guy at the tire place over torqued my rims

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WhyMe

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got new tires for the 330I last week. Went to the big chain that starts with D. Been busy the whole week and today decided to check the lugs in case they did not torque them correctly.

i tried breaking them off by hand with my breaker bar and the first one seemed really tight. I have a torque wrench that can measure breakaway torque. the next one broke are 120#. BMW spec it at 88#. checked the rest and they were the same 120#

should i be concerned they over torque it? any chance the lug bolts might break?
 
Im not convinced that they were incorrectly torqued. There is enough binding between surfaces if there is a little corrosion from getting damp a few times that it can take a lot more than they were snugged with.

They may have overtorqued them too, but I dont know that 110 is far enough from 88 to say for sure.

If they were all consistent, then the biggest concern Id have is moot.
 
Next time you remove your wheel studs, coat the threads with some silver anti seize. It will make removing the nuts much easier and your torque will be more correct to specs.
 
Breakaway torque is always going to be higher. 110 does not seem unreasonable for lug bolts that are normally torqued to 90 ft-lbs. It sounds to me that the job was done correctly.


Originally Posted By: Durangoboy
Next time you remove your wheel studs, coat the threads with some silver anti seize. It will make removing the nuts much easier and your torque will be more correct to specs.


Lubricating the threads will require you to reduce the torque applied by about 10-15%. Using lubricant on lug nuts or bolts is not advised by any OEM.
 
Originally Posted By: Danno
Unless you redid them all, you could mark them, undo, retorque to the mark and you will see the torque used.


After a couple of heat cycles, they will also be much more difficult to remove.
 
Torque them to spec and then check the break away torque after a week. Seems like a pretty simple way to verify.
 
Quite frankly, I'm surprised that some of you guys care so much about a slight overtightening of the lug nuts.

As long as the lug nuts/bolts are tightened evenly and are not grossly overtightened, it will not cause any runout issues. If my car specs 80 ft-lbs and I tightened all of the lug nuts to 100 ft-lbs, it will probably be just fine.

For instance, I use install lug nuts with my 80 ft-lb torque stick. If I set my torque wrench to 85, the lugs will click. I know that the torque stick is allowing the impact to tighten beyond the 80 ft-lb mark, but it is doing so evenly - which is what matters.
 
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Here is why I care. Once had a flat tire and I am more than capable of changing my own tires quickly. Well I couldn't get the lug nuts off with the tools in the trunk. If I had my large breaker bar, from home, it would be no problem. Ever since I have told the tire store that my wheels are hand tools only when steel rims are put back on. It is hand tools off and on when mag wheels and their lugs are involved. Just had tires done this week on the Focus and that is how they did it under my eyes not to mention they saw my torque wrench on the seat.
 
FWIW , BMW DOES recommend lubricating the wheel bolt threads and the taper section with a thin coat of engine oil.

"Do not apply oil to new wheel bolts.
In the case of used wheel bolts, apply an extremely thin coating of engine oil to the threads and tapers before reinstalling them."
 
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Quote:
.....As long as the lug nuts/bolts are tightened evenly and are not grossly overtightened, it will not cause any runout issues. If my car specs 80 ft-lbs and I tightened all of the lug nuts to 100 ft-lbs, it will probably be just fine.....

Fwiw, I agree with this. DT torques each lug, generally the service printout receipt says 80 or 90 ft/lbs. As long they torque each lug in the generally accepted method, opposite lug technique, I don't worry and have never had an issue. Honestly since going to DT I know they torque each lug, I don't watch them do each tire. And as mentioned, breakaway torque may not be the same as tightening.

Having lost a rotor prematurely once due to a tire shop's uneven torquing using an air gun only though, using a torque wrench is a priority for me. One of the many reasons I like DT and buy tires there exclusively.
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Breakaway torque is always going to be higher. 110 does not seem unreasonable for lug bolts that are normally torqued to 90 ft-lbs. It sounds to me that the job was done correctly.


Originally Posted By: Durangoboy
Next time you remove your wheel studs, coat the threads with some silver anti seize. It will make removing the nuts much easier and your torque will be more correct to specs.


Lubricating the threads will require you to reduce the torque applied by about 10-15%. Using lubricant on lug nuts or bolts is not advised by any OEM.


If the seat is kept dry, the torque required will not change. Its the static friction at the seat that keeps the bolt tight.
 
At least they were tightened about the same instead of all being hammered down hard with a high setting impact wrench.
 
Originally Posted By: WhyMe
got new tires for the 330I last week. Went to the big chain that starts with D. Been busy the whole week and today decided to check the lugs in case they did not torque them correctly.

i tried breaking them off by hand with my breaker bar and the first one seemed really tight. I have a torque wrench that can measure breakaway torque. the next one broke are 120#. BMW spec it at 88#. checked the rest and they were the same 120#

should i be concerned they over torque it? any chance the lug bolts might break?

Take it back as the wrong torque can warp the rotors. I know!
 
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Quite frankly, I'm surprised that some of you guys care so much about a slight overtightening of the lug nuts.

As long as the lug nuts/bolts are tightened evenly and are not grossly overtightened, it will not cause any runout issues. If my car specs 80 ft-lbs and I tightened all of the lug nuts to 100 ft-lbs, it will probably be just fine.

For instance, I use install lug nuts with my 80 ft-lb torque stick. If I set my torque wrench to 85, the lugs will click. I know that the torque stick is allowing the impact to tighten beyond the 80 ft-lb mark, but it is doing so evenly - which is what matters.


Bravo! I recall there was a time when TheCritic would have been worried about 80 ft-lb not being exact 80 ft-lb and really needed an expensive an accurate up to 1 ft-lb torque wrench.
 
I'd worry more about stretching the lug studs. If they run on easy by hand, they're probably OK.

Lubing the threads, unless recommended by the car maker, is a bad idea as stated above. Tightening a nut by the twisting force, a.k.a. torque, is combining the friction of the nut on the threads and the friction of the face of the nut against the wheel. Reducing the friction without reducing the max twisting force can result in stretched or broken studs or stripped threads. Calculating the amount to reduce the torque is complicated involving the type of lube and the material and surface finish of the threads. A more accurate but more trouble way to tighten correctly would be to measure either the bolt stretch (they all do; just don't stretch beyond the yield point) or the clamping force, but why bother?

The local Les Schwab tire store has the habit of hammering the lug nuts tight with their impact wrench, then multi-clicking the torque wrench to see that none of the lugs are loose. They have no clue about correct tightening.
 
Originally Posted By: Ken2
I'd worry more about stretching the lug studs. If they run on easy by hand, they're probably OK.


I think the vehicle in question does not have lug studs. If it is like almost every other Euro car it has lug bolts. So either the threads on the bolt stretch, or the hole on the hub gets buggered.
 
Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Breakaway torque is not tightening torque.
They are probably just fine. Who really knows? Maybe not enough torque!


you are correct. i verified it by using my torque wrench, which i have 3 of, set at 115 to see. I clicked without any rotation of the bolts.

this is my womans ride and if she ever has a flat, i doubt very much she would have the strength to remove them. I guess that what cell phones and i am for. LOL
 
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