Started the clean phase on my Turbo Caravan today

[oldmoparguy]

It's 1989 2.5L turbo Caravan with 190,474 miles.
Last oil change was Rotila T syn 5W-40. was ~1/2
quart used in 4800 miles.

Changed the oil and put in ST 15W-40 + A-RX for the clean phase.

Will be traveling to DC next weekend to pick up a
car and tow it back. That should warm it up pretty good.

With that trip and 2 weeks of commuting it should be ready for the first rinse.

 

[Shaman]

I have to ask, is it stock?
I keep hearing about these minivans, but don't think i have ever seen one in person

 

[Gary Allan]

I've driven one. The one I drove was sorta like chomping at the bit at idle ...ran out of steam when aerodynamics took over for the somewhat flat front ..but pulled decent until then (about 80-85 mph). When I bought my 92, I inquired about a turbo ..but they had discontinued them apparently and the hp difference was about 10 hp.

If I could find one of these engines in a K-car ..man I think it would be a real decent sleeper.

 

[Threxx]

oldmoparguy,
You wouldn't happen to be on www.camaroz28.com would you? Guy with the exact same year of van, turbo, similar milage on there.

 

[oldmoparguy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Threxx:
oldmoparguy,
You wouldn't happen to be on www.camaroz28.com would you? Guy with the exact same year of van, turbo, similar milage on there.

---

Nope.

I haven't owned a GM vehicle since 1974 when I sold my 66 chevy 3/4 tom PU.

Mopar used a lot of the J engine in 1989 because of a shortage of 3.0L mitsu V6 engines. Also used
in 90 and 91, 92 was last year used, AFAIK and are quite rare.

This engine used a smallish mitsu turbo for fast spoolup and and a limited amount of boost at the top end. Hp was 150 @4800 rpm, with 180fp torque
at 2000 rpm. Torque curve was nearly flat through 4000 rpm. Normal boost is limited to 7 psi, but the system can be tricked into boosting to 15 psi with all stock components. At that level, you need the very best premium gas, but it will do over 200 hp at the wheels.

It has a heavy duty transmission to hold the torque, but even so, I've smoked 2 trannies.

This one is completely stock, except for a valve job done at 162K due to a blown headgasket.

It runs really well, last weekend I made a trip to DC to pickup a 89 Turbo Dodge Spirit and towed it back. Next weekend, I'm going back to DC and get a 86 Turbo Omni to bring back. These will be my toys for the next couple of years.

Gary, That engine has been put in every type of 4 cyl. mopar car ever made, I even read about someone putting it in a Neon.

Couple of years ago, a guy was racing a 2 dr. K car, running in the low 10's at over 120.

In the van, the computer shuts you down at about 85 MPH, with a car computer, it will do over 100.
Stock turbo Caravans will turn low 15's - high 14's at over 100 mph in the quarter. Tricked up, they will do low to middle 13's.

The Spirit came with an empty engine compartment and a van full of parts.

I happen to have a 89 Spirit parts car, turbo of course. 63K original miles, that will provide the new power for the my new toy.

The Omni, will get an all out turbo engine and will be used to embarrass various Mustangs, Corvettes and such at the strip.

BTW: Did a compression check yesterday.

got 130, 132, 132, 129

Will be interesting to see if that changes after the ARX treatment.

Wayne in Clt. NC

 

[VNT]

sorry about the 4.7, typo.

Actually Gus owned Mean Mini, turbo Caravan. His never ran 10's. He was killed in a motor cycle accident in 8/02.

You must be thinking of Gary Donovan who has the K-car, I beleive he has the video where he smokes a 00 Supra with 10K$ into the motor at battle of the imports at NE Dragway in 01 or so. Kind of funny how a Domestic rained on their parade

THe guy in the Supra insisted he get to run Gary. Kind of embarrasing loosing to a k-car. I think there were a few other SHelby Dodge boys there that day and I think they had a few ricers scratching there heads

VNT

 

[VNT]

Nice to see another TurboDodge guy on here.

Were outnumber

Mike

86 Turbo Z CS 2.2 Intercooled, Garret 3" SV, 3" Exh, +20's A555 moly plate, GLHS Stg2 puter.
89 Shadow 2.5 Garret T2, 2.5" exh, A555 moly plate
89 Spirit Turbo for sale
90 Daytona ES turbo 2.5 5spd
90 Daytona Shelby 2.2 VNT
00 Durango 5.9 SLT +
02 Grand Cherokee 4.6
03 PT GT 2.4 Turbo 5spd Stage 1 Mopar BOV

"There is nothing more fun than smoking Ricers in a 15 year old Turbo Dodge"

 

[JeepZJ4.0]

quote:

---

Originally posted by VNT:
Nice to see another TurboDodge guy on here.

