Might be a dumb question, but is non-detergent oil acceptable in lawnmowers? Of course I know they should never be used in a modern car engine, but would they really hurt a mower? I just got a case of ND 40 wt. for free...
Non -detergent in a lawnmower???
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Check out this thread:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=483370
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=483370
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Lawn mowers do much better with synthetic oil, most current manufacturers now recommend it.
One of the comments in my thread I cited said that NON-DETERGENT OIL ONLY SHOULD BE PUT IN A WORK BENCH OIL CAN !
One of the comments in my thread I cited said that NON-DETERGENT OIL ONLY SHOULD BE PUT IN A WORK BENCH OIL CAN !
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Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Agree : though if your so low , ie: barely reading on the dipstick , it would be wise to add even non-detergent 30 until your usual oil can be found , or change the oil and filter.
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Agree : though if your so low , ie: barely reading on the dipstick , it would be wise to add even non-detergent 30 until your usual oil can be found , or change the oil and filter.
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Non detergent oils are for squirt oil cans and the tilt/trim pump for a Mercruiser boat.
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Now that is the question. Does anyone know? My guess is that they do have anti wear additives. Saw some Shell ND oil at Advance Store yesterday in the lawnmower section.
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Now that is the question. Does anyone know? My guess is that they do have anti wear additives. Saw some Shell ND oil at Advance Store yesterday in the lawnmower section.
Some do some dont, many reputable brands dont (at least on their TDS) You can blend ND oil to be a good lube without phos or Ca overbase, you just have to change more often. The art of blending ND lubes may be lost as the special tower cuts required to blend an oil with good lubricityfor IC engines may not be readily available, as most modern basestocks are cut for use with DP's. IIRC I have some Coastal and A-zone SAE30ND that I ref'd the TDS to insure they have no DP as I was buying for use as a top oil in a modern engine (in the fuel on a 4 stroke) and I didn't want earthmetal compounds near a spark plug or on the cat aftertreatment devices.
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MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: TTK
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Now that is the question. Does anyone know? My guess is that they do have anti wear additives. Saw some Shell ND oil at Advance Store yesterday in the lawnmower section.
I don't know how many times I have repeated this statement on BITOG but here it is again:
ND oils have no protection additives such as anti-wear agents, detergents, anti-rust, anti-oxidants, etc.
ND oils have only a bit of anti-foamant and that is it.
As others have stated, ND Oils do NOT belong in an internal combustion engine's crankcase.
Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Originally Posted By: exranger06
Non-detergent has no place in any internal combustion engine, whether it's a car or lawn mower. It doesn't have any additives to protect the engine and it will wear out much quicker.
Do non-detergent oils really have "no" additives? I understand if they have no detergents, as the name implies, but do they really have no additives? No zinc, no phosphorous, no nothing? Are they really just straight mineral oil with no additives to speak of? In other words, a VOA would show zeros across the board?
Now that is the question. Does anyone know? My guess is that they do have anti wear additives. Saw some Shell ND oil at Advance Store yesterday in the lawnmower section.
I don't know how many times I have repeated this statement on BITOG but here it is again:
ND oils have no protection additives such as anti-wear agents, detergents, anti-rust, anti-oxidants, etc.
ND oils have only a bit of anti-foamant and that is it.
As others have stated, ND Oils do NOT belong in an internal combustion engine's crankcase.
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There are(or at least were) non detergent racing oils that were high in anti wear agents... Since oils oils are changed often in these engines detergents aren't needed...
If we're just talking about a non detergent with SA or maybe SB ratings, it will have little to no additives...
If we're just talking about a non detergent with SA or maybe SB ratings, it will have little to no additives...
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: TFB1
There are(or at least were) non detergent racing oils that were high in anti wear agents... Since oils oils are changed often in these engines detergents aren't needed...
If we're just talking about a non detergent with SA or maybe SB ratings, it will have little to no additives...
I don't think there was any mention in the OP's post about ND racing oils.
