A new to my family 2008 Volvo XC90 w/ 43k miles dealer said they would use a full synthetic 5w30, I would like to use Rotella 5w50 T6, What do y'all think? I found this interesting read on...
2008 Volvo XC90 3.2 Sport 6Cyl3.2L - Preventive MaintenanceFollow .What type of motor oil is really best for this car?
I'm told by some very well educated mechanics that this vehicle is required to use an ACEA A1/B1, or WSS-M2C9130A/B approved oil when sold in Europe but that Volvo only requires ILSAC GF-4 approval in North America. They also recomend switching to dexos1 approved oil later this year instead of the new ILSAC GF-5.
And, they recomend switching to VW 504/507 approved oil (instead of VW 502) for my 2006 Volkswagen Jetta. They insist that I'm risking serious engine damage using any of the oil from my local parts store (even the full synthetic).
My local parts store says that all of this is hogwash and that I can use any oil that is API approved and the correct viscosity. But, nobody at the parts store has ever heard of the oil ratings listed in my owners manual. And they don't have any products that meet those ratings.
Who do I believe?
it's absolutely 100% true. The ACEA rating system is controlled by car manufacturers who have an intense interest in protecting their engines during the warranty period. API & ILSAC are dominated by oil companies who are motivated by a shortage of higher quality group III base stocks and a surplus of cheaper group I base stocks.
In Europe, Technicians have far more stringent education requirements and independent shops typically have direct affiliations with OEMs. So, in Europe, OEMs can spec whatever oil is best for the car and know that the typical shops and techs will understand that spec. Europe also has a very reasonable and stringent definition of the term "synthetic" when it is applied to motor oil.
In the USA, there are no such educational requirements and the oil industry has created a dependency on brand loyalty, SAE viscosity rating and the term (synthetic). In the good old USA, our definition of synthetic is so meaningless that every name brand product sold here since 1992 legally qualifies as "full synthetic". And, technicians in this country falsely assume that all SAE 5W-30 products are the same viscosity (nope - there are thick 5W-30s and thin 5W-30 that can not be safely substituted for each other).
Most of the common "full synthetic" 5W-30 oil products that you would find at your local auto parts store will fail to provide needed protection and fail to meet warranty requirements for most European cars that require a 5W-30 product. VW and BMW routinely deny warranty coverage for engine damage that is caused by use of the improper oil products. Any 5W-30 that is approved for most North American GM products is too thin for VW, BMW or Mercedes Benz. Any 5W-30 product that is approved by Mercedes, VW or BMW is too thick for North American GM products. And, the differences go far beyond viscosity.
Ignoring the differences in oil can turn on the "Check Engine" light. But, failure to turn that light on is no assurance that you have the correct oil. Likewise, using the wrong oil may not do any damage during many common city driving conditions. But, that same oil can quickly damage the engine under other driving conditions.
The wrong oil can also accelerate catalytic converter failure. And, with OEM recommended oil change intervals exceeding 15,000 miles on many models, differences in the longevity of the oil are also critical. Some motorists have had their oil or transmission fluid changed early based on recommendations from an independent shop. When the independent shop services the transmission with a "Universal fluid" or otherwise unapproved fluid, they often damage the transmission/engine and void the OEM warranty. The oil manufacturers typically claims to "guarantee" their oil/fluid but that "guarantee" almost never actually applies due to exclusions (fine print).
Any shop that fails to understand the ACEA oil rating system and ASTM testing standards is poorly equipped to protect their customers vehicles and other interests. Vehicle warranty is increasingly denied when the incorrect oil, transmission fluid, coolant and even oil filters are installed. And, these denials have been upheld by court challenges under the Magnuss & Moss act.
The GM Dexos approval is only one of many examples of the above. GM spent a full decade trying to prevent oil companies from misleading consumers by labeling substandard oil products as "GM Approved". At every corner the oil companies found new ways to legally claim that their misleading claims were technically "correct". GM finally created the dexos 1 and dexos 2 trademarks licensing requirements to control the quality of oil used in their cars and to make it easier for consumers and technicians to confirm compliance. This dexos licensing process actually reduces the cost of bringing high quality OEM compliant products to market. But, it makes it far more difficult for an oil company to falsely represent a substandard product as compliant. Any oil company that claims dexos compliance on any of their products without displaying the dexos trademark logo should not be trusted. ("dexos 1" and ILSAC compliant products are perfect for many North American and Asian designed products but are NOT appropriate for German and many other European designed products).
