Semi-Synthetic Mercon V

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Also, NAPA's website claims Valvoline Mercon V is a FULL SYNTHETIC fluid.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Catalo...R360_0120606896

AZ claims it's a semi-syn fluid.

http://www.autozone.com/autozone/accesso...ier=618595_0_0_

I'm so confused!
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Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I wasn't sure but I thought ALL Mercon V fluid was a syn-blend. While looking around for Mercon V fluid I came across Coastal Mercon V syn-blend fluid.



I'm not sure your statement delineates any difference ...
If I understand your quote above, you're not sure if a "syn-blend" is a "syn-blend"?

Napa's fluid (made by Ashland) is a "synthetic" by their definition; most suspect it's a high-quality group III. Some folks say that's not a "true synthetic". Others contend that "synthetic" is only a word, and many products can fit a wide definition. So, depending upon your point of view, it may or may not be. The "syn-blend" products such as many house brands and some brand-name products, are what most of us would call "semi-synthetics".

Mercon V licenses do not require a "full" synthetic. If a product offering is "synthetic" and not "semi" that is only by their choosing.

Here's an easy litmus test: is it licensed? If so, it's fine. Mercon licensed products assure the performance and/or chemistry intent of the spec is intact. 'Nuff said.

You spend way too much time worrying about the semantics of the product marketing statements and such (lubes, filters, etc). But then again, this is BITOG ...
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BOF, be careful with Valvoline.

The PDS linked on the NAPA site, dated 10/26/11, claims "Valvoline MERCON®V ATF is officially licensed and Ford-approved", which I know USED to be true, as I have used it in the past. Surf to Valvoline's own site, however, and you see the following:

"Ford and MERCON V are registered trademarks of Ford Motor Company. This is not a licensed Ford product."

Since it isn't licensed, they aren't allowed to call it Mercon V anymore, so they weasel around that by calling it "ATF for MERCON® V applications".

Valvoline has lost a few rungs on my respect ladder.
 
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
I wasn't sure but I thought ALL Mercon V fluid was a syn-blend.While looking around for Mercon V fluid I came across Coastal Mercon V syn-blend fluid.



I'm not sure your statement delineates any difference ...
If I understand your quote above, you're not sure if a "syn-blend" is a "syn-blend"?

While doing a search on Mercon fluids, at roughly 2-3 AM CT, I was comparing V to SP and LV. Then, as I was looking on AZ's website and it stated COASTAL MERCON V is a semi-synthetic fluid. No other fluids claim this. That is why (see underlined sentence above) "I thought ALL Mercon V fluid was semi-synthetic." COASTAL MERCON V is the ONLY fluid I came across that actually states on its container that it's a semi-synthetic fluid.
So, all Mercon V fluid, besides COASTAL, are NOT semi-synthetic?
 
The way that I understand it, all Mercon V fluids are at least a semi-syn but some of them are full syn. There won't be a conventional Mercon V fluid.

Coastal is just putting it on the bottle as a selling point for those that don't know Mercon V will always be a semi-syn.
 
Originally Posted By: threeputtpar
The way that I understand it, all Mercon V fluids are at least a semi-syn but some of them are full syn. There won't be a conventional Mercon V fluid.

Coastal is just putting it on the bottle as a selling point for those that don't know Mercon V will always be a semi-syn.


^that.

By definition, Mercon V is at least semi-synthetic.
 
I agree with threeputtpar and AP9, but I don't think the Mercon V spec actually defines what the base stock must be. My understanding is that conventional fluid generally won't meet the spec so by default all Mercon V is at least semi-syn.
 
Yes - I think the correct way to conceptually grasp this is that Mercon V fluids will be "at least" a semi-syn. Some products may be "upgraded" to a full syn (reagardless of group) by the maker, depending upon their particular marketing strategy.

I'm not aware of any conventional stock product that meets Mercon V, but not because of a specific base stock requirment, rather principal characteristics of the Ford spec that exclude lower grade base stocks from succeeding. IOW, perhaps a vis spread or temp range, etc. As far as I can tell any semi-syn or above would qualify, if submitted and validated to meet the chemistry/performance criteria. Therefore, typically a "synthetic" (III or IV) would pass if the other criteria were met.

Of course, you have to wonder just how much of a semi-syn (by percentage of blend) would pass versus fail. I have no idea. But then again, I don't care that much. A licensed fluid will be fine by me. Or, a fluid from a reputable manaufacturer that assures "same as" performance.
 
I do know on the back of the Supertech Mercon V bottles I have used in the past it stated it was not synthetic or blend.
From WM website:
"Utilizes a unique combination of conventional base stocks and an advanced additive technology
Meets the performance requirements of Ford automatic transmissions calling for MERCON V fluid"
 
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Yes - I think the correct way to conceptually grasp this is that Mercon V fluids will be "at least" a semi-syn. Some products may be "upgraded" to a full syn (reagardless of group) by the maker, depending upon their particular marketing strategy.