The assumption is he was referring to API SA ND oils off-the-shelf.
There are(or at least were) non detergent racing oils that were high in anti wear agents... Since oils oils are changed often in these engines detergents aren't needed...
If we're just talking about a non detergent with SA or maybe SB ratings, it will have little to no additives...
I don't think there was any mention in the OP's post about ND racing oils.
The assumption is he was referring to API SA ND oils off-the-shelf.
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Originally Posted By: Donald
Non detergent oils are for squirt oil cans and the tilt/trim pump for a Mercruiser boat.
And for air compressors. I have no idea why.
Non detergent oils are for squirt oil cans and the tilt/trim pump for a Mercruiser boat.
And for air compressors. I have no idea why.
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: zzyzzx
Originally Posted By: Donald
Non detergent oils are for squirt oil cans and the tilt/trim pump for a Mercruiser boat.
And for air compressors. I have no idea why.
Have you ever seen any combustion take place in an air compressor?
Originally Posted By: Donald
Non detergent oils are for squirt oil cans and the tilt/trim pump for a Mercruiser boat.
And for air compressors. I have no idea why.
Have you ever seen any combustion take place in an air compressor?
MolaKule
Staff member
Doesn't anyone read any other person's posts?
Originally Posted By: wally6934
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
Yes, because they want ND oil.
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
Yes, because they want ND oil.
Originally Posted By: wally6934
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
I believe the concern was possibility of foaming, but I've always used detergent oils in mine without issue... One I bought used in the 80s did later suffer from a rust hole in the tank, wonder if that can be blamed on the detergent oil?
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
I believe the concern was possibility of foaming, but I've always used detergent oils in mine without issue... One I bought used in the 80s did later suffer from a rust hole in the tank, wonder if that can be blamed on the detergent oil?
I am going to use the awful stuff as a chainsaw bar lube, only. I hope that is A-OK, I will have a lifetime supply, LOL. Thank you all.
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: wally6934
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
I believe the concern was possibility of foaming, but I've always used detergent oils in mine without issue... One I bought used in the 80s did later suffer from a rust hole in the tank, wonder if that can be blamed on the detergent oil?
I did some Googling after i posted that question. I found one source that said sometimes the seals used in compressors are not compatible with motor oil. But i have no positive confirmation about that. I do not think it is a foaming problem because motor oil in a splash lubrication system like small engines has to have a good de-foaming agent.
I think the reason no one here knows anything about ND oil is because of the obvious fact that it is not motor oil. So we do not have the right people here.
The hole in your air tank is just from water in the tank. You are supposed to keep it drained. I kind of remember automatic water drains from Ingersoll Rand that operate every time you cycle the air compressor. Otherwise you do i manually when ever you think of it.
I had a 10 HP IR compressor that made gallons of water. I got tired of draining it all the time and let it go for awhile. The tank rusted out in about 10 years.
Originally Posted By: wally6934
I have read that ND oil is used in air compressors. Is this true? and if so is there any reason regular motor oil can not be used.
I believe the concern was possibility of foaming, but I've always used detergent oils in mine without issue... One I bought used in the 80s did later suffer from a rust hole in the tank, wonder if that can be blamed on the detergent oil?
I did some Googling after i posted that question. I found one source that said sometimes the seals used in compressors are not compatible with motor oil. But i have no positive confirmation about that. I do not think it is a foaming problem because motor oil in a splash lubrication system like small engines has to have a good de-foaming agent.
I think the reason no one here knows anything about ND oil is because of the obvious fact that it is not motor oil. So we do not have the right people here.
The hole in your air tank is just from water in the tank. You are supposed to keep it drained. I kind of remember automatic water drains from Ingersoll Rand that operate every time you cycle the air compressor. Otherwise you do i manually when ever you think of it.
I had a 10 HP IR compressor that made gallons of water. I got tired of draining it all the time and let it go for awhile. The tank rusted out in about 10 years.
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