Re-thinking 9/11 and building WTC 7

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Originally Posted By: Garak
Mola, the thermal energy and heat came from alien energy rays, and had nothing to do with jet fuel or demolitions explosives. I thought you knew better than that.
wink.gif


See, my "explanation" is better. If someone claims the collapse started on the top, bottom, or middle, it doesn't matter, since aliens can aim the beam wherever they want. If someone claims there's not enough energy between the kinetic and chemical energy, the alien energy ray provided that top up! The best part is, it can't be disproved. Can I have my Nobel Prize now?
wink.gif



Your ticket for the flight to Sweden is on its way via the next available alien spacecraft.
 
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Okay, PM me when they come so I don't miss the trip. Before that happens, I should quit shaving my head and let it grow out and hairspray it up or whatever it is that silly fellow on Ancient Aliens does to his hair. Or, they can blast me with the ray on the way to the awards ceremony and that might do it.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
Okay, PM me when they come so I don't miss the trip. Before that happens, I should quit shaving my head and let it grow out and hairspray it up or whatever it is that silly fellow on Ancient Aliens does to his hair. Or, they can blast me with the ray on the way to the awards ceremony and that might do it.


You won't miss it. They already know where you are.
 
Wasn't Dec 21st last year to be the end of the world? Mayans blew that one. (Or rather all those people who said it would.)
 
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
...... I'm sure there must be a hieroglyph somewhere that resembles the towers.


You can fold a $20 certain ways and it'll show the twin towers burning. That surely means our forefathers knew it was coming, that in turn proves the govt knew about it!!!
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
...... I'm sure there must be a hieroglyph somewhere that resembles the towers.


You can fold a $20 certain ways and it'll show the twin towers burning. That surely means our forefathers knew it was coming, that in turn proves the govt knew about it!!!


http://www.conspiracies.net/
 
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Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Excellent topic. Richard Gage is right, you don't get a 110 story building to collapse neatly in on its own foot print in 10 seconds flat without explosives; it's physically impossible. The American people can't stomach the idea of their own government bringing those buildings down; so what they have done is put up psychological defense mechanisms to protect themselves mentally.
This! Only someone without common sense will not listen to this. It's physically impossible, not even counting the FACT that ground level people stated that they heard bombs go off. Plenty of videos to confirm this. I wonder what some of these people would say if all of this happended during this admin hmmm....heck those idiots already think he is the anti-[censored] and not an US citizen smh.
 
Originally Posted By: Trajan

Logic. Kryptonite to conspiracy theorist.


You can call me a conspiracy theorist if you want to, but the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind. I've done a lot of work with heavy steel plate. I went to welding class for 2 years and studied structural steel welding. I practiced and practiced welding one inch thick steel plates together as a groove weld until it would pass a bend test. Even 3/4 inch thick steel plate is extremely strong. The only way to cut that is either with a liquid cooled band saw or a cutting torch. If I had a wall made out of 3/4 inch thick steel plate, a jetliner would smash up into a little ball and bounce off. There's a reason why bulldozers and tanks are made out of heavy steel plate.
 
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
...the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind.

Provide a logical explanation for what appears to be your alternative theory, to include:
1) how and when the explosives were installed in the buildings such that there are no witnesses to the work and none of the workers have spilled the beans.
2) how the design of that demolition was conducted without anyone involved spilling the beans. This is quite an unusual professional specialty and I imagine there are a limited number of companies and academics who practice it.

Hand-waving about an all-powerful shadow government will not suffice. The design and implementation of a controlled demolition of those three buildings would have been a tremendous undertaking requiring a lot of material, time, manpower, and expertise. It's illogical to believe it could have been pulled off without a trace of evidence.

And FWIW, while I consider welding to be a true craft, your limited experience with it isn't much basis for reaching the conclusion you have. I tend to believe the reports from experts such as NIST and ASCE (yeah, yeah, I know they're government controlled lapdogs) who have provided meticulous explanations for why what you consider impossible did in fact occur.

jeff
 
Originally Posted By: Trajan
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
...... I'm sure there must be a hieroglyph somewhere that resembles the towers.


You can fold a $20 certain ways and it'll show the twin towers burning. That surely means our forefathers knew it was coming, that in turn proves the govt knew about it!!!




http://www.conspiracies.net/



LMAO!! Yup, the Government knew!!
crackmeup2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: Trajan
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
...... I'm sure there must be a hieroglyph somewhere that resembles the towers.


You can fold a $20 certain ways and it'll show the twin towers burning. That surely means our forefathers knew it was coming, that in turn proves the govt knew about it!!!




http://www.conspiracies.net/



LMAO!! Yup, the Government knew!!
crackmeup2.gif



9 + 11 = 20... I rest my case...
crackmeup2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Trajan

Logic. Kryptonite to conspiracy theorist.


