Petro Canada Duron-E XL 15w40

[Degreaser]

I'm thinking of switching from Shell Rotella T5 5w40 on my '04 Kawasaki 1500 vulcan water cooled wet clutch sump to Petro Canada Duron-E XL 15w40. Here's the specs on the Duron XL 15w40.
What do you think?

Flash Point 235 C/455 F
cSt @40 C 114
cSt @100 C 15.5
SUS @100 F 586
SUS @210 F 81.2
VI 144
HT/HS 4.5
TBN 10.3
JASO-MA Suitable for use

http://lubricants.petro-canada.ca/pdf/DURON-E_IM-8028E.pdf

 

[getnpsi]

From reading on here I've abandoned the thought of rotella in my bike, but i only have 600 miles on it so far. the UOA on the klr650 is ugly for the t6 for its cost. Of course understanding we have different engines but shared sumps. Your oil has a 0.5 higher hths value than the t6, and less VI.

 

[Degreaser]

I wonder if having a lower VI matters. I won't be riding when it's freezing out anyways, but I do want less shearing of the oil, the Rotella 5w40 does not last in my bike.

 

[addyguy]

Can't ever go wrong with PC oils, they are totally top-notch.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Degreaser
I wonder if having a lower VI matters. I won't be riding when it's freezing out anyways, but I do want less shearing of the oil, the Rotella 5w40 does not last in my bike.

Then you should have tried Rotella T 15w-40. It's proven to be pretty shear resistant in shared sumps and cheap to boot.

 

[sunruh]

+bazinga to QP above.

and 5w40 has been proven many many times to not hold up the greatest in shared sumps either. much like m1. sure it does ok in the car engine motorcycles (ie slow and no tranny) but thats not your setup is it.

srt 15w40 or delo 15w40 or delvac 15w40 are the typical wise choices. canada duron maybe good, but only a uoa on your bike after typical milage will prove that

steve

 

[Tay]

Originally Posted By: sunruh
+bazinga to QP above.

and 5w40 has been proven many many times to not hold up the greatest in shared sumps either.
steve


from most of the data i saw a 15w40 normally will have higher HTHS and shear stability then a 5w40. i just curious why for scheaffer oil, their 5w40 seem to have better HTHS and possible shear stability then their 15w40? does that mean their 5w40 is shear stable as 15w40 or the ASTM D-7109 does not really reflect real world performance?

Schaeffer 5w40:

HTHS: 4.5cp
ASTM D-7109 90 passes: 9.67% viscosity loss

Schaeffer 15w40:

HTHS: 4.3cp
ASTM D-7109 90 passes: 9.96% viscosity loss

 

[Degreaser]

Is the Schaeffer 5w40 a synthetic, a Blend or Dino? I think the Duron-E XL 15w40 is a Blend, I wonder if a Blend would hold up better in HT/HS specs than a 5w40 synthetic. I seen on a google search that a synthetic oil is thinner than dino oil, the molecules on synthetic are smaller and on older engines the synthetic oil can seep thru gaskets and leak out.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Degreaser
Is the Schaeffer 5w40 a synthetic, a Blend or Dino?

It's a group III synthetic, AFAIK.

Quote:
I wonder if a Blend would hold up better in HT/HS specs than a 5w40 synthetic.

Blend has nothing to do with it. Assuming the underlying base components are the same, a 15w-40 will always be more shear stable than a 5w-40 due to having less of a viscosity spread.

Quote:
I seen on a google search that a synthetic oil is thinner than dino oil, the molecules on synthetic are smaller and on older engines the synthetic oil can seep thru gaskets and leak out.

If it was posted on the internet, it must be right.

 

[Tay]

Originally Posted By: Degreaser
Is the Schaeffer 5w40 a synthetic, a Blend or Dino? I think the Duron-E XL 15w40 is a Blend, I wonder if a Blend would hold up better in HT/HS specs than a 5w40 synthetic. I seen on a google search that a synthetic oil is thinner than dino oil, the molecules on synthetic are smaller and on older engines the synthetic oil can seep thru gaskets and leak out.


the schaeffer 5w40 is fully synthetic. a blend of 20-30% PAO and the rest make up of group III and additives from what i gather.

 

[Degreaser]

I sent Petro Canada an email asking if their Duron-E XL blend 15w40 can be used in my wet clutch bike, I just received a reply:

Our DURON-E XL 15W40 is suitable for use where JASO-MA is called for.

So I am going to try the Duron 15w40 and see how it holds up. The Rotella T 5w40 I was using is draining like water after 1,000 miles of use. I also want to see about getting a bottle of ZDDP oil additive and adding a couple ounces to my oil changes. Maybe the extra ZDDP will help.

 

[salesrep]

Originally Posted By: Tay
[/quote]

the schaeffer 5w40 is fully synthetic. a blend of 20-30% PAO and the rest make up of group III and additives from what i gather.

This would be correct.

 

[Tay]

Originally Posted By: salesrep
Originally Posted By: Tay


the schaeffer 5w40 is fully synthetic. a blend of 20-30% PAO and the rest make up of group III and additives from what i gather.

This would be correct. [/quote]

hi salesrep. what about the HTHS and shear stability? the 5w40 held it viscosity better?

 

[Degreaser]

I think the Duron XL Blend 15w40 would be better for me than the Rotella T 5w40 I've been using in my bike, the 5w40 has 8 times the improvers that will get sheared around in the transmission gears and the 15w40 2.5 times, so 15w40 would have less shearing going on.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Degreaser
the 5w40 has 8 times the improvers that will get sheared around in the transmission gears and the 15w40 2.5 times, so 15w40 would have less shearing going on.

So you take the second number and divide by the first number and that's how you calculate the amount of improvers? LOL! That's not what these numbers mean.

 

[Degreaser]

The farther the temperature range, then more VI additives are used in the oil. So I think a 5w40 has a greater temperature range and thus has more VI additives, than a 15w40, which has a lesser temperature range. So to me it means the less VI additives in the oil means less for the transmission to deplete in shearing.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: Degreaser
So I think a 5w40 has a greater temperature range and thus has more VI additives, than a 15w40,

That would be true if both oils were made of the same oil bases, but they're typically not. A 15w-40 is typically predominantly a mineral oil. A 5w-40 is synthetic. Synthetic bases have better multi-viscosity parameters on their own, so they don't require as much VIIs to be added.

Still, in the case of T6 5w-40 specifically, we know that it just does not hold up in shared sumps. You need to try something else.

 

[Degreaser]

If you are referring to Rotella T 5w40 synthetic as having a synthetic base, I think it was due to a legal loop-hole that has allowed Shell to print 'Synthetic' on the Rotella 5w40 container. To my knowledge, Rotella 5w40 Sythetic is created from a Group III dino base with viscosity improvers added to it. I believe there are more viscosity index improvers/additives added to the 5w40 than there is to the 15w40. To me, less VII in the oil means less of it to deplete thru heat and shear. A real synthetic base would be a Group IV.

 

[Quattro Pete]

You're missing my point. I agreed with you that T6 5w-40 is weak sauce when it comes to motorcycle applications.

But there are other 5w-40 oils out there that can possibly hold up better.

 

[Degreaser]

But would it make sense that in my theory, it would be better for me to move away from the Rotella 5w40 for my bike and start using the Duron blend 15w40? To my thinking the 15w40 would last longer. Although I'm not looking for longer OCI, just that I believe the 5w40 is depleting way too fast.