HD introduces 2 new bikes

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Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
Because the Corolla isn't 2 or 3 times more expensive than the cars in it's class...

Harley Davidsons aren't either. You're showing your lack of knowledge when you say they are 2-3 times more expensive. Have you priced a Goldwing or GTL from BMW? In some cases, the HD is actually cheaper.


Corollas compare quite favorably to the other vehicles in it's class/price range...HDs don't...

I've never seen the Corolla win any magazine comparison test. Usually, the Civic, Mazda3, or even the Focus finish ahead of it. It's an inferior car compared to it's competition. Does it do it's job well? Yes. Just like Harley Davidson.


That's because they don't do long term testing....if they did it would show the Corolla was more reliable and requires fewer repairs over a longer lifespan than the vehicles you mentioned...
 
Originally Posted By: grampi
That's because they don't do long term testing....if they did it would show the Corolla was more reliable and requires fewer repairs over a longer lifespan than the vehicles you mentioned...

More so than a Honda? I'd say it's about even.
I know guys that have very high mileage Harleys. They are low maintenance, and easy to fix. ironically, They're low maintenance and easy to fix for the same reasons you criticize them. They're simple designs. How is that bad?
 
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
Isn't the Ural a Russian built bike with a sidecar drive wheel?.,,


They mostly make 2 wheel drive bikes, but also solo bikes without side cars as well. I do love the look of them, especially the old Retro solo that looked like a 50's BMW, but one guy got them to sponsor an Iron Butt ride and he went through about 4 or 5 engines. They say right in the manual to not run them above 55mph for prolonged periods or you can blow them up.
 
Originally Posted By: grampi


Corollas compare quite favorably to the other vehicles in it's class/price range...HDs don't...


Yes, they do. Pick up any bike mag, such as rider or cycle, etc (leaving out the chopper type mages for honest comparison) and several have back to back reviews and the HD usually sits first or second in comparison.

Grampi, I understand your distaste for HD and that is perfect ok with me, however, despite that distaste, if they really were That bad, they simply would not sell. Even hard core brand loyalists will say "hmmmm" when appropriate.
 
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
That's because they don't do long term testing....if they did it would show the Corolla was more reliable and requires fewer repairs over a longer lifespan than the vehicles you mentioned...

More so than a Honda? I'd say it's about even.
I know guys that have very high mileage Harleys. They are low maintenance, and easy to fix. ironically, They're low maintenance and easy to fix for the same reasons you criticize them. They're simple designs. How is that bad?


It's not a bad thing...and I've personally seen very high mileage metrics (300K+)...
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: grampi


Corollas compare quite favorably to the other vehicles in it's class/price range...HDs don't...


Yes, they do. Pick up any bike mag, such as rider or cycle, etc (leaving out the chopper type mages for honest comparison) and several have back to back reviews and the HD usually sits first or second in comparison.


I've yet to see HDs compare favorably in such comparisons...
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: grampi


Corollas compare quite favorably to the other vehicles in it's class/price range...HDs don't...


Yes, they do. Pick up any bike mag, such as rider or cycle, etc (leaving out the chopper type mages for honest comparison) and several have back to back reviews and the HD usually sits first or second in comparison.

Grampi, I understand your distaste for HD and that is perfect ok with me, however, despite that distaste, if they really were That bad, they simply would not sell. Even hard core brand loyalists will say "hmmmm" when appropriate.


The Sporties haven't been as of late. Especially since the Yamaha (Star) Bolt came around. The Shadow RS is a toss up against it. The Bolt and Bonnie usually end up on top by a reasonable margin.

I've ridden several 883 Sportsters. It's an okay bike. Like riding a perfectly preserved 1976 Yamaha XS650 (except I think the XS650 is a tick quicker) I would have said a Kawasaki 454 LTD with the belt drive but the Kawi will flat kill an 883 in spite of giving up nearly double the displacement.
 
Motorcycles are largely an emotional choice since most riders are using them for recreation as opposed to daily transportation.
I've owned four HD's and enjoyed each one for it's intended purpose.
If you choose to spend your time riding around in a Corolla feeling unhappy about what others ride for fun, by all means, feel free to do so.
 