You can call me a conspiracy theorist if you want to, but the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind. I've done a lot of work with heavy steel plate. I went to welding class for 2 years and studied structural steel welding. I practiced and practiced welding one inch thick steel plates together as a groove weld until it would pass a bend test. Even 3/4 inch thick steel plate is extremely strong. The only way to cut that is either with a liquid cooled band saw or a cutting torch. If I had a wall made out of 3/4 inch thick steel plate, a jetliner would smash up into a little ball and bounce off. There's a reason why bulldozers and tanks are made out of heavy steel plate.


Really...Think this through.. I can bend the frame on an old Ford I-beam truck but jumping a small ditch or having a head on collision. The I-Beam is made of steel - And steel bends, even without fire.

Now, take a Boeing 757. It weighs in at 127-140,000LBS (dependent on model)EMPTY. Now add the weight of cargo, luggage, people, 10,000 Gallons of fuel at roughly 7 Lbs per gallon. Take that and add it all up. Now push that total weight at 530MPH into a steel I-Beam of the type made for buildings and see if it doesn't buckle. Sorry, but even that is not strong enough to stay intact. The following is a summary of how the support structure of the WTC building was different than other buildings:

"The most significant advancement in the World Trade Center's design had to do with the towers' steel framework. Instead of spacing the vertical support beams evenly across the floors, the designers moved all of them to the exterior walls and the central core of the structure. These columns supported all of the buildings' weight, but without lateral, or side-to-side, support from the floors, these columns would have buckled. The floors were built upon trusses, which bridged the distance between the exterior and core columns. Connected with two bolts on each end, these spans of rigid steel framework prevented the columns from bowing inward or outward. They also supported a 4-inch-thick (10 centimeters) floor made of reinforced concrete (reinforced concrete is embedded with steel for increased strength). Spray-on fireproofing, made from material similar to the rolled insulation in your home, further protected the integrity of the steel floor trusses, while the central columns were shielded by fire-resistant drywall. This economical design required less concrete and created nearly an acre of rentable office space on each of the buildings' 110 floors."

Once the planes compromised the outer walls and the floors, the buildings failed. AS for the supposed "explosions" and dust puffs seen coming from the floors as they collapsed, have you ever dropped a book onto a dusty rug or powdery dirt floor? Guess what, it puffs the same way, try it for yourself.
 
Originally Posted By: greenjp

1) how and when the explosives were installed in the buildings such that there are no witnesses to the work and none of the workers have spilled the beans.
2) how the design of that demolition was conducted without anyone involved spilling the beans. This is quite an unusual professional specialty and I imagine there are a limited number of companies and academics who practice it.
jeff


Again I'm trying to look at the whole thing logically and the whole argument that "someone would've talked" just doesn't hold water with me.

Just look at the countless military black projects that we only are beginning to know about after the documents have been declassified decades after the fact.
I was watching a program about the SR-71 Blackbird development and how fairly easily it was kept secret. Thousands of civilians worked on the development, not just military personnel. During the test flights when the prototype was spotted by civilian jetliners, FBI agents were waiting at the landing airport and making all passengers and crew sign waivers that they would not mention this event to anyone.
They also took full advantage of the UFO phenomenon so popular at the time.

I think it's relatively easy for the government agencies to keep secrets from us because even if someone does come out, they will either ruin the person financially or make them a conspiracy nutcase or in many cases both.

Not saying that's the case here, but it surely was and still is actively being done at all levels of government.
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Trajan

Logic. Kryptonite to conspiracy theorist.


You can call me a conspiracy theorist if you want to, but the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind. I've done a lot of work with heavy steel plate. I went to welding class for 2 years and studied structural steel welding. I practiced and practiced welding one inch thick steel plates together as a groove weld until it would pass a bend test. Even 3/4 inch thick steel plate is extremely strong. The only way to cut that is either with a liquid cooled band saw or a cutting torch. If I had a wall made out of 3/4 inch thick steel plate, a jetliner would smash up into a little ball and bounce off. There's a reason why bulldozers and tanks are made out of heavy steel plate.


Really...Think this through.. I can bend the frame on an old Ford I-beam truck but jumping a small ditch or having a head on collision. The I-Beam is made of steel - And steel bends, even without fire.

Now, take a Boeing 757. It weighs in at 127-140,000LBS (dependent on model)EMPTY. Now add the weight of cargo, luggage, people, 10,000 Gallons of fuel at roughly 7 Lbs per gallon. Take that and add it all up. Now push that total weight at 530MPH into a steel I-Beam of the type made for buildings and see if it doesn't buckle. Sorry, but even that is not strong enough to stay intact. The following is a summary of how the support structure of the WTC building was different than other buildings:

"The most significant advancement in the World Trade Center's design had to do with the towers' steel framework. Instead of spacing the vertical support beams evenly across the floors, the designers moved all of them to the exterior walls and the central core of the structure. These columns supported all of the buildings' weight, but without lateral, or side-to-side, support from the floors, these columns would have buckled. The floors were built upon trusses, which bridged the distance between the exterior and core columns. Connected with two bolts on each end, these spans of rigid steel framework prevented the columns from bowing inward or outward. They also supported a 4-inch-thick (10 centimeters) floor made of reinforced concrete (reinforced concrete is embedded with steel for increased strength). Spray-on fireproofing, made from material similar to the rolled insulation in your home, further protected the integrity of the steel floor trusses, while the central columns were shielded by fire-resistant drywall. This economical design required less concrete and created nearly an acre of rentable office space on each of the buildings' 110 floors."

