GM tops in torque~

Status
Not open for further replies.
To bad its only going in the $60k trucks.

That would be a fun motor to have in a lighter truck, or if they made another SS...
 
Last edited:
Perhaps the 6.2L does - for now. The Ford 6.2L has plenty of room for improvement.

The new DI 5.3L GM motor still makes less HP and only 3 ft lbs more Torque than my 5.0L Ford, yet has more displacement. I'm not impressed.

BTW - I tow a LOT and if you pull 11,000+ lbs with a half ton, you're a fool. These "towing wars" with ALL the auto makers are nothing but silly to me.
 
A quick tweak to the Ecoboost and it will top GM. My guess is they will up power for 2015's redesign. The 5.0 has LOTS of headroom as does the 6.2.

In the 1500 space, Ram is the one sorely feeling the heat. Lowest payload, lowest tow ratings, and average fuel economy.
 
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Perhaps the 6.2L does - for now. The Ford 6.2L has plenty of room for improvement.

The new DI 5.3L GM motor still makes less HP and only 3 ft lbs more Torque than my 5.0L Ford, yet has more displacement. I'm not impressed.

BTW - I tow a LOT and if you pull 11,000+ lbs with a half ton, you're a fool. These "towing wars" with ALL the auto makers are nothing but silly to me.

Amen
 
I read in a few places that stock, the ecoboast is good for 500/500 ... the problem was that it was blowing up AWD components in the SHO and had to be detuned. I'm sure it would be pretty easy for Ford to up the power a bit more with some software tweaks




Originally Posted By: itguy08
A quick tweak to the Ecoboost and it will top GM. My guess is they will up power for 2015's redesign. The 5.0 has LOTS of headroom as does the 6.2.

In the 1500 space, Ram is the one sorely feeling the heat. Lowest payload, lowest tow ratings, and average fuel economy.


The first two was intentional ... they purposely went with coil springs ...
 
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Perhaps the 6.2L does - for now. The Ford 6.2L has plenty of room for improvement.

The new DI 5.3L GM motor still makes less HP and only 3 ft lbs more Torque than my 5.0L Ford, yet has more displacement. I'm not impressed.

BTW - I tow a LOT and if you pull 11,000+ lbs with a half ton, you're a fool. These "towing wars" with ALL the auto makers are nothing but silly to me.


Less hp? Only 3 more ft lbs of torque? True, but at what rpm's? Oh and since we are talking about what's been put on paper lets not forget that the GM engine with more "displacement" gets better fuel economy then the 5.0. Direct injection or not the 5.3 is STILL a push rod engine, and of course the 5.0 has DOHC…
 
Originally Posted By: jimmy87
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Perhaps the 6.2L does - for now. The Ford 6.2L has plenty of room for improvement.

The new DI 5.3L GM motor still makes less HP and only 3 ft lbs more Torque than my 5.0L Ford, yet has more displacement. I'm not impressed.

BTW - I tow a LOT and if you pull 11,000+ lbs with a half ton, you're a fool. These "towing wars" with ALL the auto makers are nothing but silly to me.


Less hp? Only 3 more ft lbs of torque? True, but at what rpm's? Oh and since we are talking about what's been put on paper lets not forget that the GM engine with more "displacement" gets better fuel economy then the 5.0. Direct injection or not the 5.3 is STILL a push rod engine, and of course the 5.0 has DOHC…


Isn't the F-150 heavier?

I can see the 5.0L making 500HP with DI. Considering it made 444HP in non-DI BOSS 302 trim.

I don't think anybody is knocking the LSx engines, they are a formidable force. But once shouldn't underestimate their competition either. The current generation of Ford's OHC engines have proven to not only be extremely durable but potent performers as well.

All of the current trucks have awesome engine line-ups IMHO.
 
Simple tuning and the ford 5.0 will easily beat those numbers but low rpm grunt is what a truck needs and a dohc engine tends to need rpm for power.
Dodge can likely get more hp from the hemi,and mds helps fuel economy.
I look forward to seeing what happens next
 
I dunno. Used to be common to derate motors in trucks. Cars generally don't do heavy loads for long periods of time. Lots of heat gets generated. Has that changed today? As in, vastly better control over hot spots in the engine, and keeping uniform temps, oil issues and whatnot?
 
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Simple tuning and the ford 5.0 will easily beat those numbers but low rpm grunt is what a truck needs and a dohc engine tends to need rpm for power.
Dodge can likely get more hp from the hemi,and mds helps fuel economy.
I look forward to seeing what happens next


Very true!

