Toyota 2AZ-FE oil burn

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This seems to be a common problem for those with Toyota 2AZ-FE (4 cylinder, 2.4L) engines. At higher mileages, oil burn suddenly increases. I first noticed this about a year ago when I checked the dipstick and found the oil barely discernible on the low end of the stick. This never happened previously in such a short period.

Ever since I've kept careful notes. All fills listed below were with Mobil 1 HM 5W-30.

05-17-2012 -- 96987 miles -- drained 2.9 qts -- replaced Purolator filter, filled with 4.0 qts
09-02-2012 -- 99219 miles -- dipstick low, added 0.5 quarts
11-25-2012 -- 101550 miles -- dipstick low, added 0.3 quarts
06-04-2013 -- 105970 miles -- drained 3.2 qts -- replaced Purolator filter, filled with 4.0 qts

How much oil are we supposed to get with a drain and filter change, the full 4.0 quarts?

If yes this means it burned 1.6 quarts over the previous 8983 miles...roughly .178 quarts per 1000 miles.
 
Is it leaking oil around the head gasket or losing coolant?
This engine series has a problem with the head bolt threads pulling out of the block.
 
Capacity with filter is 4qts. Cant be exact measuring with a dipstick. All oil doesn't come out whether its been sitting 5 mins or 5 hours. Oil remains absorbed in the filter media. Use 1qt every 5k. Close enough.

You say suddenly. Is that why you switched to M1 HM? How long have you been using M1 HM? What oil was used prior? What year is the engine? Different years, different problems.
 
I was under the impression Purolator PureONE filters do not absorb as much oil. Whenever I change mine, I turn them upside down on the drain pan for several hours to let them drain.

2004 model engine 2AZ-FE

For this drain I jacked up the left front (as if I was changing a tire) and got another 0.2 quarts drained that way.

Been using synthetics exclusively for the last 50K miles. Used PP for a while, then regular M1 synthetic. No reason other than the odometer reading for switching to M1 HM the last two oil changes.

Yes, suddenly in the sense consumption increased dramatically around 90K. Reading the Toyota forums, this seems to be quite common...the consumption problems for many begin at 80K-100K miles. In my case, it was burning at most 0.3-0.5 quarts every 5000 miles up until 90K miles.

No coolant loss. No head gasket leaks. No leaks out the bottom.

I realize the consumption I'm seeing is nowhere near as bad as others are seeing. My question is whether to expect consumption to keep increasing or will it somewhat stabilize for a while? On a side note, I should probably replace the PCV valve as that's never been done on this engine.
 
I don't drain for long periods for every last drop so I don't know exactly how much comes out. Want to avoid dry starts, when most engine wear occurs.

Your going 10k a year, assume local car. Not much heat, should be ok with the stripped thread issue. Drain and fill the coolant if you haven't.

The main oil consumption issues in that year are the valve seals or clogged piston oil return holes. By now, M1 HM has done all it can do for seals. In this engine, a 1 second small puff of blue smoke can be noticed at the tailpipe on a morning start only. It happens fast, will only be noticed if your behind the car when it starts. Have somebody else start it in the morning and watch. if you see the blue puff, have the valve seals replaced.

The piston oil return hole clogging is cumulative from day 1. So its more what happened early in the cars life, not necessarily recent. Because of location, flow, and depth of deposits in the holes, near impossible to remove unless caught early. You can try solvents, but IMO only answer is teardown. Expensive. IMO not worth it.

PCV may help, use an OE only.

Can't say it won't get worse, but mine hasn't in well over 100k. I burn more than you, but M1 HM made consumption lessen over 2 OCI's. Because in my case the valve seals are bad. The cost of repair is not justified in this car so I'm living with it. Burning 1 qt every 3500-4k.

Lastly, not all oil consumption is bad. You get a chance to replenish, which means you can extend the interval longer. Using M1 HM, 1 year/10k is fine. Personal opinion, use a high efficiency extended interval synthetic media oil filter rather than a resin/paper media filter. Better flow longer.
 
OP:
When changing the PCV valve, check the hose...mine was brittle-hard/cracked at each end and needed replacing too ($15 @ dealer)...

I got my 2AZ-FE @97.5K and with PYB 5w-30 it had dropped to 1/3qt down after 3k miles when I switched to PP 5w-30 @ 103k...when I changed plugs, PCV valve/hose, valve cover gasket...

I'd feel your concern too for a loss/burn increase from .5qt/5k miles to .5qt/2500 miles....with PP mine's only bit better @ .5qt/3-3.5k miles....but...

