Wearever Platinum Premium Ceramic Brake Pads?

[Cujet]

Just remember that if you are going from conventional "semi metallic" brake pads to modern ceramic brake pads, you will experience "at least" some reduction in braking power. And possibly 1/2 the braking power if you go from a high end OEM semi metallic to a cheap ceramic.

Or, put another way, your brake pedal will require more pressure.

People are often under the impression that ceramic pads stop as powerfully as quality semi metallics. With very few exceptions such as Carbotech ceramic based racing pads (which dust and squeal like crazy) everyday ceramics create lower braking torque.

On today's vehicles, this is often not a problem, as the brake systems are quite capable. But, if you have pickup truck, such as an older F150 with marginal brakes, and you tow... Choose a high end semi metallic. Otherwise you and your boat are going to be sailing through the red lights with both feet on the brakes.

From brakeperformance.com:

 

[demarpaint]

I tried high end ceramic brakes thinking they were better, and as a result will continue to use high end semi metallic. Opinions vary.

 

[rshaw125]

CORRECTION. Mine are the Gold Ceramic not the Platinum ceramic.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Note that many folks with my 4 piston fixed caliper brembo setup have switched from noisy factory semi metallics to ceramics and been VERY displeased with the performance, especially in the wet and cold climates.

Pads are like ice cream, a million flavors out there.

Note that dust seems to correlate to braking performance, some here will understand, most will never notice...

 

[rshaw125]

Interesting. So the advantages of ceramic are low dust and long life. Semi-metallic more dust better brakes.

 

[mclasser]

I'm running the Platinums on my Accord and I35 right now paired with AAP rotors with no issues. Fit fine, no squeaks or dust, and have a nice bite to them. Can be obtained for cheap with AAP coupon codes.

 

[stephen9666]

Originally Posted By: rshaw125
Interesting. So the advantages of ceramic are low dust and long life. Semi-metallic more dust better brakes.


Not exactly. There are too many broad generalizations in this thread being bandied about as fact, when they're just not true in every application or for every brand of pad.

Ceramic pads can perform well and stop well. I have Bendix CT-3 pads that are GG rated, which is a higher friction rating than many semi-metallic pads. They stop very well and I haven't really noticed the claims about poor wet and cold performance. Mine seem to perform well.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: stephen9666
Mine seem to perform well.


Exactly. What works very well on your platform may be completely different on another.

Excellent point!

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: stephen9666
Not exactly. There are too many broad generalizations in this thread being bandied about as fact, when they're just not true in every application or for every brand of pad.

Ceramic pads can perform well and stop well. I have Bendix CT-3 pads that are GG rated, which is a higher friction rating than many semi-metallic pads. They stop very well and I haven't really noticed the claims about poor wet and cold performance. Mine seem to perform well.


I wanted to post a chart of the brake pad rating system. However, I was unable to find one rapidly, so I posted the "low information" chart above. This link is a bit more informative:

http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~smacadof/DOTPadCodes.htm

Some things for people to be mindful of. In much the same way as oil viscosity ratings, pad ratings don't full cover operational temperatures.

So, an E,E rated pad has 0.25+ friction rating at both 250 + 600 deg F. This says nothing about performance at 1400 degrees F. A temperature achievable by very hard use, such as track, towing down mountains or repeated high speed stops. (by the way, E,E is about the same as steel on steel friction if I remember correctly)

Another item: Ceramics that have high performance ratings often contain more metal, they may contain large amounts of copper or other alloys.

The ratings system is just a basic guideline to get ya started.

I used Carbotech XP-10 pads on my turbo miata. They outperformed any other pad I have tried. Took about 1/2 second to warm up and then worked amazingly well. Even when dragging the car down from 168MPH repeatedly on Homestead track.

 

[stephen9666]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: stephen9666
Not exactly. There are too many broad generalizations in this thread being bandied about as fact, when they're just not true in every application or for every brand of pad.

Ceramic pads can perform well and stop well. I have Bendix CT-3 pads that are GG rated, which is a higher friction rating than many semi-metallic pads. They stop very well and I haven't really noticed the claims about poor wet and cold performance. Mine seem to perform well.


I wanted to post a chart of the brake pad rating system. However, I was unable to find one rapidly, so I posted the "low information" chart above. This link is a bit more informative:

http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~smacadof/DOTPadCodes.htm

Some things for people to be mindful of. In much the same way as oil viscosity ratings, pad ratings don't full cover operational temperatures.

So, an E,E rated pad has 0.25+ friction rating at both 250 + 600 deg F. This says nothing about performance at 1400 degrees F. A temperature achievable by very hard use, such as track, towing down mountains or repeated high speed stops. (by the way, E,E is about the same as steel on steel friction if I remember correctly)

Another item: Ceramics that have high performance ratings often contain more metal, they may contain large amounts of copper or other alloys.

The ratings system is just a basic guideline to get ya started.

I used Carbotech XP-10 pads on my turbo miata. They outperformed any other pad I have tried. Took about 1/2 second to warm up and then worked amazingly well. Even when dragging the car down from 168MPH repeatedly on Homestead track.


That info is all well and good, and it is useful for people to understand. But it doesn't affect my previous statement that people in this thread have made some broad generalizations about the stopping performance of pads marketed as "semi metallic" or "ceramic" that just aren't accurate. The performance of a pad will depend completely on the specific friction formula being used in the pad, not whether the box says it's "semi metallic" or "ceramic."

I'm not trying to start another dumb BITOG argument, but this statement you made just isn't accurate. It 100% depends on the pads you're comparing.
Quote:
Just remember that if you are going from conventional "semi metallic" brake pads to modern ceramic brake pads, you will experience "at least" some reduction in braking power.

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: stephen9666


I'm not trying to start another dumb BITOG argument, but this statement you made just isn't accurate. It 100% depends on the pads you're comparing.
Quote:
Just remember that if you are going from conventional "semi metallic" brake pads to modern ceramic brake pads, you will experience "at least" some reduction in braking power.


Understood. I see your point and I think we actually agree fully. I did try and give an example of a company that produces ceramic pads that outperform everything else I've used (Carbotech) However, those pads are not the "dust free" and "squeal free" ceramics that everybody craves.

Friction ratings aside, so many of today's ceramics do not outperform even the most basic of semi metallics. I've spent a lifetime on the track. I'm just reporting what "seems" to be common knowledge with regard to typically available pad materials. Purchasing typical NAPA, AAP, Posiquiet, EBC or other common "dust free" ceramics will, in my experience, result in less braking torque.

As I'm sure you know, without test results on a particular vehicle, brake pads and the resulting stopping power, are a bit of a gamble. Especially cheaper, commonly available ceramics.

 

[Cujet]

Here is a very cool pic of carbon brakes doing what they do best!

 

[artificialist]

I don't remember if I used Wearever Gold or Wearever platinum on my dad's Pontiac G6, but they make no noise, and feel the same as factory brake pads, so I can't complain too much.

Mine were also made in India, and that annoyed me. Unfortunately, I was in a hurry, so I took what I could get.