Recent Topics
It's Not About The Nail
by JerryBob
10/25/14 01:27 PM
Windows Scripting Tool?
by sleddriver
10/25/14 01:10 PM
calcium sulfonate quiz
by miro
10/25/14 12:50 PM
BATTERY QUESTION
by lucerne06
10/25/14 12:42 PM
Motor Brushes
by Vikas
10/25/14 12:39 PM
Car Quest Merger Results
by doitmyself
10/25/14 12:29 PM
Rental car for cheap in boston, MA mid May
by oilboy123
10/25/14 12:29 PM
Recommend a tire shop in Houston
by rainman49
10/25/14 12:28 PM
DI oil bypass filter
by Inspecktor
10/25/14 11:41 AM
Tough older guy shoots home invaders.
by spasm3
10/25/14 10:10 AM
Oil recommendation for a 2015 Mazda 6
by BrianPA
10/25/14 09:20 AM
2015 Mazda 6 oil filter
by BrianPA
10/25/14 08:31 AM
Newest Members
ChevyTwo, BrianPA, JeepCommander, hevslark, Hox
51688 Registered Users
Who's Online
74 registered (bdcardinal, Apollo14, 2cool, 2009Edge, BigD3800, 9 invisible), 1810 Guests and 199 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
51688 Members
64 Forums
221190 Topics
3497166 Posts

Max Online: 2862 @ 07/07/14 03:10 PM
Donate to BITOG

Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#3210971 - 12/09/13 06:51 AM JP-8 in a diesel
Groundhog Offline


Registered: 12/08/13
Posts: 4
Loc: Wadmalaw island SC
I have learned that JP-8 can be converted for use in a Diesel engine if certain esters are added. My question is what products contain these esters? Diethyl Azelate, Diethly adipate, or bis2 ethyl- hexyl sebacate. These esters lower the wear scar value below what ULS diesel's value is. There are Some other esters as well but these stuck out at me. Any ideas?

Top
#3210997 - 12/09/13 07:34 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
JHZR2 Offline



Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 33786
Loc: New Jersey
IIRC they are part of the fuel additive package. JP-8 adds can be highly toxic.

Top
#3211210 - 12/09/13 12:31 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
SrDriver Offline


Registered: 12/09/06
Posts: 2474
Loc: Southeast Alabama
All I know is when the switch was made from JP-5 to JP-8 in aircraft engines problems were many.

Unless you have access to free JP-8 I can't see any benefit in trying to use it in any diesel engine unless the engine is multi-fuel rated then the is no need in adding anything in that application.

Some military multi-fuel engines come to mind.

Top
#3211500 - 12/09/13 05:04 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
Rat407 Offline


Registered: 12/13/02
Posts: 763
Loc: North Carolina
I ran JP-8 in my old 91 jetta diesel with no issues. Didn't run it much, just a tank full here and there so no long term effects where noted.

Top
#3211679 - 12/09/13 08:17 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: SrDriver]
Groundhog Offline


Registered: 12/08/13
Posts: 4
Loc: Wadmalaw island SC
I did pretty much get it free, had to haul it out . I've wondered about adding 2 stroke oil like Klotz or Castrol?

Top
#3212848 - 12/10/13 08:50 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 9414
Loc: OH
How much of this fuel did you snag?
What's wrong wih it, since normally nobody is looking to give away jet fuel?
It would probably be pretty safe to mix this with regular ULSD.
What kind of a diesel would you use it in?
I'd bet it would be just fine in an old mechanical injection engine and maybe not as great in a modern common rail one.
_________________________
12 Accord LX 22K HGMO 0W-20
09 Forester 64K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 127K G-Oil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 98K Synpower 10W-30
95 BMW 318iC 149K Defy 10W-40

Top
#3214247 - 12/12/13 08:34 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
bullwinkle Offline


Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 4102
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
I would run it in the old IDI diesels mixed with 50:1 two-stroke oil. The military 6.2 diesel injection pumps have hardened internal components to stand up to the "dry" fuel, I've heard of airline mechs running pumped out Jet-A with an extra fuel/water separator to remove the excess water.
_________________________
06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4 48RE SRW, 93 GMC C3500 6.2 diesel, 89 F-450 7.3 IDI, 98 Cherokee 4.0, 05 Scion xB, 82 Mercedes 300D, company van 12 Ford E-250 4.6

Top
#3214719 - 12/12/13 05:05 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 14644
Loc: Midwest
Originally Posted By: Groundhog
I have learned that JP-8 can be converted for use in a Diesel engine if certain esters are added. My question is what products contain these esters? Diethyl Azelate, Diethly adipate, or bis2 ethyl- hexyl sebacate. These esters lower the wear scar value below what ULS diesel's value is. There are Some other esters as well but these stuck out at me. Any ideas?


Methyl soyate.
_________________________
Just pour the coffee and back away slowly! smile

Top
#3216160 - 12/14/13 03:08 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 26818
Loc: a prison island
I'd use Rapeseed Ethyl Ester personally Mola...can make either in a coke bottle 'though.

Top
#3217601 - 12/15/13 05:26 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Shannow]
MolaKule Offline


Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 14644
Loc: Midwest
Originally Posted By: Shannow
I'd use Rapeseed Ethyl Ester personally Mola...can make either in a coke bottle 'though.


Either Rapeseed Ethyl Ester or Methyl Soyate would be good additives. In fact, just about any veggy methyl or ethyl ester would work.

Up here in the northern hemishpere, soybean esters seem to dominate as an additive for the medium distillates.

FOr JP-8, I think about 15% by volume of a veggy ester would be sufficient.


Edited by MolaKule (12/15/13 05:26 PM)
_________________________
Just pour the coffee and back away slowly! smile

Top
#3218051 - 12/16/13 03:03 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 26818
Loc: a prison island
Sorry Mola, was trying (unsuccessfully) to be humerous...

Interesting to see who's lobby groups get what through, as your biodiesel specs pretty much make soy oil the only primary contender...ours make conola the preferred feedstock. Use anything else, and there's something that needs modifying to get it right.

I made a quart in a bottle at work some many moons ago while presenting at a meeting on sustainability...simple stuff, but it made an impact.

Premium diesel usually has 2% RME in it around here.

Top
#3220974 - 12/18/13 07:27 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: fdcg27]
Groundhog Offline


Registered: 12/08/13
Posts: 4
Loc: Wadmalaw island SC
Well about 1k gals. It was used at an engine plant and was considered waste. So being on a farm and not highway use I just had to haul it away. Now I'm all over the road with what to add.
As far as engines I've got everything from a single cyl diesel 8000 hrs pump to an 7430 John Deere.
JD is CR but my others are not
Maybe a dumb question but isn't rapeseed oil same as canola?

Top
#3221016 - 12/18/13 08:17 PM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 26818
Loc: a prison island
Sort of...Conola is a modified rapeseed, and is typically the "R" in Australian biodiesel.

Top
#3224343 - 12/22/13 07:35 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 9414
Loc: OH
A thousand gallons for the cost of hauling it off?
Great score!
It might be best not to use it in the CR Deere, but I'd bet that the mechanical IDI engines wouldn't much care.
To Mola and Shannow, what would be a good commercial source for a methyl or ethyl ester to blend with this fuel?
Canola or soybean oil off the grocer's shelf?
_________________________
12 Accord LX 22K HGMO 0W-20
09 Forester 64K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 127K G-Oil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 98K Synpower 10W-30
95 BMW 318iC 149K Defy 10W-40

Top
#3224463 - 12/22/13 09:16 AM Re: JP-8 in a diesel [Re: Groundhog]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 26818
Loc: a prison island
Anywhere that sells 100% biodiesel...as long as it's pure and clean.

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >