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#3127041 - 09/16/13 09:16 PM '04 Sienna 105k
DVE Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 109
Loc: Houston, TX
1. What kind of vehicle you have
2004 Toyota Sienna CE (Cheap Edition) 105k miles
2. What your owner's manual says -- not just viscosity, but certifications (look for acronyms like API SM, ILSAC GF-4, etc.) and change intervals as well
0w-20, 5w-20, 5w-30 don't have manual
3. Where you live
Houston, TX
4. How you drive (easy? hard? fast? slow?)
Very easy, hardest is overtaking a semi
5. What your daily drive is like (short trips? long trips? city? highway?)
HWY long distance trips, cross country, coast-to-coast
6. Whether your car has any known problems
afraid of carbon build up

Basically just bought the car, it had a sticker saying fresh oil change with Quaker State, once I got time to finally change the oil it was a disaster (to me). Filter was MicroGuard. Changed it for 5w-30 ML synblend and Wix oil filter.

Once I got the opportunity to open the cap on top of the engine I was in for some serious crusty black build up. At this point I am a bit scared, so I searched through this great website and decided on Kreen, but I am bit worried that it might loosen up some big chunks.
I am grateful for any help.
Thank you all very much.
P.S.: I bought some synpower jugs thanks to $5 off coupons. I have 0w-20 for the "Winter" (wanted to see how the van likes it) and the rest is synpower 5w-30. I have receipts, so I can exchange them just in case.


Edited by DVE (09/16/13 09:22 PM)
_________________________
'04 Sienna 105k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, Denso Air
'00 Altima 146k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, A/C Delco Air

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#3127049 - 09/16/13 09:32 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2233
Loc: Southeast Texas
Your driving style will help things out. The viscosity is not that important, but personally I would use a synthetic that cleans really well. The Synpower, or Pennz Ultra or Platinum for 5K intervals (at first) is a good place to start.

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#3127050 - 09/16/13 09:35 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
NO2 Offline


Registered: 09/06/12
Posts: 63
Loc: Michigan
The oil won't affect carbon build up. You need to run the engine at high RPM's to clear it out. If you are referring to sludge visible below the oil cap , use the Synpower or, preferably, an oil designed for cleaning like Mobil 1 HM or Pennzoil Ultra. Make sure to use a high capacity oil filter too. It might take 30-50K to clean out the sludge. Better to do it gradually if your engine is working OK than rapidly with Kreen. The previous 3.0L has had sludge issues, the 3.3L is supposed to be better.

Don't forget to change the brake and ATF too - the previous owner(s) are likely to have neglected/forgotten it.

Your engine is designed for 0w-30 or 5w-30 oil. I'd always use the 0w-xx oil (if available in the oil you choose) since it is likely to have higher quality base stocks and will help for very cold cross country trips.


Edited by NO2 (09/16/13 09:45 PM)

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#3127065 - 09/16/13 09:48 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: NO2]
DVE Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 109
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Your driving style will help things out. The viscosity is not that important, but personally I would use a synthetic that cleans really well. The Synpower, or Pennz Ultra or Platinum for 5K intervals (at first) is a good place to start.

I just changed the oil, is it worth it to dump it? ML Synblend has some cleaning properties, right? I have read here nothing but great things about PU, and with the FRN $0.50 for 20 gallons makes it pretty good choice.

Originally Posted By: NO2
The oil won't affect carbon build up. You need to run the engine at high RPM's to clear it out. If you are referring to sludge visible below the oil cap , use the Synpower or, preferably, an oil designed for cleaning like Mobil 1 HM or Pennzoil Ultra. Make sure to use a high capacity oil filter too. It might take 30-50K to clean out the sludge. Better to do it gradually if your engine is working OK than rapidly with Kreen. The previous 3.0L has had sludge issues, the 3.3L is supposed to be better.

Don't forget to change the brake and ATF too - the previous owner(s) are likely to have neglected/forgotten it.

Your engine is designed for 0w-30 or 5w-30 oil. I'd always use the 0w-xx oil (if available in the oil you choose) since it is likely to have higher quality base stocks. It will make no difference in Houston.

I have done ATF flush at the dealership, might not have been the best idea. In the future I will do Drain&Fill myself. The engine according to Toyota is not 0w-30. It's not under warranty or anything, so If you say it's better I will go that route. I can only say that there is no "gelling" or sludge per se, but all I found was clumps of something black and gritty. I thought about the break fluid, and will do it right after I address some other issues on the car.


Thank you all very much for such quick responses.
_________________________
'04 Sienna 105k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, Denso Air
'00 Altima 146k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, A/C Delco Air

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#3127082 - 09/16/13 10:12 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2233
Loc: Southeast Texas
Originally Posted By: DVE
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Your driving style will help things out. The viscosity is not that important, but personally I would use a synthetic that cleans really well. The Synpower, or Pennz Ultra or Platinum for 5K intervals (at first) is a good place to start.

I just changed the oil, is it worth it to dump it? ML Synblend has some cleaning properties, right? I have read here nothing but great things about PU, and with the FRN $0.50 for 20 gallons makes it pretty good choice.


No! Do not dump it and waste perfectly good oil. Just limit the OCI to 5K, then when you can, use the Synpower, then the Pennz Ultra or Platinum, or Mobil 1 etc.

Your long distance driving is going to help you too.

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#3127088 - 09/16/13 10:20 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
Thax Offline


Registered: 11/07/10
Posts: 630
Loc: VA
My suggestion would be PU for 5K for a couple years to clean this engine out. In Houston I would use 5w-30 , very low volatility for the hot weather and very good cold flow properties for your few cold days down there. The black gunk your seeing under the fill cap is part of a oil baffle in Toyota v6 engines of that genre , I would not put too much worry into it. I have seen that baffle look like a sludge dump yet when the valve covers come off there usually is a much cleaner story. For the Trans use Castrol Multi-Vehicle Import on your drain and refills at every other oil change. This fluid meets Toyota T-IV , will keep the Trans running smooth and help clean any varnish deposits. Drain and refills at 10K would help out a possibly neglected transmission , who knows what and if the PO did for the car.
_________________________
00 Dodge Durango 4.7L
99 Jeep Cherokee 4.0L
ASE P2 Parts Specialist
AIA Import Part Specialist

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#3127092 - 09/16/13 10:26 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: Thax]
DVE Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 109
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Originally Posted By: DVE
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
Your driving style will help things out. The viscosity is not that important, but personally I would use a synthetic that cleans really well. The Synpower, or Pennz Ultra or Platinum for 5K intervals (at first) is a good place to start.

I just changed the oil, is it worth it to dump it? ML Synblend has some cleaning properties, right? I have read here nothing but great things about PU, and with the FRN $0.50 for 20 gallons makes it pretty good choice.


No! Do not dump it and waste perfectly good oil. Just limit the OCI to 5K, then when you can, use the Synpower, then the Pennz Ultra or Platinum, or Mobil 1 etc.

Your long distance driving is going to help you too.

5k? OK will do, I was actually going to do 3k on ML and 5k on synpower.
Originally Posted By: Thax
My suggestion would be PU for 5K for a couple years to clean this engine out. In Houston I would use 5w-30 , very low volatility for the hot weather and very good cold flow properties for your few cold days down there. The black gunk your seeing under the fill cap is part of a oil baffle in Toyota v6 engines of that genre , I would not put too much worry into it. I have seen that baffle look like a sludge dump yet when the valve covers come off there usually is a much cleaner story. For the Trans use Castrol Multi-Vehicle Import on your drain and refills at every other oil change. This fluid meets Toyota T-IV , will keep the Trans running smooth and help clean any varnish deposits. Drain and refills at 10K would help out a possibly neglected transmission , who knows what and if the PO did for the car.

Thank you with the info. I know that the baffle is black, it just had baked on crusty black gritty stuff on it. I have to do spark plugs, so I might pull the valve cover to check out the engine a bit. Might as well do the PCV while I am at it.
_________________________
'04 Sienna 105k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, Denso Air
'00 Altima 146k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, A/C Delco Air

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#3127095 - 09/16/13 10:27 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2233
Loc: Southeast Texas
3K then 5K is a good plan. That will get the cleaning process started.

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#3127101 - 09/16/13 10:35 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: gfh77665]
DVE Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 109
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: gfh77665
3K then 5K is a good plan. That will get the cleaning process started.

Thanks for the reassurance. I can not honestly wait till the 3k is up, might have to make few trips to Big Bend laugh
_________________________
'04 Sienna 105k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, Denso Air
'00 Altima 146k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, A/C Delco Air

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#3127112 - 09/16/13 11:01 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
901Memphis Offline


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 4898
Loc: Northern Kentucky
PYB for some 3-5k intervals. Can you run it in 3rd gear to keep the RPMS up after the oil is at temp? Might help facilitate the cleaning process if it doesn't use much fuel. In my experience it only loses 2-3 mpg for the lower gear.

I wouldn't run extended drain oils like PU until it was cleaned up.

Keep it short and sweet with a high calicum oil. Valvoline products aren't my favorite for cleanups since they use a totally different additive pack...Maybe you can save them for when its all cleaned up.
_________________________
1999 Ford Taurus 145k (Vulcan v6) - Mobil 1 High Mileage 5w30 | FL400S
2002 Buick Century 102k - PU 5w30 / Fram Ultra XG 3980 / Filter mag

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#3127131 - 09/16/13 11:29 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: 901Memphis]
DVE Offline


Registered: 09/16/13
Posts: 109
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: 901Memphis
PYB for some 3-5k intervals. Can you run it in 3rd gear to keep the RPMS up after the oil is at temp? Might help facilitate the cleaning process if it doesn't use much fuel. In my experience it only loses 2-3 mpg for the lower gear.

I wouldn't run extended drain oils like PU until it was cleaned up.

Keep it short and sweet with a high calicum oil. Valvoline products aren't my favorite for cleanups since they use a totally different additive pack...Maybe you can save them for when its all cleaned up.

I was going to run PU for 5k, and what would you recommend for high calcium? I could maybe run some HDEO like Delo 5w-30 or Rotella, that might be better?
_________________________
'04 Sienna 105k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, Denso Air
'00 Altima 146k 5w-30 ML SynBlend, Wix oil, A/C Delco Air

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#3127141 - 09/16/13 11:52 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
Quest Offline


Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 6269
Loc: beaver land EH?
If you really want to know your engine condition (head area), you should simply pull off the valve cover and look inside, instead of just peeking through the baffled valve cover fill hole.

Take pictures to share with us if you are unsure about the condition.

If you see gunks similar to this:

http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/sludge/oil_pickup_screen.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/sludge/cleaning_sludge.html&h=599&w=800&sz=115&tbnid=ZyIBPBPFZE0QlM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=122&zoom=1&usg=__pghqZMceZq3H61vC3LuzXM-2RtA=&docid=SfoUSQwmYkEy1M&sa=X&ei=xuM3Uq_jOIGciQKQo4GYCw&sqi=2&ved=0CD4Q9QEwAA&dur=252

or this:

http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.bellperformance.com/Portals/68152/images/pick-up-screen.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.bellperformance.com/blog/bid/73499/Healthy-Oil-Series-Combating-and-Removing-Engine-Oil-Sludge&h=480&w=640&sz=39&tbnid=Hh0BXv-Ly38qtM:&tbnh=92&tbnw=122&zoom=1&usg=__nY9CNyuZhqwVOcmtguFH-A8Thl8=&docid=4VNTrVOtrPdMpM&sa=X&ei=xuM3Uq_jOIGciQKQo4GYCw&sqi=2&ved=0CEQQ9QEwAg&dur=376

Then my advise to you is to pack things up, turn around and sell it. No use patching a ticking time bomb when, sooner or later, the sludged up engine is gonna fail you.
.
_________________________
"Internet discussion boards act as echo chambers for conspiracy dittoheads" A.Allen

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#3127155 - 09/17/13 12:55 AM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
901Memphis Offline


Registered: 08/14/10
Posts: 4898
Loc: Northern Kentucky
The PU is fine for 5k, i was just worried you are over paying for your investment. For that price you could get maybe 2 jugs of PYB and run them 3-5k each. All pennzoil products are high in calcium. PYB, PP, PU , all good stuff, i just wouldn't be buying a top synthetic for a cleaning cycle unless i was rich.
_________________________
1999 Ford Taurus 145k (Vulcan v6) - Mobil 1 High Mileage 5w30 | FL400S
2002 Buick Century 102k - PU 5w30 / Fram Ultra XG 3980 / Filter mag

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#3127302 - 09/17/13 08:31 AM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: DVE]
gfh77665 Offline


Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 2233
Loc: Southeast Texas
The Penn Ultra and Penn Platinum has substantially higher cleaning capabilities than PYB. Its worth a few extra dollars for a few changes, if he wants to make real progress, IMO.

http://www.pennzoil.com/motor-oil/

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#3127583 - 09/17/13 01:41 PM Re: '04 Sienna 105k [Re: Thax]
wag123 Offline


Registered: 06/14/11
Posts: 493
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Thax
My suggestion would be PU for 5K for a couple years to clean this engine out. In Houston I would use 5w-30, very low volatility for the hot weather and very good cold flow properties for your few cold days down there. The black gunk your seeing under the fill cap is part of a oil baffle in Toyota v6 engines of that genre, I would not put too much worry into it. I have seen that baffle look like a sludge dump yet when the valve covers come off there usually is a much cleaner story.

^ This.
The 3.3L is not prone to having the same sludge problem that the 3.0L had. Thax is right. The baffle you are seeing through the oil filler is subject to gunking-up even when the inside of the engine is perfectly clean. Just start using a 5W-30 with known-good cleaning properties (PYB, PP, PU, M1-HM, etc), continue using it from now-on, and don't worry about it.
I would NOT use anything but genuine Toyota T-IV transmission fluid in it. Now that the dealer has flushed your transmission, you are good to go for at least the next 60k-75k miles, so don't worry about THAT either.
With 105k miles on it, you need to have the T-belt replaced if it has not already been done. If the spark plugs have not been replaced, that will also need to be done within the next year or so (a big job and not cheap).
Keep an eye on the steering rack, they are prone to having seal problems and leakage when they get older. If it is leaking a little you do not need to replace it immediately (if ever), just keep an eye on the fluid and top it up as needed (Dex III).
In 2004 the Siennas had a problem with the radiators cracking and leaking. It may have already been replaced. Just know that you need to keep an eye (and nose) on it.

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