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#3115620 - 09/05/13 10:30 AM Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB
jkhawaii Offline


Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 446
Loc: Oahu
Would it really make much difference if a JASO MA oil is used instead of MB? Honda seems to be the only one that sells a 10w30 MB rated oil. It would seem to me that a MB rated oil would just be any SN oil for cars.
_________________________
Previous vehicle 2008 Pontiac G5 OLM and factory oil's mostly.
Currently 2013 GMC Terrain 2.4L FWD.
2012 Piaggio Fly 50 4T 4V. 2013 Honda PCX 150

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#3115643 - 09/05/13 11:00 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
mrsilv04 Offline


Registered: 12/08/06
Posts: 6456
Loc: Illinois
One could always "play it safe" by using Honda's oil while it is under warranty. Not like it takes a gallon for each change.

Once it is out of warranty, the will likely be more MB players in the market.
_________________________

President of the Illinois chapter of 'Motorcyclists for Global Warming'.

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#3115703 - 09/05/13 11:50 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
Phishin Offline


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Indiana
Run any 30 weight oil you want. Honestly.

And change the oil often. The more often the better. Does this scoot have an oil filter? If it doesn't (like my Honda scooters), I change my oil every 600 miles. How often you change the oil will have a far greater impact on your scooter than how what oil you use.

I own a Ruckus and a CH250. My Ruckus has 18k miles on it. I've done 35 or so oil changes on it. It only takes 0.7 quarts. So, just change it. Your motor will thank you.

My reasoning: The high revving scoot engines shear oil like CRAZY. It will be quickly out of grade. Second, with no oil filter, contaminates build up quickly. My engines run better than any scoot out there for their mileage.

Since you're in Hawaii....run any 10w30 you want (synthetic or concentional) or any HDEO oil: 5w40 or 15w40.
_________________________
2010 Accord-LX K24: PU 5w30
2009 Subaru Forester 2.5X: M1 5w40 TDT
1990 Chevy K1500 350TBI: Frankenbrew
2008 Ruckus 50ccGET: M1R Mix

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#3115798 - 09/05/13 01:42 PM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
OriginalRocket Offline


Registered: 07/06/09
Posts: 75
Loc: Chicago, Illinois
Mr phishin and I have had this discussion before.

While I agree with most of what he has said, I don't agree with the frequent OCI.

I have the original PCX 125cc (2011)

Honda SPECS 5000 miles for this. I don't dare go that far. I change every 2000 miles. Make sure your air filter is a good fit, and change it at the recommended intervals.

The screen "filter" basically stops break in metals from destroying the engine. I've cleaned it every oil change and only on the first initial 600 mile did I find anything in it.

As for the oil to use, this is a dry clutch engine, and no shared transmission/gears. Run any 10w30 you like as long as it meets or exceeds the rating grade, (SG?)

The oil change is about .95 quarts, So I buy 1 quart bottles and use all of it. I've ran everything, GTX, Mobil 1, Penz Ultra, Rotella, Amzoil and now I have Redline 10w30. None have changed the feel of the engine, none have given me better or worse fuel millage. None come out of the drain hole any different.

I'm fast approaching 10,000 miles on my scooter. Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.
_________________________
2001 Acura Integra GS-R
2011 Honda PCX 125cc
2012 Honda NC700X DCT
2012 Honda CBR250R ABS

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#3116375 - 09/06/13 12:57 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
jkhawaii Offline


Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 446
Loc: Oahu
its funny that the manual says do not used energy conserving oil, but says to use MB oil, witch is basically the same thing.
I was disappointed there was not oil filter on this engine
_________________________
Previous vehicle 2008 Pontiac G5 OLM and factory oil's mostly.
Currently 2013 GMC Terrain 2.4L FWD.
2012 Piaggio Fly 50 4T 4V. 2013 Honda PCX 150

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#3116483 - 09/06/13 07:10 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: OriginalRocket]
Phishin Offline


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.


I never have had to adjust my valves. My engine doesn't wear.

To the OP....it's a quart of oil. If you feel like changing your oil every 500-800 miles is a waste, then drain it into a very clean container. I run my oil through a coffee filter, and then use it in other vehicles.

I run a 50/50 mix of M1 Racing 0w50 (about $20/quart) and M1 0w20AFE (about $5/quart). So, even though my Ruckus only uses 0.7 quart per OCI and there is no oil filter, I still have about $10 in an oil change. The ester-based M1 Ow50 mixed with AFE is a good top off oil for nearly any vehicle/engine. So, I use it in other stuff since it only has a few hundred miles on it.
_________________________
2010 Accord-LX K24: PU 5w30
2009 Subaru Forester 2.5X: M1 5w40 TDT
1990 Chevy K1500 350TBI: Frankenbrew
2008 Ruckus 50ccGET: M1R Mix

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#3119061 - 09/09/13 12:14 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: OriginalRocket]
jkhawaii Offline


Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 446
Loc: Oahu
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Mr phishin and I have had this discussion before.

While I agree with most of what he has said, I don't agree with the frequent OCI.