Originally Posted By: grampi

I've yet to see HDs compare favorably in such comparisons...


Well, Get your reading glasses, click on some links, and start reading just a few examples provided:

http://www.ridermagazine.com/road-tests/...dge-review.htm/
http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/10/10474/Motorcycle-Article/2011-Bagger-Cruiser-Shootout.aspx
http://hallicino.hubpages.com/hub/American_Vs_Metric_Cruisers
http://www.cycleworld.com/2010/08/18/har...omparison-test/

The HD may still not be "your" type of bike, but it seems they are not that bad either, contrary to your opinions.
 
Originally Posted By: Spazdog

I've ridden several 883 Sportsters. It's an okay bike. Like riding a perfectly preserved 1976 Yamaha XS650 (except I think the XS650 is a tick quicker)


The Sportster was Harleys answer to the British 650's, and of similar performance. Some years ago I rode an Evo Sporty and nice updated XS650 back to back, not a lot between them. Comparable to my BMW R65 too, but the R65 revs better. I'd like an 883, standard controls and wide bars....I see no need for the 1200, I prefer to push a slow bike hard rather than dawdle on a more powerful bike.
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01


http://hallicino.hubpages.com/hub/American_Vs_Metric_Cruisers


The HD may still not be "your" type of bike, but it seems they are not that bad either, contrary to your opinions.


Funny article.

Quote:
The target for these first Vulcans, Shadows, Intruders and Viragos were the elusive Sportster look, long, thin, raked and mean. What the Japanese stylists came up with their first mid-Eighties efforts at creating a Metric Cruiser Look was fiddly, incoherent, lumpy, cliched and far too compact. I stated in my editorial that "The Kawasaki execs should just buy a Harley and send it down to the styling department with a note attached 'Copy This Down To The Bolts'."


If you have ever ridden a Kawasaki VN750 Vulcan, it is a competent machine. It handles well for a cruiser. The engine has a nice steady "thrum" to it. Not an intrusive numbing vibration, a reassuring presence. And when you twisted the right grip, it would run away from Harley Davidsons.

I think the name "Vulcan" was appropriate. It looked like something designed by Mr Spock.
lol.gif
Not anything from this planet.
186958986_1985-2004-vn750.jpg


No apologies....it is not a pretty bike. Good machine, bad style

And that was what Kawasaki was. The 454 LTD was similarly styled but it was a great riding machine. It could nip at the heels of the 4 cylinder 500cc Honda V30 Magna.
(Eliminators excepted...the the ZL900 and 1000s were great looking and quick)

Honda's Shadows weren't quite so ugly and they were good riding bikes. If I remember correctly, the Shadow 700 could run the 1/4 mile in 12.9.
The current Shadow 750 is a lot closer to the "look" but now runs a 15.3. Driven by a chain instead of a shaft and it is almost 2.5 seconds slower.

I liked the Yamaha Viragos. Very pleasant machines. Simple air-cooled 2 valve per cylinder OHC v twins. (widely rumored to have been a discarded Harley Davidson engine design
21.gif
) Good riding bikes. The 750 could run the 1/4 in the mid to high 13s. Ugly as a mud fence.

Something happened when they started to "get closer to the mark of a truly righteous ride". Something bad.
Remember the 500 Shadow? Rode and looked like a Honda VT500 Ascot with a stepped seat and pull back bars. Freeway? no problem. You had better have a serious freakin' car if you plan to drag race against the littlest Shadow. Fast forward to the Shadow VLX. Style is closer but it is a pain to ride on the freeway. It'll buzz your hands numb at 70 and puts all your weight square on your coccyx. 100 extra ccs and it is noticeably slower. 0-60mph is something like 8 seconds now.

I can only hope that the newest middleweight Harley Davidsons ride and perform as well as '80s Japanese cruisers did. I don't expect much though.
 
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
It's funny I've never heard anyone brag saying, my bike looks and sounds just like a suzuki.Except maybe you?.,,,



Hahahaha!! Seems true on the surface. However, my SV1000s with Yosh pipes and the quiet inserts, sounds great!! Everybody loves the sound of it. So, maybe that's not as true as it would at first seem.

sv1000s.jpg
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
That's because they don't do long term testing....if they did it would show the Corolla was more reliable and requires fewer repairs over a longer lifespan than the vehicles you mentioned...