Were outnumber

Mike

86 Turbo Z CS 2.2 Intercooled, Garret 3" SV, 3" Exh, +20's A555 moly plate, GLHS Stg2 puter.
89 Shadow 2.5 Garret T2, 2.5" exh, A555 moly plate
89 Spirit Turbo for sale
90 Daytona ES turbo 2.5 5spd
90 Daytona Shelby 2.2 VNT
00 Durango 5.9 SLT +
02 Grand Cherokee 4.6
03 PT GT 2.4 Turbo 5spd Stage 1 Mopar BOV

"There is nothing more fun than smoking Ricers in a 15 year old Turbo Dodge"

---

I saw the video of that guy who ran his Chrysler with the Turbo and ran 10s (?) I forget his name and but he died. It was amazing.

PS. the Grand Cherokee V8 is a 4.7L, not 4.6.

 

[oldmoparguy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by VNT:
Nice to see another TurboDodge guy on here.

Were outnumber

Mike

"There is nothing more fun than smoking Ricers in a 15 year old Turbo Dodge"

---

Hey Mike, good to hear from you.

I found this place while looking for info on synthetic oils.

Good folks here, lots of good info.

Just got back from DC yesterday, picked up a really nice 86 GLHT. The Turbo Mini towed it back without incident.

Now have ~1100 miles on the clean phase. 2 weeks of commuting and I will be ready for the rinse..

Also have a 2 89 Turbo Spirits, Got a really nice
89 ES 2 weeks ago, only needs the drive train, which will come from the other 89 turbo Spirit parts car.

Will try to have this one at SDAC this year.

Later,

Wayne

 

[Rick20]

Keep us posted on your results after the rinse phase. Should be interesting to see if compression numbers come up.

 

[oldmoparguy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rick20:
Keep us posted on your results after the rinse phase. Should be interesting to see if compression numbers come up.

---

Will do.

I don't expect to see much change, this is a low compression engine, (7.8/1).

When I did the valve job at 162K, compression was
down around 120 on #'s 1 & 4 cylinders. Head gasket was blown on both ends. Don't remember what the middle cyls were, valves were pretty well used and needed to be reground. Ran a whole lot better after the regring.

 

[txmatt]

quote:

---

Stock turbo Caravans will turn low 15's - high 14's at over 100 mph in the quarter. Tricked up, they will do low to middle 13's.

---

Just had to comment...

150hp in an ~3000lb vehicle isn't likely to run low 15's, much less high 14's, at 100 mph.

For example, of the same vintage, a stock '91 Sentra SE-R, 2600 pounds, 140 hp, stock limited slip diff, posted a best magazine-documented time of 15.8 at ~87mph.

A turbo Caravan in stock form, while it has slightly more hp, is hauling around at least 200 more pounds. And unless it's one of the rare 5-speeds, it's also running an auto to further sap power. I'd say even the 5-speed in stock form would take great driving/launch technique to break into the 15's.

Just looking at general 1/4 mile trends from a car mag for new cars, 16 flat equates to ~85mph, 15 flat equates to ~93 mph, and 14 flat equates to ~100mph, give or take a few mph.

There's certainly a lot of performance potential with this engine, but even many modded Turbo Caravans are running mid 15's at 85-90mph: reasonably quick but not 100+mph trap speed which is in the Neon SRT4 league.

Matt

 

[Jerry]

I had the turbo in an '87 Lebaron. I liked the car but was disappointed when I got on it once and ran it flat out for 4-5 miles and that killed the lower bearings in it. It had 10W-30 GTX in it and 110K miles. After that it had low oil pressure and rod flutter.

 

[VNT]

TxMatt

How about a stock solid rebuilt 2.5 with a stock Garret T2 turbo, 2.5 exhaust, intercooler, good valve job and good auto 14.6 at 90 MPH. In 89 Caravan. Visit the Dodgegarage

Stock they would run about 15.5 at 86 MPH or so

http://www.turbovan.net/turbovan.html

 

[txmatt]

Like I said "There's certainly a lot of performance potential with this engine." No argument from me that they can made to be powerful and fast. That's the beauty of most modern turbo and supercharged vehicles: you can coax out significantly more hp/$ than you can with most normally aspirated vehicles.

On the page referenced, most of those turbos with extra boost and simple intake and exhaust mods are running 15.4-15.8 @ 85-88mph, so I still think it'd take one heck of a run to do that in stock form.