2008 Volvo XC90 3.2 Sport 6Cyl3.2L - Preventive MaintenanceFollow .What type of motor oil is really best for this car?
I'm told by some very well educated mechanics that this vehicle is required to use an ACEA A1/B1, or WSS-M2C9130A/B approved oil when sold in Europe but that Volvo only requires ILSAC GF-4 approval in North America. They also recomend switching to dexos1 approved oil later this year instead of the new ILSAC GF-5.
And, they recomend switching to VW 504/507 approved oil (instead of VW 502) for my 2006 Volkswagen Jetta. They insist that I'm risking serious engine damage using any of the oil from my local parts store (even the full synthetic).
My local parts store says that all of this is hogwash and that I can use any oil that is API approved and the correct viscosity. But, nobody at the parts store has ever heard of the oil ratings listed in my owners manual. And they don't have any products that meet those ratings.
Who do I believe?
it's absolutely 100% true. The ACEA rating system is controlled by car manufacturers who have an intense interest in protecting their engines during the warranty period. API & ILSAC are dominated by oil companies who are motivated by a shortage of higher quality group III base stocks and a surplus of cheaper group I base stocks.
In Europe, Technicians have far more stringent education requirements and independent shops typically have direct affiliations with OEMs. So, in Europe, OEMs can spec whatever oil is best for the car and know that the typical shops and techs will understand that spec. Europe also has a very reasonable and stringent definition of the term "synthetic" when it is applied to motor oil.
In the USA, there are no such educational requirements and the oil industry has created a dependency on brand loyalty, SAE viscosity rating and the term (synthetic). In the good old USA, our definition of synthetic is so meaningless that every name brand product sold here since 1992 legally qualifies as "full synthetic". And, technicians in this country falsely assume that all SAE 5W-30 products are the same viscosity (nope - there are thick 5W-30s and thin 5W-30 that can not be safely substituted for each other).
Most of the common "full synthetic" 5W-30 oil products that you would find at your local auto parts store will fail to provide needed protection and fail to meet warranty requirements for most European cars that require a 5W-30 product. VW and BMW routinely deny warranty coverage for engine damage that is caused by use of the improper oil products. Any 5W-30 that is approved for most North American GM products is too thin for VW, BMW or Mercedes Benz. Any 5W-30 product that is approved by Mercedes, VW or BMW is too thick for North American GM products. And, the differences go far beyond viscosity.
Ignoring the differences in oil can turn on the "Check Engine" light. But, failure to turn that light on is no assurance that you have the correct oil. Likewise, using the wrong oil may not do any damage during many common city driving conditions. But, that same oil can quickly damage the engine under other driving conditions.
The wrong oil can also accelerate catalytic converter failure. And, with OEM recommended oil change intervals exceeding 15,000 miles on many models, differences in the longevity of the oil are also critical. Some motorists have had their oil or transmission fluid changed early based on recommendations from an independent shop. When the independent shop services the transmission with a "Universal fluid" or otherwise unapproved fluid, they often damage the transmission/engine and void the OEM warranty. The oil manufacturers typically claims to "guarantee" their oil/fluid but that "guarantee" almost never actually applies due to exclusions (fine print).
Any shop that fails to understand the ACEA oil rating system and ASTM testing standards is poorly equipped to protect their customers vehicles and other interests. Vehicle warranty is increasingly denied when the incorrect oil, transmission fluid, coolant and even oil filters are installed. And, these denials have been upheld by court challenges under the Magnuss & Moss act.
The GM Dexos approval is only one of many examples of the above. GM spent a full decade trying to prevent oil companies from misleading consumers by labeling substandard oil products as "GM Approved". At every corner the oil companies found new ways to legally claim that their misleading claims were technically "correct". GM finally created the dexos 1 and dexos 2 trademarks licensing requirements to control the quality of oil used in their cars and to make it easier for consumers and technicians to confirm compliance. This dexos licensing process actually reduces the cost of bringing high quality OEM compliant products to market. But, it makes it far more difficult for an oil company to falsely represent a substandard product as compliant. Any oil company that claims dexos compliance on any of their products without displaying the dexos trademark logo should not be trusted. ("dexos 1" and ILSAC compliant products are perfect for many North American and Asian designed products but are NOT appropriate for German and many other European designed products).
