its best to remove your TB for cleaning. after all. your are dumping all that carbon and gunk down your intake manifold and in to your chambers. so your not protecting nothing only causing more harm. I take my TB off and take off the IAC and the TPS. also with it off you can get all the lil areas and have a true clean TB. so if you just spray down the TB with it on. why bother to clean it at all.
Cleaner for Throttle Body and Intake Manifold ?
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I feel that there is usually no need to remove the throttle body. You can clean it very well in place. I use a good cleaner (usually a spray) with an old toothbrush to get the hard to reach places. I'm somewhat gentle with the brush though. A little cleaner into the cylinders isn't harmful.
Almost everyone I know including me has just sprayed these cleaners into a vacumn line or straight into the throttle body with the engine running. Never had any problems down the road either.
These are all mid 90s or earlier vehicles. Domestic and foreign models.
These are all mid 90s or earlier vehicles. Domestic and foreign models.
not talking about the cleaner but the crud you break loose with the cleaner. its not good on your motor. man people so anal about their oil and keeping there internal engine area clean. but will let all that carbon and grime go right down the intake and into their combustion chambers.
you be surprised at how much stuff you miss by just spraying down the TB. but its your engine and if you want all that grit and grime to go into your combustion chambers. thats fine and I will always take my TB off and clean it and know I wont have my cylinder walls all scratched up over time.
you be surprised at how much stuff you miss by just spraying down the TB. but its your engine and if you want all that grit and grime to go into your combustion chambers. thats fine and I will always take my TB off and clean it and know I wont have my cylinder walls all scratched up over time.
I can understand where you're coming from Dark Jedi. I suppose I'm not as anal as some people are when it comes to car care.
Yes, I'm certain and in agreement with you that spraying into the TB without removal will not clean it thoroughly and that the liquified contaminates will be blown into combustion chambers in an engine spinning at 1500 or more revolutions per minute to be burned and consumed in a harsh violent fiery environment that very likely makes the devil jealous. This abuse only lasts for 15 minutes or less. Once I lost the rubber gasket that lines the inside of a spark plug socket. It fell into the combustion chamber and I couldn't get it out. Now it's acting as a sticky valve guide on my exhaust port. Actually, it probably melted and vaporized. Either way, the car didn't even hiccup. I sure as heck didn't feel like pulling the head to get it out!
Considering that I may do this type of sub-standard and dangerous cleaning 3x over the course of 250,000 miles I just never saw the benefit of doing it "properly" as I simply do not have the time nor do I understand how 45 minutes of horrible abuse in 15 minutes increments followed by an immediate oil change can signifigantly impact the life of the engine.
Keep in mind that the junk in the throttle body and other intake components is an "excess" of what has ended up in the combustion chamber for years of service. The TB and related components do not act as filters. What you see lining it is probably just the tip of the icerberg compared to what gets inside the engine every time you turn the key and step on the gas.
I'm not arguing with you btw. Your approach is exactly how I'd want a professional to do the job if I were paying out good money. Just giving another perspective on why some do it this way even if it's not the BITOG way.
I can say that I am always good about proper OCIs, filters and other preventive maintanence though!
Yes, I'm certain and in agreement with you that spraying into the TB without removal will not clean it thoroughly and that the liquified contaminates will be blown into combustion chambers in an engine spinning at 1500 or more revolutions per minute to be burned and consumed in a harsh violent fiery environment that very likely makes the devil jealous. This abuse only lasts for 15 minutes or less. Once I lost the rubber gasket that lines the inside of a spark plug socket. It fell into the combustion chamber and I couldn't get it out. Now it's acting as a sticky valve guide on my exhaust port. Actually, it probably melted and vaporized. Either way, the car didn't even hiccup. I sure as heck didn't feel like pulling the head to get it out!
Considering that I may do this type of sub-standard and dangerous cleaning 3x over the course of 250,000 miles I just never saw the benefit of doing it "properly" as I simply do not have the time nor do I understand how 45 minutes of horrible abuse in 15 minutes increments followed by an immediate oil change can signifigantly impact the life of the engine.
Keep in mind that the junk in the throttle body and other intake components is an "excess" of what has ended up in the combustion chamber for years of service. The TB and related components do not act as filters. What you see lining it is probably just the tip of the icerberg compared to what gets inside the engine every time you turn the key and step on the gas.
I'm not arguing with you btw. Your approach is exactly how I'd want a professional to do the job if I were paying out good money. Just giving another perspective on why some do it this way even if it's not the BITOG way.
I can say that I am always good about proper OCIs, filters and other preventive maintanence though!
I have expensive personal experience with Accord throttle body cleaning on my daughter's 2000 Accord. Do not, repeat, DO NOT just "spray" it in the throttle body. The wet rag method works, the spray/clean method did not work for me. Damaged (ruined) IAC valve - to the tune of almost $200. Ouch.
Toluene is very harmful if inhaled in high amounts or if large amounts are absorbed thru the skin. However, unless you sniff the can or bath in it, you should be fine. Toluene is closely related to benzene, but is not suspected of having the same carcinogenic effects. In Wal-Mart, they do an ID check when you buy Chemtool b/c of kids huffing it. As for harming sensors, it shouldn't, as toluene, unlike many solvents, is a component of gasoline.
