Mobil 1 0W20 VS Amsoil 0W-20 Signature Series

[fdcg27]

The mediocre NOACK numbers?
Oh, wait, that spec isn't provided on the PDS.
There is the mediocre VI, though.
Why would you think that M1 AFE isn't primarily a Grp III oil when every other oil in its price range is?
You could always ask XOM, since they do have both a phone number and an email address.
In contrast to SOPUS, who state that their syn oils are Grp III, XOM won't give you a straight answer.
This has been discussed on this board many times.

 

[hounddog]

I have been asked to get receipts and proof of oil changes many times. But never asked about the oil used. On other fliuds never asked that I can remember by factory reps or independent adjusters. I have been involved in literary 100s of such situations. Dealt with dozens and dozens of independent adjusters taking photos,reports etc.as well factoy reps.

 

[hounddog]

I read a lot about dealers 'weaseling' out of repairs. Then again in my 30 odd years in dealer service depts I really never encountered such. I wanted any and every 'warranty' motor.trans etc. that I(we) could get or hands on and get the factory to buy it. Its BIG business. Those are GREAT tickets. Loved them!. $40% plus mark up on parts,usually a warranty labor rate that wasn't far off customer pay. Decent warranty flat rate. PLUS any add ons that really were needed that was was owner responsibility. Like OTHER service work that was not done in the past and he owners wanted to 'catch' it up. The pain in the rear repairs were the neglect,no documentation of maintace and such. If the repair was declined it was alwys 'our fault' Well NO it wasn't. I use to argue the point with the factory. I wanted a happy customer plus II wanted that $2000 to $5000 repair over the curb!!!

 

[dave1251]

Now this explains the few times I have brought my cars in for warranty work, the service manager was happy to schedule it and did not ask for receipts and my maintenance log. The dealership wanted to get paid. I am sure if the factory gave any feedback my receipts and log would of helped but I am happy the service manager was able to the work covered without any issues.

 

[hounddog]

Every bay.every tech working every minute thats possable. No different then a busy Doctors office that the Doctors work for a company. The bay and tech has cost factors etc.The DEALER is open to MAKE MONEY. I find a lot of service people spend more time explaining why not and can't instead of making it happen. I ran and worked in shops with up to 50 give or take techs. They weren't there for fun. How its supposed to work is the shop makes enough profit/money to pay fixed expenses. Then sales is pure profit. Sometimes it takes a few years to get to that point in a new dealer. Then every month the percentage of what department is paying fixed is discussed and broken down and such until the correct balance is achieved. Its not easy or for the faint of heart.

 

[tribocessive]

it is time to get out the mechanic's stethoscope!

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
The mediocre NOACK numbers?
Oh, wait, that spec isn't provided on the PDS.
There is the mediocre VI, though.
Why would you think that M1 AFE isn't primarily a Grp III oil when every other oil in its price range is?
In contrast to SOPUS, who state that their syn oils are Grp III, XOM won't give you a straight answer.

As has been mentioned, the preferred Amsoil 0W-20 is their GP III based XL version with a good (not great) NOACK of 12.5%.
PP SN 0W-20 is better at 11.5% along with a higher 175 VI.
We know M1 AFE isn't primarily GP III based since it has the lowest MRV @ -40 degrees of any oil, a figure that simply is not acheiveable with a GP III formulation.

At more typical start-up temp's whether a 0W-20 is GP III or GP IV based is not important but performance spec's are. M1 0W-20 does have a higher VI than Amsoil so that makes it a preferred choice although it's not the best Mobil offering for the OP's Toyota. That would be not surprisingly the Toyota 0W-20. Since price is not a concern to the OP I don't see any logically reason not to use the oil specified by Toyota.

 

[asharris7]

If anyone is "worried" about using the Amsoil Signature line due to warranty issues, just go buy some Subaru, Toyota, Eneos, M1 oil and return it..just keep the original receipt after they give you your money back. That's what I do. I have reciepts stating I bought (API spec) oils and I have been running Amsoil ow-20 SS line the whole time. Problem solved.

Cheers!

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: asharris7
If anyone is "worried" about using the Amsoil Signature line due to warranty issues, just go buy some Subaru, Toyota, Eneos, M1 oil and return it..just keep the original receipt after they give you your money back. That's what I do. I have reciepts stating I bought (API spec) oils and I have been running Amsoil ow-20 SS line the whole time. Problem solved.
Cheers!

That's a lot of extra running around to use a long drain heavier than spec' oil and you still can't take advantage of the extra long drain potential without voiding your warranty.