Once the planes compromised the outer walls and the floors, the buildings failed. AS for the supposed "explosions" and dust puffs seen coming from the floors as they collapsed, have you ever dropped a book onto a dusty rug or powdery dirt floor? Guess what, it puffs the same way, try it for yourself.


Again with the facts....
spankme2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: greenjp
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
...the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind.

Provide a logical explanation for what appears to be your alternative theory, to include:
1) how and when the explosives were installed in the buildings such that there are no witnesses to the work and none of the workers have spilled the beans.
2) how the design of that demolition was conducted without anyone involved spilling the beans. This is quite an unusual professional specialty and I imagine there are a limited number of companies and academics who practice it.

Hand-waving about an all-powerful shadow government will not suffice. The design and implementation of a controlled demolition of those three buildings would have been a tremendous undertaking requiring a lot of material, time, manpower, and expertise. It's illogical to believe it could have been pulled off without a trace of evidence.

And FWIW, while I consider welding to be a true craft, your limited experience with it isn't much basis for reaching the conclusion you have. I tend to believe the reports from experts such as NIST and ASCE (yeah, yeah, I know they're government controlled lapdogs) who have provided meticulous explanations for why what you consider impossible did in fact occur.

jeff
.. the pre-supposition of these reports are "the gov't can do no harm".. to think otherwise would have you removed from having anything to do with the final reports..the end result determined by politicians of the same view or understanding...thus the need for a reinvestigation as mentioned on page 1
 
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
I think it's relatively easy for the government agencies to keep secrets from us because even if someone does come out, they will either ruin the person financially or make them a conspiracy nutcase or in many cases both.
Like one Adam Lanza or James Holmes perhaps...MKUltra comes to mind...
 
Originally Posted By: Propflux01
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: Trajan

Logic. Kryptonite to conspiracy theorist.


You can call me a conspiracy theorist if you want to, but the notion that airplanes made those buildings come down is not logical in my mind. I've done a lot of work with heavy steel plate. I went to welding class for 2 years and studied structural steel welding. I practiced and practiced welding one inch thick steel plates together as a groove weld until it would pass a bend test. Even 3/4 inch thick steel plate is extremely strong. The only way to cut that is either with a liquid cooled band saw or a cutting torch. If I had a wall made out of 3/4 inch thick steel plate, a jetliner would smash up into a little ball and bounce off. There's a reason why bulldozers and tanks are made out of heavy steel plate.


Really...Think this through.. I can bend the frame on an old Ford I-beam truck but jumping a small ditch or having a head on collision. The I-Beam is made of steel - And steel bends, even without fire.

Now, take a Boeing 757. It weighs in at 127-140,000LBS (dependent on model)EMPTY. Now add the weight of cargo, luggage, people, 10,000 Gallons of fuel at roughly 7 Lbs per gallon. Take that and add it all up. Now push that total weight at 530MPH into a steel I-Beam of the type made for buildings and see if it doesn't buckle. Sorry, but even that is not strong enough to stay intact. The following is a summary of how the support structure of the WTC building was different than other buildings:

"The most significant advancement in the World Trade Center's design had to do with the towers' steel framework. Instead of spacing the vertical support beams evenly across the floors, the designers moved all of them to the exterior walls and the central core of the structure. These columns supported all of the buildings' weight, but without lateral, or side-to-side, support from the floors, these columns would have buckled. The floors were built upon trusses, which bridged the distance between the exterior and core columns. Connected with two bolts on each end, these spans of rigid steel framework prevented the columns from bowing inward or outward. They also supported a 4-inch-thick (10 centimeters) floor made of reinforced concrete (reinforced concrete is embedded with steel for increased strength). Spray-on fireproofing, made from material similar to the rolled insulation in your home, further protected the integrity of the steel floor trusses, while the central columns were shielded by fire-resistant drywall. This economical design required less concrete and created nearly an acre of rentable office space on each of the buildings' 110 floors."

Once the planes compromised the outer walls and the floors, the buildings failed. AS for the supposed "explosions" and dust puffs seen coming from the floors as they collapsed, have you ever dropped a book onto a dusty rug or powdery dirt floor? Guess what, it puffs the same way, try it for yourself.
..I haven't heard this explanation before and have no way of determining if the above explanation is even possible ( I couldn't build a bird house if I wanted to )...here's my question(s)...can you explain how Richard Gage and his 2000+ architechs/builders do not accept what you have said..is it even possible that they are not aware of the advanced design of that time ...apparently they would like to challenge the gov't position on just how those buildings came down..no conspiracy here
 
this thread has deviated from the original question about WTC7.."free falling" in less then 10 seconds onto its own foot print...
 
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