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#3013035 - 05/25/13 11:43 AM 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France
Hi,

i'm a French dude wanting to know few things about engine oils.
Here where i am i don't know peoples with knowledge in this specific domain so i ask here.
Ive read several articles about oil on the net hosted here that's why i come in there.



Here is the intro to the questions.

I have a 240 volvo diesel 6 cylinders 1991 model.
It has a indirect injection engine in it.
It's exactly like a V8 6.2 idi from GM if you know.

There is no emission device on it.
No catalyst or what so ever.


It has been serviced since 1991 with big brands oils like shell total,mobil etc
They were semi synthetic 10w40 or 15w40 like as written in the manual.

changed every 10 000kms (6000 miles) or every year or a bit more.

It has 240 000 kms now.

The car makes very short trips of few kilometers only, several times a day since few years.
Sometimes a normal journey.











I would like to know :

-if there are problems using a thinner grade cold like 5w40 for example.
-if synthetic are okay with this engine.
-if i can use ACEA c1 c2 c3 c4 oils ?
-if the low sulphur and sulphated ashes like in a ACEA "C" rated oil are a problem for my engine ?
Is there any incompatibilities because of the chemical composition that would cause problems on mechanical parts like bearings or anything else ?


Why can i see restrictions use of this type ?

ACEA A5/B5 oils are Upper Mainline lubricants. They are designed for use in high performance gasoline and light duty diesel engines that are specifically designed to use a low viscosity oil. These oils may be unsuitable for use in some engines.



Please don't tell me "stick to semi synthetic oil it's good enough"
I already know that,it's not my goal.


Thank you : )

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#3013045 - 05/25/13 11:52 AM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
Donald Offline


Registered: 03/21/04
Posts: 13346
Loc: Upstate NY
I would use Shell Rotella T6 if available. Its 5W40 around here. It will be fine for almost any diesel engine you will come across. If it starts to leak a little do not worry, that will stop as seals are conditioned.

Your biggest problem will be fuel dilution with short trips and not getting the engine all the way hot. That could also cause the exhaust to not last as long also (not getting it nice and hot to burn off any condensation).
_________________________
2001 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 4.0 - PP & M1
1999 Dodge Ram 2500 w/Cummins - Rotella T6 & M1
Amsoil ATF in both vehicles & Magnefine filter.

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#3013162 - 05/25/13 01:58 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
bullwinkle Online   confused


Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 3979
Loc: Cincinnati, OH, USA
Not sure what is available in France, but my 3 IDIs do just fine on any CH-4, CI-4, CJ-4, or even CF rated HDEO I can find-they aren't that hard on oil, and get changed often enough that soot, etc. isn't a concern. Oil that is recommended for MB 228.1 or other HD diesel engines would be perfect for an older IDI.
_________________________
06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4 48RE SRW, 93 GMC C3500 6.2 diesel, 89 F-450 7.3 IDI, 98 Cherokee 4.0, 05 Scion xB, 82 Mercedes 300D, company van 12 Ford E-250 4.6

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#3013205 - 05/25/13 02:51 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 9195
Loc: OH
IIRC, the engine is a VW and was offered by Volvo in the US during the brief diesel craze of the 'eighties, when you could get a diesel engine in a much greater variety of US market cars than is the case today.
Given its age and era of manufacture, I doubt that it's real picky about oil.
If you can get a diesel rated 5W-40 where you live, that would be a good choice if you truly want to use a synthetic.
This is a pretty low mileage engine for its age, so if the car around it is pretty decent, it's probably worth taking care of.
When I owned my old Mercedes diesels, I just used 10W-40 conventional on short OCIs, since soot loading is extreme with those things, and they seemed to do perfectly fine on that oil.

_________________________
12 Accord LX 22K HGMO 0W-20
09 Forester 64K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 127K G-Oil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 98K Synpower 10W-30
95 BMW 318iC 146K Defy 10W-40

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#3013265 - 05/25/13 04:02 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: Donald]
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: Donald
I would use Shell Rotella T6 if available. Its 5W40 around here. It will be fine for almost any diesel engine you will come across. If it starts to leak a little do not worry, that will stop as seals are conditioned.

Your biggest problem will be fuel dilution with short trips and not getting the engine all the way hot. That could also cause the exhaust to not last as long also (not getting it nice and hot to burn off any condensation).


Yes,fuel dilution,cold running engine bother me,but i'm not the owner,it's a soccer mom car in a little city...
The engine run on cold start advance timing very often,i don't like.
the oil is not gunky just a bit thicker at the oil change,the valve train is very clean.

For the most there are 5w30 here.
No rotella,it's helix for shell if i'm good.

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#3013269 - 05/25/13 04:05 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: bullwinkle]
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: bullwinkle
Not sure what is available in France, but my 3 IDIs do just fine on any CH-4, CI-4, CJ-4, or even CF rated HDEO I can find-they aren't that hard on oil, and get changed often enough that soot, etc. isn't a concern. Oil that is recommended for MB 228.1 or other HD diesel engines would be perfect for an older IDI.


When i wrote C rated oil i wanted to say ACEA C 1 2 3 or 4.
Not API (if it's what you wrote) i'm not sure.

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#3013278 - 05/25/13 04:13 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: fdcg27]
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
IIRC, the engine is a VW and was offered by Volvo in the US during the brief diesel craze of the 'eighties, when you could get a diesel engine in a much greater variety of US market cars than is the case today.
Given its age and era of manufacture, I doubt that it's real picky about oil.
If you can get a diesel rated 5W-40 where you live, that would be a good choice if you truly want to use a synthetic.
This is a pretty low mileage engine for its age, so if the car around it is pretty decent, it's probably worth taking care of.
When I owned my old Mercedes diesels, I just used 10W-40 conventional on short OCIs, since soot loading is extreme with those things, and they seemed to do perfectly fine on that oil.




