OK, hitting 2000 mi on the new RSX. Since I am changing somewhat early, I'm going with a high-moly oil to keep formulation in-line with factory-fill, Havoline 5w-20.(~400ppm) I'll add VSOT to it for a lil visc bump and whatever extra moly that adds. From what I remember, 1oz per Q adds 100ppm, correct me if I'm wrong. So that's pretty easy, it's already high-moly, so no need to over-do it. Later on, I have some Havoline Synth 5w-30 which is a low-addititve oil, (moly 40-60ppm). Outside temps will be getting higher, so the higher visc is ok, I don't really want to bump it up too much, but the moly is low. I remember Molakule saying not to add more than 1oz/Q of VSOT as not to throw-off additive balance and in this case, thickening the oil is not desirable either. I'm doing short intervals fwiw. So, is the 1oz/Q an ideal add level for both oils, going from spring w/5w-20 (high moly) still early in the engine's life, to 5w-30 with low moly into summer heat? Am I over-complicating it? I know some guys will say not to add anything to the 5w-20 and some will say to add to whole bottle to the 5w-30 synth. What's ideal?
Add how much VSOT to Havoline 5w-20 & Synth 5w-30?
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Triple_Se7en
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I used a whole bottle initially to my Colorado 3.5L with six quart capacity. Now I use a half-bottle (7.5oz) every OCI. Valvoline says it is safe to use the entire bottle in any engine - even those with 3.5 quart capacities.
Using Havoline oil is irrelevant & again - no mention from Valvoline about usng less VSOT with high moly motor oils. If the VSOT is doing any damge to engines, both Valvoline & I would like to see some physical evidence please.
Using Havoline oil is irrelevant & again - no mention from Valvoline about usng less VSOT with high moly motor oils. If the VSOT is doing any damge to engines, both Valvoline & I would like to see some physical evidence please.
use Redline 5w20 and OCI every 10k, tons of moly and one of the toughest oils on the market, save yourself lots of work, brewmeistering, mixing, oil component incompatibilities and worry.
these DOHC HMC VTEC's love lots of moly, helps keep that top end spinning smoothly and quietly at 8k rpm
VSOT has large amounts of VI's which fall apart from heat and shearing, similar concept to space shuttle foam peeling off or booster O rings burning out, going to cost someone
[ March 17, 2006, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: Steelhead ]
these DOHC HMC VTEC's love lots of moly, helps keep that top end spinning smoothly and quietly at 8k rpm
VSOT has large amounts of VI's which fall apart from heat and shearing, similar concept to space shuttle foam peeling off or booster O rings burning out, going to cost someone
[ March 17, 2006, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: Steelhead ]
Somehow this is OK with the warranty?
Bag the VSOT. Use a good oil and high moly is simply not necessary. How much Mo in Amsoil XL5W-20. Show me the wear. You know it!
We aren't even sure the factory Mo isn't from assembly lube, so trying to duplicate something you don't know, with some compounds you barely know, without at least some fundamental oil testing and knowledge probably is not best practiced on a new car.
Bag the VSOT. Use a good oil and high moly is simply not necessary. How much Mo in Amsoil XL5W-20. Show me the wear. You know it!
We aren't even sure the factory Mo isn't from assembly lube, so trying to duplicate something you don't know, with some compounds you barely know, without at least some fundamental oil testing and knowledge probably is not best practiced on a new car.
Well said, Pabbs.
That's the problem with ALL of this stuff. We just don't know. I'm thinking it might be best to use an oil that has plenty of the additives you're looking to get with the VSOT instead of adding VSOT. In my old car, I know it smoothed out valve train buzz, but in a new car, I dunno, the stuff DOES thicken oil noticeably even at an ounce/Qt. You can see it in the rotation of the cams, the consistency on the dipstick.
I don't know why VSOT has to be SO THICK. Does that create a warranty issue? Who knows? I suspect the stuff won't kill your engine before the warranty is up, or ever, or it may be GOOD for the engine. But who determines that? And at what cost? Without a lot of costly oil analysis, you simply don't know what you've done til maybe it's too late. IF you sludge the engine early on with the stuff, you can BET they'll analyze the sludge when they get inside the engine, and how do you explain THAT? They tell you not to add stuff in the manual and warranty.
I haven't seen ANYONE here point to the stuff (or any of these additives to be fair to VSOT) and say, in a positive, educated fashion, that VSOT is GOOD for engines, and then back it up with controlled studies or empiracle proof supplied by engineers. Anecdotes, seat of the pants impressions, but PROOF? Fact IS, even Valvoline doesn't juice their oils with this stuff.
If the goal is the additives, heck, run Havoline Dino, it has the Moly, Boron, Calcium, some Zinc in abundance. I imagine there are iterations of Amsoil and others that have lots of chemistry in them to play with if you want to vary the additive package, and you'll not run afoul of the warranty.