The loss/burn off RATE MAY LESSEN between half-way down to the "L" line and the "L"...at least that's what I've read others have experienced...so what I'm going to do monitor the dipstick and see just how many miles it takes to get to "L"...when it'll get the next OC...this is only my 2nd OCI (the engine's first with synthetic) so I'm not sure what to expect...

I know this is too simple, given your your attention to detail, but since didn't mention it...when you did fill up, was the oil AT the "F" line?...and...
Has you driving changed at all...like more highway miles?
 
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Also if you have no external gasket leaks... In your climate I would try M1 0w40. A thicker operating weight will slow consumption in both areas discussed. Sold in the walmart jug now! Currently on rollback at $22.47 / 5qt jug

If you want to blend M1 HM 5w30 with M1 HM 10w40 thats fine too. Top off with a quart of M1 HM 10w40, see what that does.
 
I have one that is not burning yet but am only at 80k miles. However, it has had synthetic with 5k oil changes since new. But it is a common issue with this engine for certain years. I have one of the ones that requires a tear down to replace the rings to fix it. This will never happen as long as I own it. So, I keep using any synthetic. My neighbor has one and he changes oil every 5000 and just puts 4.5 quarts in and uses the .5 quart in 5000.
 
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NOTE: the PVC value is called a ventilation valve in the RAV4.
I have the mentioned engine and I too noted an oil use increase at about 90,000 miles. (108,000 miles now). I known for a while that I need to check my "PVC" valve.
 
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals

The main oil consumption issues in that year are the valve seals or clogged piston oil return holes. By now, M1 HM has done all it can do for seals. In this engine, a 1 second small puff of blue smoke can be noticed at the tailpipe on a morning start only. It happens fast, will only be noticed if your behind the car when it starts. Have somebody else start it in the morning and watch. if you see the blue puff, have the valve seals replaced.

The piston oil return hole clogging is cumulative from day 1. So its more what happened early in the cars life, not necessarily recent. Because of location, flow, and depth of deposits in the holes, near impossible to remove unless caught early. You can try solvents, but IMO only answer is teardown. Expensive. IMO not worth it.

PCV may help, use an OE only.


I'll inspect for blue smoke in the morning. Good tip, thanks!

The car has had 66% city (25-50 MPH stop and go) and 33% freeway (no more than 65-70 MPH around here) its whole life. The overwhelming majority of the driving has been thirty to forty minutes commuting to and from work, approx 35 miles per day. We don't drive our cars rough, if anything we're light footed to save gas.

I've read about the piston oil return hole clogging on the Toyota forums. In fact, I think I read comments made by you on this very topic. This is really frustrating, especially on a Toyota product. It's a great car in every other respect. I hate the idea of having to sell or junk it prematurely because it needs an engine rebuild.

Originally Posted By: LeakySeals

Lastly, not all oil consumption is bad. You get a chance to replenish, which means you can extend the interval longer. Using M1 HM, 1 year/10k is fine. Personal opinion, use a high efficiency extended interval synthetic media oil filter rather than a resin/paper media filter. Better flow longer.


I thought Purolator PureONE were considered high efficiency/extended interval with synthetic media?
 
Originally Posted By: KitaCam
OP:
When changing the PCV valve, check the hose...mine was brittle-hard/cracked at each end and needed replacing too ($15 @ dealer)...

Thanks for the tip!

Originally Posted By: KitaCam

I got my 2AZ-FE @97.5K and with PYB 5w-30 it had dropped to 1/3qt down after 3k miles when I switched to PP 5w-30 @ 103k...when I changed plugs, PCV valve/hose, valve cover gasket...

I'd feel your concern too for a loss/burn increase from .5qt/5k miles to .5qt/2500 miles....with PP mine's only bit better @ .5qt/3-3.5k miles....but...

The problem for me is that the ladies in the family drive the RAV4 far more often than I do. They're not as mechanically inclined to check the oil level and add oil on their own. The burden is on me to keep track of these things.

If the oil consumption gets much worse, I see this being really problematic when they want to take it on road trips. And even if I could teach them how to fill the oil, this is something they will completely forget about until they get home. I hate to stereotype all women like this, but every woman I've known has been terribly naive in this department.

Originally Posted By: KitaCam

The loss/burn off RATE MAY LESSEN between half-way down to the "L" line and the "L"...at least that's what I've read others have experienced...so what I'm going to do monitor the dipstick and see just how many miles it takes to get to "L"...when it'll get the next OC...this is only my 2nd OCI (the engine's first with synthetic) so I'm not sure what to expect...