I have the original PCX 125cc (2011)

Honda SPECS 5000 miles for this. I don't dare go that far. I change every 2000 miles. Make sure your air filter is a good fit, and change it at the recommended intervals.

The screen "filter" basically stops break in metals from destroying the engine. I've cleaned it every oil change and only on the first initial 600 mile did I find anything in it.

As for the oil to use, this is a dry clutch engine, and no shared transmission/gears. Run any 10w30 you like as long as it meets or exceeds the rating grade, (SG?)

The oil change is about .95 quarts, So I buy 1 quart bottles and use all of it. I've ran everything, GTX, Mobil 1, Penz Ultra, Rotella, Amzoil and now I have Redline 10w30. None have changed the feel of the engine, none have given me better or worse fuel millage. None come out of the drain hole any different.

I'm fast approaching 10,000 miles on my scooter. Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.

I plan on using a MA Synthetic Motorcycle oil and following the manufactures recommendation of 5,000 miles or 1 year (with my current commute that would be 2,500-3,500 miles)
I have Dimple Magnetic drain plug coming in to. bugs me that this engine has no true oil filter
_________________________
Previous vehicle 2008 Pontiac G5 OLM and factory oil's mostly.
Currently 2013 GMC Terrain 2.4L FWD.
2012 Piaggio Fly 50 4T 4V. 2013 Honda PCX 150

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#3119062 - 09/09/13 12:19 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: Phishin]
jkhawaii Offline


Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 446
Loc: Oahu
Originally Posted By: Phishin
Originally Posted By: OriginalRocket
Just do the valves at the 600, and again at the 2500. After that maintenance on these scooters is super easy.


I never have had to adjust my valves. My engine doesn't wear.


Yeah. Valve adjustment intervals per Honda are crazy! I would not be surprised if the dealer charges to check them and never takes the valve covers off. I'm a Automotive dealer Tech, it's hard to trust other dealer techs with your vehicle. Never know if your going to get one of the techs that really cares about doing the job right or, the hack that only cares about making money.
_________________________
Previous vehicle 2008 Pontiac G5 OLM and factory oil's mostly.
Currently 2013 GMC Terrain 2.4L FWD.
2012 Piaggio Fly 50 4T 4V. 2013 Honda PCX 150

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#3119527 - 09/09/13 01:06 PM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
BusyLittleShop Offline


Registered: 12/09/11
Posts: 251
Loc: Ca USA
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
its funny that the manual says do not used energy conserving oil, but says to use MB oil, witch is basically the same thing.


It is funny because Energy Conserving is not additive... its an API test
that this "oil may result is an overall saving of fuel in the vehicle fleet as a whole"...

Technically speaking Energy Conserving tested oil can not defeat a wet
clutch in good working order... what is confusing the issue is the
fact that all motorcycle wet clutches will reach a point in their life
and start to slip... no one complains about clutch slip when the bike
is new... but on about the 27K to 57K range is when containments may
build up to point where the clutch begins to loose its grip... this is
usually discovered by the owner during WFO (Wide Fooking Open)throttle
like at a track day... in error one can blame the oil but its really
the contaminants on the clutch plates...

So the notion that we should stay away from EC oil is on shaky
ground... fact is I've been using 10/30 Energy Conserving Mobil 1
since 98 in Mr.RC45 with no clutch slipping due to oil being certified
10% freer flowing than non EC oil... and we're talking about Honda's
homologated racer with a tall first gear good for 90mph that's known
to incinerate clutch plates...
_________________________
Larry L
Have a Wheelie NICE day
94 RC45 #2 58,000 on 30 weights Currently Mobil 1 0W30
2002 Camaro Mobil 1 0W30
1952 De Havilland Chipmunk




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#3120242 - 09/10/13 07:40 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
Phishin Offline


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii

Yeah. Valve adjustment intervals per Honda are crazy! I would not be surprised if the dealer charges to check them and never takes the valve covers off. I'm a Automotive dealer Tech, it's hard to trust other dealer techs with your vehicle. Never know if your going to get one of the techs that really cares about doing the job right or, the hack that only cares about making money.


First of all....please don't take your scooter into a Honda dealer and have your valves adjusted for no reason.

There are two reasons to have your valves adjusted:
1.) They are noisy (valve lash too loose...common on intake valve)
2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)

If your scooter fires right up and is really quiet....of course they are going to charge you $200 and NOT do a thing....it's the price you pay for not knowing anything about your bike.

Adjust the valves when you need to...not because a book told you so.
_________________________
2010 Accord-LX K24: PU 5w30
2009 Subaru Forester 2.5X: M1 5w40 TDT
1990 Chevy K1500 350TBI: Frankenbrew
2008 Ruckus 50ccGET: M1R Mix

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#3120336 - 09/10/13 09:35 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: Phishin]
sunruh Offline


Registered: 06/28/05
Posts: 1631
Loc: Cedar Park, TX
Originally Posted By: Phishin

2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)


depending on the motor...this is very incorrect information. usually it is the intake valves that are too tight. i reference the honda crf250, kawaski kxf250, suzuki rmz250 and yamaha yz250f (along with the 450 lines of these) as prime examples.
_________________________
motorcycle oil myth buster

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#3120579 - 09/10/13 02:15 PM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: sunruh]
Phishin Offline


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: sunruh
Originally Posted By: Phishin

2.) Your scooter is hard to start (valve lash too tight....valves can't close all the way, you loose compression at start-up...common on the exhaust valve)


depending on the motor...this is very incorrect information. usually it is the intake valves that are too tight. i reference the honda crf250, kawaski kxf250, suzuki rmz250 and yamaha yz250f (along with the 450 lines of these) as prime examples.