 

[buster]

If you buy M1 0w20 at WM in the 5qt jug, you get the oil for $5.79qt.

Amsoil SS is a good oil, but not worth it when you can buy M1 for that price.

M1 0w20 has better cold temperature performance and probably rivals the high temp performance of the SS.

Amsoil SS has much higher levels of Ca and a higher Tbn, but as we know the initial Tbn doesn't mean all that much.

 

[asharris7]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: asharris7
If anyone is "worried" about using the Amsoil Signature line due to warranty issues, just go buy some Subaru, Toyota, Eneos, M1 oil and return it..just keep the original receipt after they give you your money back. That's what I do. I have reciepts stating I bought (API spec) oils and I have been running Amsoil ow-20 SS line the whole time. Problem solved.
Cheers!

That's a lot of extra running around to use a long drain heavier than spec' oil and you still can't take advantage of the extra long drain potential without voiding your warranty.


ow-20 is the Speced oil for my vehicle (actually my wifes) I am in sales and I travel all day in my company car and on their gas also. So no big deal for my method (to me at least)

 

[CATERHAM]

0W-20 may be the spec' grade but the Amsoil ASM 0W-20 is a very heavy 20wt with it's HTHSV of 2.8cP and therefore is actually closer to a 30wt than the 2.6cP spec' oil.
In terms of required viscosity the GP III based XLZ or OEZ 0W-20's are more suitable.

 

[asharris7]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
0W-20 may be the spec' grade but the Amsoil ASM 0W-20 is a very heavy 20wt with it's HTHSV of 2.8cP and therefore is actually closer to a 30wt than the 2.6cP spec' oil.
In terms of required viscosity the GP III based XLZ or OEZ 0W-20's are more suitable.


I am new here and I respect your opinion. I have learned a lot by reading your posts. Thanks for the help! Do you even want to know what kind of car it is first?

Are you also saying that no vehicle that calls for o20 is going to be serviced well by ASM o20?

 

[hounddog]

So one is a 'heavier' 0w20 then the next. SO?

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: hounddog
So one is a 'heavier' 0w20 then the next. SO?

If it doesn't matter to you then just run a light A1/B1 30wt oil because their operational viscosities will be close.

 

[asharris7]

Originally Posted By: asharris7
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
0W-20 may be the spec' grade but the Amsoil ASM 0W-20 is a very heavy 20wt with it's HTHSV of 2.8cP and therefore is actually closer to a 30wt than the 2.6cP spec' oil.
In terms of required viscosity the GP III based XLZ or OEZ 0W-20's are more suitable.


I am new here and I respect your opinion. I have learned a lot by reading your posts. Thanks for the help! Do you even want to know what kind of car it is first?

Are you also saying that no vehicle that calls for o20 is going to be serviced well by ASM o20?


Please help me understand

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: hounddog
So one is a 'heavier' 0w20 then the next. SO?

If it doesn't matter to you then just run a light A1/B1 30wt oil because their operational viscosities will be close.


Viscosity or film strength?

So far, my bud in his 07 Fit Sport has no difference in gas mileage between M1 AFE 0w-20 and Amsoil ASM 0w-20. In fact, if I recall, has gotten his best gas tank on the ASM.

 

[CATERHAM]

Most people can't measure the fuel economy difference (nominally 2%) between a typical 2.6cP 5W-20 and a 3.1cP 5W-30.
The fuel economy difference between M1 and ASM I would guess to be a fraction of 1%.

If maximizing fuel economy is the main objective then I'd suggest the ultra high VI (216) Toyota 0W-20 or the even higher 229 VI Sustina 0W-20. These are the most fuel efficient lubes on the market today.

 

[Oldwolf]

Looks like the Eneos Sustina 0W20 runs about $12/qt shipped on Amazon. Is it hat much better than M1 or Toyota 0W20. I have to do 10k ocis on my 2012 Prius for the warranty.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: Oldwolf
Looks like the Eneos Sustina 0W20 runs about $12/qt shipped on Amazon. Is it hat much better than M1 or Toyota 0W20. I have to do 10k ocis on my 2012 Prius for the warranty.

I agree with the Toyota 0W-20 going for $5.75/L in my area it's hard to justify the increased cost of Sustina.

BTW new member DanMiller just posted a new ultra high VI oil called Syngard. Their 0W-20 has a 220 VI. See below:
http://www.crossoil.com/lib/docs/pds/PDSFullSyntheticPCMOSNSynGard.pdf