I'm not aware of any conventional stock product that meets Mercon V, but not because of a specific base stock requirment, rather principal characteristics of the Ford spec that exclude lower grade base stocks from succeeding. IOW, perhaps a vis spread or temp range, etc. As far as I can tell any semi-syn or above would qualify, if submitted and validated to meet the chemistry/performance criteria. Therefore, typically a "synthetic" (III or IV) would pass if the other criteria were met.

Of course, you have to wonder just how much of a semi-syn (by percentage of blend) would pass versus fail. I have no idea. But then again, I don't care that much. A licensed fluid will be fine by me. Or, a fluid from a reputable manaufacturer that assures "same as" performance.


Originally Posted By: sonofbumperbolt
I do know on the back of the Supertech Mercon V bottles I have used in the past it stated it was not synthetic or blend.
From WM website:
"Utilizes a unique combination of conventional base stocks and an advanced additive technology
Meets the performance requirements of Ford automatic transmissions calling for MERCON V fluid"

DN3, do you think ST fluid is a syn-blend? Or, in the past was not but is now? From my understanding of your reply Mercon V is too complex to be just a conventional fluid. Is this correct?
 
I have no idea if it (the ST brand) is a semi-syn or a full syn, or a psuedo-syn. It was licensed, last time I checked.
 
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Originally Posted By: dnewton3
I have no idea if it (the ST brand) is a semi-syn or a full syn, or a psuedo-syn. It was licensed, last time I checked.


Besides meeting Ford specs because it's licensed, do Ford specs also require it to be made the same as Motorcfraft/Ford Mercon V fluid? If so, is MC MV a semi-syn fluid?
 
Ford would license anything that met the following criteria:
1) applied for the license
2) met any/all performance attributes for the engineering spec
3) met any/all chemical attributes for the engineering spec
4) met any/all construct attributes for the engineering spec
5) agreed to any legal mumbo-jumbo in the license agreement regarding labeling, marketing, delivery, fiscal exchange, etc


To the best of my understanding, the Motorcraft Mercon V is a semi-syn fluid.
To the best of my understanding, no conventional base stock would pass the combination of specs for Mercon V licensing.
To the best of my understanding, there is no requirement that any product be identical to the Motorcraft offering; they could be "better" or "worse", but as long as they passed the license criteria, they would be approved.
To the best of my understanding, the way something is "made" might refer to either:
a) the method in which it's produced (example: both tables have legs that were "made" on the same lathe)
b) the inference of the final state of a product (example: both tables have legs "made" from oak)
and therefore I cannot comment on what you seek; you're question is too vague.


In this thread, you seek info regarding the Coastal Mercon V; it's likely a semi-syn. We have no idea how much of that product is what portion of which base stock. (Is it 10% syn, 30% syn, 50% syn of the total volume?) We have no idea. But the same can be said of the Motorcraft branded Mercon V also. We also know that other products may be "upgraded" versions because they claim to be fully "synthetic" (but don't explain if that's group III or IV, or a "blend" of III and IV, etc). There is a large list of licensed Mercon V products; they have met all the criteria and are officially approved by Ford.

There are also non-licensed products that would also work extremely well in Mercon V applications, but for a variety of individual reasons, the entities that market those products choose not to submit their products for license validation. While some folks love to speculate as to why, we know nothing other that what we see at face value. Products from Amsoil, RL, RP, and now even some products from Valvoline and Mobil, are taking the approach that they can offers excellent products but still have some savings from not buying the license. That does not void the warranty that they offer, it only shifts the burden of proof unto the user and the producer, rather than the OEM, should there be the remote and unlikely lube-related failure.


Past that, I'm not really sure what more I can tell you that would satiate your desire.
 
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Considering that there is a formal Mercon V license hurdle that any Mercon V fluid needs to pass, I'd probably just buy whatever is cheaper. O'Relly stores can get you Ford's Motorcraft Mercon V for $5 a quart if you buy a box. Otherwise, Walmart's SuperTech is probably just fine.
 
Just to add some fuel to the fire, here is the info on the Synthetic Blend Motorcraft Mercon V https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=Synthetic%20Blend%20MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid

Then there is the Motorcraft Mercon V
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid
 
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Just to add some fuel to the fire, here is the info on the Synthetic Blend Motorcraft Mercon V https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=Synthetic%20Blend%20MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid

Then there is the Motorcraft Mercon V
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid

There are no links.
 
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Just to add some fuel to the fire, here is the info on the Synthetic Blend Motorcraft Mercon V https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=Synthetic%20Blend%20MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid

Then there is the Motorcraft Mercon V
https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/product.asp?product=MERCON%AE%20V%20Automatic%20Transmission%20and%20Power%20Steering%20Fluid&category=Transmission%20Fluid

There are no links.


you have to copy and paste, its off of https://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubricants.com/main/
 
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