More so than a Honda? I'd say it's about even.
I know guys that have very high mileage Harleys. They are low maintenance, and easy to fix. ironically, They're low maintenance and easy to fix for the same reasons you criticize them. They're simple designs. How is that bad?


It's not a bad thing...and I've personally seen very high mileage metrics (300K+)...

I think you just made my point. A simple design can be a good thing, and they are comparable to metrics. Can you just admit that HD's are good at what they do?
 
Originally Posted By: jek388
Motorcycles are largely an emotional choice since most riders are using them for recreation as opposed to daily transportation.
I've owned four HD's and enjoyed each one for it's intended purpose.
If you choose to spend your time riding around in a Corolla feeling unhappy about what others ride for fun, by all means, feel free to do so.




I use my Corolla to tow my bike and it works quite well...and my bike more than keeps me happy thank you...
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: grampi

I've yet to see HDs compare favorably in such comparisons...


Well, Get your reading glasses, click on some links, and start reading just a few examples provided:

http://www.ridermagazine.com/road-tests/...dge-review.htm/
http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/10/10474/Motorcycle-Article/2011-Bagger-Cruiser-Shootout.aspx
http://hallicino.hubpages.com/hub/American_Vs_Metric_Cruisers
http://www.cycleworld.com/2010/08/18/har...omparison-test/

The HD may still not be "your" type of bike, but it seems they are not that bad either, contrary to your opinions.


These articles do seem to have the HDs fairing a bit better than in other comparos I've seen...the 3rd link was basically an op-ed by someone who is clearly "HD leaning", so hardly objective...the others are conspicuously omitting all Goldwing models, and the Vic Cross Country and Vision. I respectfully disagree with some of what was written in the Cycle World article as I have ridden both that HD and that Vic...the driveline was much smoother on the Vic as was the engine...and how 'bout some comparisons between some of the big HD non-baggers (103s and 110s) vs some big metric cruisers like the Raider, Stryker, M109R, Vic Hammer, Honda F6B...even some of the now discontinued metrics like the VTX, V2K Vulcan, Road Warrior, would be more than comparable to any of the HDs...you should be thanking the metrics for forcing HD out of the old, dark AMF days...had they not done that, HD would've folded altogether....
 
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Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
Anyone can make a suzuki sound like a suzuki.It would be more impressive if you could make a Harley sound like a suzuki.,,,


You keep clinging to the "sound" thing cuz that's all you got...
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
It's funny I've never heard anyone brag saying, my bike looks and sounds just like a suzuki.Except maybe you?.,,,



Hahahaha!! Seems true on the surface. However, my SV1000s with Yosh pipes and the quiet inserts, sounds great!! Everybody loves the sound of it. So, maybe that's not as true as it would at first seem.

sv1000s.jpg



HD folks think they have the market cornered on the sound thing, but I've heard several bikes that sound better...a V-Max with aftermarkets is one that comes to mind...
 
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
That's because they don't do long term testing....if they did it would show the Corolla was more reliable and requires fewer repairs over a longer lifespan than the vehicles you mentioned...

More so than a Honda? I'd say it's about even.
I know guys that have very high mileage Harleys. They are low maintenance, and easy to fix. ironically, They're low maintenance and easy to fix for the same reasons you criticize them. They're simple designs. How is that bad?


It's not a bad thing...and I've personally seen very high mileage metrics (300K+)...

I think you just made my point. A simple design can be a good thing, and they are comparable to metrics. Can you just admit that HD's are good at what they do?


Anything is comparable to anything as comparing is a verb, meaning it's something that's done by someone...HOW things compare is what matters, and though HDs are routinely compared to other makes, they come up on the short end more often than not...and yes, HD is very good at what they do...selling an image...
 
Originally Posted By: grampi


Anything is comparable to anything as comparing is a verb, meaning it's something that's done by someone...HOW things compare is what matters, and though HDs are routinely compared to other makes, they come up on the short end more often than not...and yes, HD is very good at what they do...selling an image...
And outselling suzuki's.,,
 
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