"low rpm grunt is what a truck needs",

A. K. A:

LOW END TORQUE!
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: jimmy87
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Simple tuning and the ford 5.0 will easily beat those numbers but low rpm grunt is what a truck needs and a dohc engine tends to need rpm for power.
Dodge can likely get more hp from the hemi,and mds helps fuel economy.
I look forward to seeing what happens next


Very true!

"low rpm grunt is what a truck needs",

A. K. A:

LOW END TORQUE!



Which is where the variable cam timing on a DOHC motor can shine if done right. My M5 makes prodigious torque right off idle and its torque curve looks like Saskatchewan. But it doesn't make peak HP until 6,800RPM.

Ford would be able to work similar magic with their 5.0L.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
and its torque curve looks like Saskatchewan.


Great comment but there is maybe only 10 guys on this site that can appreciate it.
 
Originally Posted By: Miller88
I read in a few places that stock, the ecoboast is good for 500/500 ... the problem was that it was blowing up AWD components in the SHO and had to be detuned. I'm sure it would be pretty easy for Ford to up the power a bit more with some software tweaks


This is true. The SHO, Flex, MKS, and MKT are all still FWD drive trains and are the limiting factor for the Ecoboost. I'm surprised the guys with the tuned cars have not blown it up yet.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: jimmy87
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Perhaps the 6.2L does - for now. The Ford 6.2L has plenty of room for improvement.

The new DI 5.3L GM motor still makes less HP and only 3 ft lbs more Torque than my 5.0L Ford, yet has more displacement. I'm not impressed.

BTW - I tow a LOT and if you pull 11,000+ lbs with a half ton, you're a fool. These "towing wars" with ALL the auto makers are nothing but silly to me.


Less hp? Only 3 more ft lbs of torque? True, but at what rpm's? Oh and since we are talking about what's been put on paper lets not forget that the GM engine with more "displacement" gets better fuel economy then the 5.0. Direct injection or not the 5.3 is STILL a push rod engine, and of course the 5.0 has DOHC…


Isn't the F-150 heavier?


Bing we have a winner.

Half tons are limited to around 6k+/- GVW because of the leaf springs and axles. So in the real world a lighter truck will be fast and more useful for truck stuff, ie able to carry more. My 8ft bed regular cab 1500 is rated to haul more than every other 1500 model of that year.

So GM has the lighter truck, they win, they can carry more and need less HP to achieve acceptable performance. Less weight also means less wear and operating costs on suspension parts.

Besides their are a ton of 500hp or more trucks out their already, why does the world need more? This half ton HP and towing war is silly.

What I'd love to see is a half ton fuel mileage war. Trucks that lower operating costs for the people who really need trucks.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: jimmy87
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Simple tuning and the ford 5.0 will easily beat those numbers but low rpm grunt is what a truck needs and a dohc engine tends to need rpm for power.
Dodge can likely get more hp from the hemi,and mds helps fuel economy.
I look forward to seeing what happens next


Very true!

"low rpm grunt is what a truck needs",

A. K. A:

LOW END TORQUE!



Which is where the variable cam timing on a DOHC motor can shine if done right. My M5 makes prodigious torque right off idle and its torque curve looks like Saskatchewan. But it doesn't make peak HP until 6,800RPM.

Ford would be able to work similar magic with their 5.0L.


Love the sask remark.
With vvt I guess that opens alot of doors as far as cams profiles and a broad powerband.
The future is bright
 
^^^Agreed. Great time to look at a truck, eh?

Note that these new GM offerings are all DI and we have yet to see what that will be like. The GM V8's have had VVT for some time now and it works well to flatten the torque curve yet keep the high rpm performance. IMO there is no advantage to DOHC/Twin Turbos, etc., in a TRUCK, I want grunt to pull my cargo not high rpm hp to impress my friends. As a fleet owner I have learned to value simplicity over technical sophistication. People who keep a truck a couple years and trade will not care as much, but we expect 200-250k minimum before any major services are required.

Weight is the big issue. You pay every day for it with fuel, tires, brakes, and more wear/tear on everything. The GM trucks are at least 200 pounds or more LIGHTER than the other trucks and yet still loaded with features. They also can carry incrementally more payload.

Unlike all the Ford rooters I am NOT brand loyal unless they earn it. Ford cannot be used in our service vans because the duty cycle includes extensive stationary operations. But my Wifey needs a new truck for home healthcare and you can bet we will consider ANY brand that can bring us fuel economy and sprightly performance along with great comfort and ergonomics.

GM just made the choices more varied...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top