Yes, VW engine...
d24 type.
That's a "problem" when you speak about coolant with stupid,studborn peoples.
It's my next question in the appropriate topic.

Yes i want to use synthetic.
I will try to find a 5w40 but most of oils here are 5w30.
Yes the car is decent,even if the owners are not as picky as me.
I take care of the things even if they are old unwanted vehicles,that's why i'm here.

i don't know what is a short OCI i guess it's a car wich run short distance ?

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#3013287 - 05/25/13 04:24 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France

Thank you for your answers yet. : )



So i resume : no problems with synthetic and lower viscosity oil like 5w40 if possible.

But what about those ACEA :

C1-04 Petrol and Light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 low SAPS, two way catalyst compatible.
C2-04 Petrol and light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 mid SAPS, two way catalyst compatible.
C3-04 Petrol and light duty Diesel engines, based on A5/B5-04 mid SAPS, two way catalyst compatible, Higher performance levels due to higher HTHS.



Is there incompatibility with internal components like bearings gaskets etc ?

I ask you because i can read about ACEA A5/B5



"These oils may be unsuitable for use in some engines"

?

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#3013356 - 05/25/13 06:13 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
m37charlie Offline


Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 1124
Loc: Alaska
I apologize for my colleagues suggesting oils like Rotella T6 that are only available in N. America.
I would NOT use an ACEA "C" oil, they are low SAPS and you have no need of that. They have low alkalinity and acidify much more quickly.
I would suggest any of the many ACEA A3/B4 oils such as the MB 229.3 and 229.5 lists:
http://bevo.mercedes-benz.com/bevolisten/229.5_en.html.

Charlie
_________________________
05 Unimog U500/Unicat camper/Delvac 1 SHC ACEA E4/E5
09 BMW X5 35d/Delvac1 LE 5W30
01 BMW 325xi M1 0W40
52 Dodge M37/Hercules diesel
79 BJ40 Landcruiser

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#3013387 - 05/25/13 06:38 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
fdcg27 Offline


Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 9195
Loc: OH
"OCI" is oil change interval.
I ran my old Benzes on 3K mile, or 5K kilometer oil changes.
This was also what Mercedes recommended at the time with the oils then available.
I'm pretty sure you can get a 5W-40 synthetic diesel oil in France.
Total, Motul and Mobil all offer these oils in France, although I have no idea how much you'd have to pay for them.
_________________________
12 Accord LX 22K HGMO 0W-20
09 Forester 64K PU 5W-30
02 Accord 127K G-Oil 5W-30
01 Focus ZX3 98K Synpower 10W-30
95 BMW 318iC 146K Defy 10W-40

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#3013589 - 05/26/13 12:02 AM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: fdcg27]
BituminousCoal Offline


Registered: 04/11/12
Posts: 49
Loc: New York
I have a similar VW IDI diesel. I run oversized filter, Schaeffer/Amalie/Mobil 1 TDT 5w40 diesel oil and 5,000 mile changes. Excellent UOA's. I highly recommend switching to 5w40 synthetic - so much better in the cold with an old IDI.

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#3021111 - 06/03/13 03:47 AM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
ac_tc Offline


Registered: 05/06/08
Posts: 512
Loc: sweden
HDEO xw-40 or xw-30 API CI or better if you could find it.
Get it at the local farm store in a 20 l can.
As stated earlier, it aint picky about oil.
( i assume its the 82 hp non turbo six not the 125 hp
turbo version. Not that it really matters, none
of these engines are hard on oil )
The only real concern is the short trips but thats nothing
any oil can do anything about, just shorten the OCI helps.
By the way, check oil level in the gearbox...they are almost
indestructible but doesent like being run dry.
_________________________
-98 Dodge Durango 5.9 4*4 HDEO 10w- 40 ci4
-04 PT Cruser GT 10w- 40 HDEO ci4
-Everything else HDEO 10w- 40 ci4/STOU 10w-30/THF

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#3035298 - 06/16/13 03:31 PM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
Falcon_LS Offline


Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 3481
Loc: Kuwait
For that particular engine, I think Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 would do quite well, as it meets ACEA B3/B4. Only concern would really be price. Other options might be:

- Mobil Super 3000 X1 5W-40
- Fuchs Titan SuperSyn 5W-40
- Liqui Moly Diesel Synthoil 5W-40
- Liqui Moly Synthoil High Tech 5W-40
- Liqui Moly Leichtlauf HC7 5W-40

- Fuchs Titan Syn MC 10W-40
- Fuchs Titan UniMax Ultra MC 10W-40
- Mobil Super 2000 X1 10W-40
- Shell Helix HX7 10W-40
- Liqui Moly Super Leichtlauf 10W-40

If you're really looking for a heavy-duty oil, I would suggest you go with something meeting ACEA E7.
_________________________
00 Pajero: M1 0W-40/26300-35503
01 Marquis: M1 ESP Formula 5W-30/FL820S
05 Envoy: M1 ESP Formula 5W-30/51522XP

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#3065772 - 07/15/13 09:14 AM Re: 1991 Indirect injection diesel / no emissions [Re: polux]
polux Offline


Registered: 05/20/13
Posts: 10
Loc: France
Ok
I answer back to you to thank you for the inputs.

The oil change will be done with 10w40 semi-synthetic Mobil

The owner bought it yet.

However my own car ,identical,will have synthetic 5w40 B4 oil as soon as the generic cheap mineral oil will end its life after the breaking in.

Thank you again : )

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