You are correct sunruh....I switched them around by accident.

It's usually your intake valve that gets too tight and your exhaust can get loose. I didn't catch my mistake until you pointed it out. Thank you for the correction. I don't want to spread bad info.

Regardless, I wouldn't suggest you pay someone to adjust your valves until you have evidence that it's needed. And if you go 3k mile OCI's on this scoot using PCMO 30 weight oil...you'll probably need it done anyway.

Shorten your OCI up to 800 miles, use a 40 weight oil...any 0w40, 5w40, 10w40, or even 15w40 since your in Hawaii, and you shouldn't have to ever adjust those valves. Especially if you change the oil often when breaking the scooter in. During break in....I like to change the oil in my Honda scooters at 50, 200, and then 500 miles. Then do my typical 600 miles OCI from then on.


Edited by Phishin (09/10/13 02:19 PM)
_________________________
2010 Accord-LX K24: PU 5w30
2009 Subaru Forester 2.5X: M1 5w40 TDT
1990 Chevy K1500 350TBI: Frankenbrew
2008 Ruckus 50ccGET: M1R Mix

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#3121360 - 09/11/13 10:07 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
jkhawaii Offline


Registered: 06/03/05
Posts: 446
Loc: Oahu
Thanks for every one's input, and opinion's. I found that Bel-Ray, and Lucus make Jaso MB motorcycle oil's, in addition to Honda.


Edited by jkhawaii (09/11/13 10:10 AM)
_________________________
Previous vehicle 2008 Pontiac G5 OLM and factory oil's mostly.
Currently 2013 GMC Terrain 2.4L FWD.
2012 Piaggio Fly 50 4T 4V. 2013 Honda PCX 150

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#3121398 - 09/11/13 11:01 AM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
Phishin Offline


Registered: 05/01/12
Posts: 1482
Loc: Indiana
Originally Posted By: jkhawaii
Thanks for every one's input, and opinion's. I found that Bel-Ray, and Lucus make Jaso MB motorcycle oil's, in addition to Honda.


Come on bro. Stay away from Bel-Ray and Lucas oils. They are overpriced and junk.

Forget the Jaso MB approval. You'd be better off running 10w40 Valvoline or Pennzoil conventional oils than Lucas and Barf-Ray (VWB and PYB are far superior to those other oils).

Why are you so concerned with the MB approval?


Edited by Phishin (09/11/13 11:02 AM)
_________________________
2010 Accord-LX K24: PU 5w30
2009 Subaru Forester 2.5X: M1 5w40 TDT
1990 Chevy K1500 350TBI: Frankenbrew
2008 Ruckus 50ccGET: M1R Mix

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#3121732 - 09/11/13 04:35 PM Re: Honda PCX 150 calls for jaso MB [Re: jkhawaii]
kmrcstintn Offline


Registered: 05/11/06
Posts: 353
Loc: Palmyra, PA
Honda brand motorcycle oil with JASO MB rating...the one that comes to mind is the synthetic blend WITH MOLY; I'm guessing that Honda PCX probably uses a dry clutch design and they might spec for an MB oil to have extra wear preventing additives (MOLY) than a JASO MA or MA2 oil would have; just a thought...

if it were my scooter I would opt for a reasonably priced full synthetic like Super Tech, Quaker State Ultimate Durability, or Mobil Super full synthetic (unless your dealer/Honda Corp can prove to you that NOT using their oil will void the warranty)

my personal scooter calls for 15w-40 or a 'quality motorycle oil'; oil change intervals are 2000 miles with filter replacement every 4000 miles; I also have magnetic crain plugs installed; I want to use a full synthetic since I have to keep it in the upper half of the power band alot, but didn't want to pay $11-13 per quart of motorycle specific oil...I settled on Amsoil 10w-40 synthetic scooter oil that costs me $8.17/qt at my Genuine Scooter dealer;

my point is to choose something better than conventional automobile oil, but why pay top dollar for oil that you're not gonna use to its full potential; choose a good synthetic 10w-30 that won't break the bank...heck, you can get Mobil 1 or Castrol Syntec or Pennzoil Platinum at Walmart for $6.79/qt if you wanted 'top tier' oil


Edited by kmrcstintn (09/11/13 04:43 PM)
_________________________
2011 Jeep Liberty Sport (3.7L V-6), 2009 Suzuki GZ250 (249cc air-cooled single cylinder), 2006 Honda Shadow Aero 750 (745cc liquid-cooled v twin)

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