1 for a good cleaning and moisture removal(Possibly?) that the TCW-3 isn't providing. Although, TCW-3 may do some cleaning, it is a luberacant.

Not saying completely that the battery isn't in need of replacement but, I don't hear the OP say that the starter has any...tic-tic-tic-tic! And dose finaly get the engnine to fire

 

[901Memphis]

Yes it could be something else but a fresh battery won't hurt and is a fairly inexpensive start. I'd be interested to hear if a battery fixes the issue entirely.

 

[toneydoc]

Well ziggy when you decide to buy a battery, buy it online from advance and use one of their discount codes such as es123 or a123 and get 40% off your purchase. That makes it less painful than buying it at the store. Then drive to the store and they will install it for you. Good luck