Having just purchased a new car, I'm getting kinda hinky about tampering with the warranty with additives on second thought. I am changing the he11 outta the oil the first 5000 miles, but no more VSOT-adds to the thing until it has reached beater-status. Besides, run a Havoline or other oil with the same additive-package, and the VSOT becomes a bit, shall we say, redundant? Why mess with the viscosity when the manufacturer is so insistent on the subject?
Just my two cents, but Pablo makes good sense when he points up that we just do not KNOW. Everything else is starting to strike me as a crap shoot with this additive experimentation. I think I'm going to limit my experimenting to trying different oils and filters that meet grades and settings spec'd by the manufacturer.
THAT leaves a lot of leeway to play, yes? No?
That's the problem with ALL of this stuff. We just don't know. I'm thinking it might be best to use an oil that has plenty of the additives you're looking to get with the VSOT instead of adding VSOT. In my old car, I know it smoothed out valve train buzz, but in a new car, I dunno, the stuff DOES thicken oil noticeably even at an ounce/Qt. You can see it in the rotation of the cams, the consistency on the dipstick.
I don't know why VSOT has to be SO THICK. Does that create a warranty issue? Who knows? I suspect the stuff won't kill your engine before the warranty is up, or ever, or it may be GOOD for the engine. But who determines that? And at what cost? Without a lot of costly oil analysis, you simply don't know what you've done til maybe it's too late. IF you sludge the engine early on with the stuff, you can BET they'll analyze the sludge when they get inside the engine, and how do you explain THAT? They tell you not to add stuff in the manual and warranty.
I haven't seen ANYONE here point to the stuff (or any of these additives to be fair to VSOT) and say, in a positive, educated fashion, that VSOT is GOOD for engines, and then back it up with controlled studies or empiracle proof supplied by engineers. Anecdotes, seat of the pants impressions, but PROOF? Fact IS, even Valvoline doesn't juice their oils with this stuff.
If the goal is the additives, heck, run Havoline Dino, it has the Moly, Boron, Calcium, some Zinc in abundance. I imagine there are iterations of Amsoil and others that have lots of chemistry in them to play with if you want to vary the additive package, and you'll not run afoul of the warranty.
Having just purchased a new car, I'm getting kinda hinky about tampering with the warranty with additives on second thought. I am changing the he11 outta the oil the first 5000 miles, but no more VSOT-adds to the thing until it has reached beater-status. Besides, run a Havoline or other oil with the same additive-package, and the VSOT becomes a bit, shall we say, redundant? Why mess with the viscosity when the manufacturer is so insistent on the subject?
Just my two cents, but Pablo makes good sense when he points up that we just do not KNOW. Everything else is starting to strike me as a crap shoot with this additive experimentation. I think I'm going to limit my experimenting to trying different oils and filters that meet grades and settings spec'd by the manufacturer.
THAT leaves a lot of leeway to play, yes? No?
Motorbike:
"I think they might be using Enhanced Polyisobutylenes and here might be the key to producing a product w/o possible sludging issues of regular polymeric thickeners.
From the website below .
Because we have the unique ability to control the polymerization process we are developing oligomeric products containing defined ratios of C16/C20/C20+.
Here is some info , click on Highly Reactive but actually it might be best to first read about the Conventional listed to learn why the HR's are the ticket .
http://www.txpetrochem.com/p/poly.htm
This particular Valvoline product blew away STP and it's ordinary thickener in a TFOUT shootout and the above is my best guess as to the reason it did and why the Maxlife additve was not tested in this way"
"I think they might be using Enhanced Polyisobutylenes and here might be the key to producing a product w/o possible sludging issues of regular polymeric thickeners.
From the website below .
Because we have the unique ability to control the polymerization process we are developing oligomeric products containing defined ratios of C16/C20/C20+.
Here is some info , click on Highly Reactive but actually it might be best to first read about the Conventional listed to learn why the HR's are the ticket .
http://www.txpetrochem.com/p/poly.htm
This particular Valvoline product blew away STP and it's ordinary thickener in a TFOUT shootout and the above is my best guess as to the reason it did and why the Maxlife additve was not tested in this way"
I have the Honda version of your engine and had similar goals. I purchased 3 cases of Havoline synthetic 5W-30 for $1/quart on clearance. It's got very good CCS numbers but no moly. For the winter I blended Havoline 5W-20 (dino with 400 ppm of moly) with Havoline 5w-30 synthetic @ 50/50 ratio. The resulting blend should get you a group II+/III blend at 200 ppm moly. I also used LC @ the recommended dose. I ran this blend for a 5K interval.
Holy keerap, a Motorbike quote!
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