I know this is too simple, given your your attention to detail, but since didn't mention it...when you did fill up, was the oil AT the "F" line?...and...
Has you driving changed at all...like more highway miles?


Yes, I've been refilling up to the F line on the dipstick.

Driving has been the same over the life of the car. Mostly city, some freeway locally, and the remaining freeway has been road trips.
 
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Also if you have no external gasket leaks... In your climate I would try M1 0w40. A thicker operating weight will slow consumption in both areas discussed. Sold in the walmart jug now! Currently on rollback at $22.47 / 5qt jug

If you want to blend M1 HM 5w30 with M1 HM 10w40 thats fine too. Top off with a quart of M1 HM 10w40, see what that does.


Thanks for the tip!
 
Originally Posted By: 535678
I thought Purolator PureONE were considered high efficiency/extended interval with synthetic media?
High efficiency? As high as an over the counter filter gets, yes. Synthetic media? No, resin/cellulose. Considered extended interval? Relative I guess. I consider 7k+ extended interval, some may not. Other factors include driving conditions and engine cleanliness. So maybe the P1 is ok for you, maybe close to clogging @10k. Because I don't know for sure, take the safe bet and recommend a extended interval high efficiency synthetic.

Are you ok going 10k with a P1? probably. If you notice the engine being unusually noisy at startup close to the end of the OCI, thats a clue that the flow is becoming diminished. Our engines are very sensitive to flow being vvt-i.
 
Originally Posted By: 535678
This seems to be a common problem for those with Toyota 2AZ-FE (4 cylinder, 2.4L) engines. At higher mileages, oil burn suddenly increases.

Ever since I've kept careful notes. All fills listed below were with Mobil 1 HM 5W-30.

I am pretty sure that this is nothing to do with Toyota and this particular engine. I had the same problem on my 2005 Nissan Maxima. If you can, do the compression test. I am almost ready to bet that in will be above 220 psi. In other words, I am sure that your oil rings are stuck.

Get rid of M1 HM. Many synthetic oils, being heated on pistons, has a nasty feature to cover them by deposits. If you can read in Russian, there is a great oil-related blog. Probably this tool will be very useful as well. Just click the button and it is ready to use. Pictures shows deposits that were got heating oil to 380C (usual piston temperature).
Almost all mineral oils are stable and additives do not conform deposits. Many Group III synthetics do. You can see all pictures yourself, but this is my favorite (Lukoil mineral vs Lukoil Syn, oils were just heated in a spoon):
338_900.jpg

Conclusion: try to use pure mineral oil or syn blend. But I am 99% sure that it will not help. Check your compression, it should be easy on 4 cyl engine. If it is too high, I am right.
 
My buddy and his daughter each have the Toyota 2AZ-FE motor

His-'04 Camry 115K, Hers-'07 Scion tC 100K

His burns no oil to speak of in 5K-6K OCI...Hers burns 1qt every 1K miles

He has tried many things such as HM oils and 10w40 oils or both(HM 10w40), to no avail.
 
timeau - We know whats causing oil consumption in the 2AZ-FE, wrote about it. One teardown myself, followed several more online. Nothing to guess about. Valve seals or the same problem afflicting thousands of 98-02 1zz-fe 1.8L Toyota engines. Clogged piston oil return holes. Of course when the holes clog, it will throw more oil on the rings, possibly making them stick. Unless you fix "why rings stick", you will continue to have problems no matter how many times you jump to the ring conclusion. Probably the real reason your rings stick on the Nissan. That, and believing the Russians
grin.gif


Here is a 2AZ-FE piston with 320k on the clock torn down for oil consumption. Oil used was Castrol syntec, a semi blend. He had to drill the holes out. It was the only thing wrong.

piston_hole_debri_zps8fa9422c.jpg


That Russian site suggesting syn is more volatile than conventional has been discussed, testing method debunked many times by people on here that know oil better than I ever will. Really don't want to talk about it again. Post what you wrote in the forum, watch what happens.

What we do know is there is a high complaint rate for oil consumption on Toyotas, especially this engine. Oil used prior to, or when consumption started is dino 90% of the time. Some dinos more than others. People switch to syn to try to resolve it. By then its usually too late, holes are clogged. Thats the part your missing. The last thing they want to do is go back.

And lastly, I've been using M1 HM for 130k on the old Camry in my sig. No guessing here either. @10k intervals. So I know its not making things worse, quite the opposite. If it were I would stop using it.
 
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