I'm not trying to be pissy, just "keeping it real(istic)" since we're mostly here to be better informed about car stuff.

 

[oldmoparguy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by txmatt:
Like I said "There's certainly a lot of performance potential with this engine." No argument from me that they can made to be powerful and fast. That's the beauty of most modern turbo and supercharged vehicles: you can coax out significantly more hp/$ than you can with most normally aspirated vehicles.

On the page referenced, most of those turbos with extra boost and simple intake and exhaust mods are running 15.4-15.8 @ 85-88mph, so I still think it'd take one heck of a run to do that in stock form.

I'm not trying to be pissy, just "keeping it real(istic)" since we're mostly here to be better informed about car stuff.

---

Understood.

I have to admit that I have no personal experiance with those numbers, just what I have read,

OTOH: My van has smoked both front tires a time or two.

This was with General 215-70-14 ST-2000
tires that were worn down to slicks, (almost).

I am on the third tranny, so I have been a lot more careful with it lately as my wife is using it for her daily driver, since she wrecked her 2000 GC.

The HP numbers for this engine don't tell the whole story. The van SBEC is set to limit the HP.
From what I've read, it's not all that hard to get 200+HP at the wheels with stock parts.

By next summer I'll know for sure. I had initally intended to kick up the mini, but now that I have aquired a really sweet Spirit ES, that will be my first project. I hope to have it ready for 05 SDAC

Besides, the mini is my APV, car, truck, camper, etc, do I don't want to break it..

Cheers,

Wayne

 

[Bill]

oldmoparguy,

I bought a brand new Omni GLH (goes like **** !)
Turbo in 1985.
Car was lots of fun, and amazing,
could chirp the tires in 2nd gear, the rpm's
come up so fast.
I got 35 mpg on the highway on a trip to Alabama,
and I ran 20W-30 oil in the engine.

I know you will have fun with the GLH

 

[oldmoparguy]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bill:
oldmoparguy,

I bought a brand new Omni GLH (goes like **** !)
Turbo in 1985.
Car was lots of fun, and amazing,
could chirp the tires in 2nd gear, the rpm's
come up so fast.
I got 35 mpg on the highway on a trip to Alabama,
and I ran 20W-30 oil in the engine.

I know you will have fun with the GLH

---

Heh!

I have fun with everything I drive.

On the way back from DC with the Omni on the dolly
behind me, I got into a race with an 18 wheeler.

Thought my wife was going to kill me!!!

 

[oldmoparguy]

Update:

Have 1378 miles on the ARX clean phase now and have noticed a number of oddities, kind of..

I mentioned in my first post that I had ran Rotilla T syn for 4800 miles with ~1/2 qt. used.

Now, for all the years that I have owned this van, it has never used more then 1/2 qt. of oil between changes, ~3K oci, but I never really watched it closely, like I'm doing now.

With the Rotella, I noticed that it used ~1/2 qt. in the first 900 miles, and not a drop more, all the way out to 4800 miles. That seemed a little unuasual, but now with the ST 15-40 + ARX, it used ~1/2 qt. in the first 1000 miles, and has not used a drop since!

Will be really interesting to see what happens with the rinse. Will be changing the oil this Sat. for the rinse phase.

Another thing, oil pressure, was always a little above minimum at idle, and dead center at 3K rpm,
winter or summer, oil was Castrol 10-40 winter, 20-50 summer.

Right away I noticed that the Rotilla 5-40 was right down at minimum at idle and in the upper 2/3 of the gauge at 3K rpm, and the hotter it was, the higher the oil pressure got.

Now I'm not talking big differences here, but it was noticable.

With the ST 15-40 + ARX, idle pressure was normal at a little above minimum, and middle of the gauge at 3K, just like the Castrol.

After about 1100 miles, I noticed that the 3K pressure was down a little from the middle, maybe a needle width, not a lot, but noticable. Idle pressure was still the same as before.

I don't claim to understand any of this, but it is interesting to watch.

Wayne

 

[oldmoparguy]

Update 2:

1472 miles now.

Drove wife to work yesterday so I could use the van and noticed something odd with the oil pressure.

Cold, it was normal, lower 1/3 scale at idle, middle scale at 3K rpm.

Warm, idle pressure was the same, lower 1/3 scale, at 3K rpm it was only middle 1/3 scale. I've never seen oil pressure that low in this engine at cruse speed.

Not sure what is going on here, is it the ST 15-40 +ARX, or is the pressure sender getting flaky??

Will change it on Sat. Until them, I'll be watching it closely.

Wayne