I've cleaned my Accord's TB by spraying cleaner through the butterfly valve. I even went as far as to remove the IAC, spray lots of TB cleaner into it (to flush it) and then reinstall. Nothing bad happened. In fact my idle improved and gas mileage went up. I've only heard of problems when people use Carb cleaner instead of TB safe cleaner.
Others have mentioned removing the TB to clean it thoroughly, but on honda's it's a PITA to do much of anything in the engine bay. I dislike having to remove the airbox/hose b/c there are so many other things to account for/remove. As long as I get most of crud that I can see, that's good enough for me.
[ December 02, 2005, 11:44 PM: Message edited by: seotaji ]
Nah, it's not really considered a serious carcinogen. Not even considered so by the state of California.
http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/t3913.htm
Of course, there are other hazards, but as we've said...if proper precautions are taken, no worries.
http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/t3913.htm
Of course, there are other hazards, but as we've said...if proper precautions are taken, no worries.
LOL, what happened to the IAC? I use brake cleaner to clean it!
based on esencially this theory:
after sucking all that crap down for awhile... i let it run and drove it around a bit to suck or burn off the remainder of the crc... then proceeded to suck down the last of a bottle of seafoam i had, and then about a quart of water. (all through a tb vacume line with air-filter back in place....
I figured, the seafoam and the water, would help purge out any crap the crc left behind.. then drove it around for a little while, the did an oil change... no problems thus far.... (though it didn't fix my pre-exsisting idle issue).
Of which I was thinking something very similar... I cleaned my TB recently with a can of the CRC.. got the engine nice and hot, and sprayed it in while holding the throttle around 1500... cleaned up sparkling... i know I didn't get every nook... but i did pull the iac and poke around in there with the little hose-on-can thing... everything i can see, is sparkling metal surface now... and i bet, anyplace else the cleaner got sucked and blasted around, is probably also similarly clean... the CRC seems to work best with heat.... almost boils as it breaks away crud.
after sucking all that crap down for awhile... i let it run and drove it around a bit to suck or burn off the remainder of the crc... then proceeded to suck down the last of a bottle of seafoam i had, and then about a quart of water. (all through a tb vacume line with air-filter back in place....
I figured, the seafoam and the water, would help purge out any crap the crc left behind.. then drove it around for a little while, the did an oil change... no problems thus far.... (though it didn't fix my pre-exsisting idle issue).
"Nah, it's not really considered a serious carcinogen. Not even considered so by the state of California."
Um, not to be too picky, but yes it is. Perhaps you missed the statement as follows on the MSDS you quoted: "WARNING:
THIS PRODUCT CONTAINS A CHEMICAL(S) KNOWN TO THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA TO CAUSE BIRTH DEFECTS OR OTHER REPRODUCTIVE HARM."
That terminology means it is, by definition, on the "Prop 65" list of recognized carcinogens.
It has been on the Prop 65 carcinogen list since 1991. You can download the list here: http://www.oehha.ca.gov/prop65/prop65_list/files/P65single120205.pdf
In any case, why take chances? Minimize exposure and use in a fresh air environment. Don't use it every day and you should be fine.
Um, not to be too picky, but yes it is. Perhaps you missed the statement as follows on the MSDS you quoted: "WARNING:
THIS PRODUCT CONTAINS A CHEMICAL(S) KNOWN TO THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA TO CAUSE BIRTH DEFECTS OR OTHER REPRODUCTIVE HARM."
That terminology means it is, by definition, on the "Prop 65" list of recognized carcinogens.
It has been on the Prop 65 carcinogen list since 1991. You can download the list here: http://www.oehha.ca.gov/prop65/prop65_list/files/P65single120205.pdf
In any case, why take chances? Minimize exposure and use in a fresh air environment. Don't use it every day and you should be fine.
Seotaji,
I guess I should have removed the IAC valve, looking back. I've cleaned many throttle bodies over the years, always without incident. Not this time, though. I used NAPA brand throttle body spray cleaner, as I always have.
Once I started the car, it had a very high, then low idle -- then it gave a check engine light. Tried letting it sit overnight hoping it would dry out, but wasn't that lucky. The way the IAC sits on the throttle body, it was a real PITA to change ... very close to the firewall. Live & learn, I guess.
I guess I should have removed the IAC valve, looking back. I've cleaned many throttle bodies over the years, always without incident. Not this time, though. I used NAPA brand throttle body spray cleaner, as I always have.
Once I started the car, it had a very high, then low idle -- then it gave a check engine light. Tried letting it sit overnight hoping it would dry out, but wasn't that lucky. The way the IAC sits on the throttle body, it was a real PITA to change ... very close to the firewall. Live & learn, I guess.
Hi all,
I'm currently running MMO at the recommended dose of 4oz/gallon. I am also considering getting my throttle body cleaned.
After the throttle body clean, would it be advisable to run a fuel system cleaner (Prestone, Techron, Valvoline etc.) in the gas tank to get rid of all the throttle body grease and grime from the combustion chamber/valves, or should I just stick with the current regiment of 4 oz MMO/gallon?
Thanks.
Regards,
AJW
I'm currently running MMO at the recommended dose of 4oz/gallon. I am also considering getting my throttle body cleaned.
After the throttle body clean, would it be advisable to run a fuel system cleaner (Prestone, Techron, Valvoline etc.) in the gas tank to get rid of all the throttle body grease and grime from the combustion chamber/valves, or should I just stick with the current regiment of 4 oz MMO/gallon?
Thanks.
Regards,
AJW
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