gtx5W20synbl 10k mi '12 hyundai 2.0L
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Where is the moly and boron?? I thought those were necessary to get low wear like this?
Just a good example of a very decent oil in a good engine. I thank you for posting this UOA and having the guts to run a conventional to 10k. Great results!
Just a good example of a very decent oil in a good engine. I thank you for posting this UOA and having the guts to run a conventional to 10k. Great results!
Originally Posted By: chubbs1
Where is the moly and boron?? I thought those were necessary to get low wear like this?
Just a good example of a very decent oil in a good engine. I thank you for posting this UOA and having the guts to run a conventional to 10k. Great results!
Its was a synblend not conventional.
Where is the moly and boron?? I thought those were necessary to get low wear like this?
Just a good example of a very decent oil in a good engine. I thank you for posting this UOA and having the guts to run a conventional to 10k. Great results!
Its was a synblend not conventional.
castrol plays their cards close to their chest; who knows what's in there; operating conditions include 200+ freeway miles each day with light payloads and a mild climate.
I don't think Blackstone's 11-12 k suggestion is unreasonable. Looks like it would cut it close on the TBN but this isn't exactly severe service.
dnewton3
Staff member
Originally Posted By: addyguy
"I'd use a full syn and get a bit more peace of mind for a 10k run ..."
He ran nearly 2x the "normal" average duration and got Al, Cr and Fe all at UA levels, with Pb at zero and Cu on par.
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these? I find your comment incredulous. Just what manner of sleepless night is being caused by fantastic results like this? Why not use full PAO syn at 3k mile OCIs with bypass filtration? After all, if it's "peace of mind" you're after, there is no better cure than trippling down with syns, bypass and super-short OCIs!
Why pay for, and then ignore, data that shows everything is doing spectacularly well, if you don't listen to it and learn from it?
As for the TBN, one would really would need to know the TAN to condemn this load. If TBN were the sole issue and it were this low, I'd still run it, if TAN were acceptable. TBN is not an automatic cause to send the oil to the drain pan. TBN is a factor in determining an OCI point; it is not a reason to just arbitrarily dump oil without viewing the overall conditions. There is a quote running around here somewhere from Mobil where they acknoweldge that TBN is not a sole condemation point; it must be factored with other criteria to make a good determination of when to OCI. You really need to know TAN when TBN is low, because a low base is not an automatic assurance of high TAN.
His wear is LOW! There is no contamination to be found. Vis and FP are fine. 12k miles would easily be attainable given performance like this.
"I'd use a full syn and get a bit more peace of mind for a 10k run ..."
He ran nearly 2x the "normal" average duration and got Al, Cr and Fe all at UA levels, with Pb at zero and Cu on par.
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these? I find your comment incredulous. Just what manner of sleepless night is being caused by fantastic results like this? Why not use full PAO syn at 3k mile OCIs with bypass filtration? After all, if it's "peace of mind" you're after, there is no better cure than trippling down with syns, bypass and super-short OCIs!
Why pay for, and then ignore, data that shows everything is doing spectacularly well, if you don't listen to it and learn from it?
As for the TBN, one would really would need to know the TAN to condemn this load. If TBN were the sole issue and it were this low, I'd still run it, if TAN were acceptable. TBN is not an automatic cause to send the oil to the drain pan. TBN is a factor in determining an OCI point; it is not a reason to just arbitrarily dump oil without viewing the overall conditions. There is a quote running around here somewhere from Mobil where they acknoweldge that TBN is not a sole condemation point; it must be factored with other criteria to make a good determination of when to OCI. You really need to know TAN when TBN is low, because a low base is not an automatic assurance of high TAN.
His wear is LOW! There is no contamination to be found. Vis and FP are fine. 12k miles would easily be attainable given performance like this.
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Originally Posted By: dnewton3
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these?
You have to remember that addyguy is from Canada. Up here, when you do find a synblend that isn't a HM oil, it's pretty much at synthetic prices anyhow and never goes on sale. So, if it were me, I'd either spend the tiny bit extra for the full synthetic (or probably less since the full synthetic could be found on sale), or start over with conventional.
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these?
You have to remember that addyguy is from Canada. Up here, when you do find a synblend that isn't a HM oil, it's pretty much at synthetic prices anyhow and never goes on sale. So, if it were me, I'd either spend the tiny bit extra for the full synthetic (or probably less since the full synthetic could be found on sale), or start over with conventional.
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
Originally Posted By: Garak
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
Totally true. I honestly cannot think of any time I have ever seen GTX syn blend. I have no idea what the bottle even looks like. Have we ever had it here? I have used Durablend in the past, but I think that was the only blend I ever used and that was years ago.
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
Totally true. I honestly cannot think of any time I have ever seen GTX syn blend. I have no idea what the bottle even looks like. Have we ever had it here? I have used Durablend in the past, but I think that was the only blend I ever used and that was years ago.
dnewton3
Staff member
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these?
You have to remember that addyguy is from Canada. Up here, when you do find a synblend that isn't a HM oil, it's pretty much at synthetic prices anyhow and never goes on sale. So, if it were me, I'd either spend the tiny bit extra for the full synthetic (or probably less since the full synthetic could be found on sale), or start over with conventional.
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
I can understand that mantra; makes sense. But only when it's explained well, as you have.
When performance is this good, it makes sense to use whatever is the least expensive, regardless of base stock. As always, it's a ROI thing for me. I don't mind paying premium prices, but I expect premium results. I want the maximum output for any choice I make.
Perhaps I misunderstood his comment, and I apologize for that. But it certainly came off as "use synthetic and sleep well at night" as if there greater sanity (peace of mind) could be found for using a syn. Seriously; it would be really hard to "better" the wear data and such, regardless of what was used. The "peace of mind" would have to come from the savings, because it would be nearly improbable to top the results.
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
How much more "peace of mind" is it worth to spend more money for results like these?
You have to remember that addyguy is from Canada. Up here, when you do find a synblend that isn't a HM oil, it's pretty much at synthetic prices anyhow and never goes on sale. So, if it were me, I'd either spend the tiny bit extra for the full synthetic (or probably less since the full synthetic could be found on sale), or start over with conventional.
Fortunately though, at least from my point of view particularly with respect to price, the synthetic blends, aside from HM ones), are disappearing from our shelves.
I can understand that mantra; makes sense. But only when it's explained well, as you have.
When performance is this good, it makes sense to use whatever is the least expensive, regardless of base stock. As always, it's a ROI thing for me. I don't mind paying premium prices, but I expect premium results. I want the maximum output for any choice I make.
Perhaps I misunderstood his comment, and I apologize for that. But it certainly came off as "use synthetic and sleep well at night" as if there greater sanity (peace of mind) could be found for using a syn. Seriously; it would be really hard to "better" the wear data and such, regardless of what was used. The "peace of mind" would have to come from the savings, because it would be nearly improbable to top the results.
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Originally Posted By: SLCraig
I honestly cannot think of any time I have ever seen GTX syn blend. I have no idea what the bottle even looks like. Have we ever had it here?
Canadian Tire used to have it. I can't recall what the bottle looked like, though. I do remember it's price point was perilously close to that of the Syntec at the time, so my reasoning was why bother. At least the HM synblends are routinely subject to sales, and at least they're marketed towards specific issues, so I can live with that.
I think it was back in the very late 1980s or early 1990s that Canadian Tire used to always push the differences between conventionals, synblends, and synthetics in their catalogues and other literature (like their winter driving guides).
@Dave: Well, the only readily available products that are marketed up here as a synblend (aside from HM oils) are a few HDEOs, and most never see such an animal, aside from the Rotella synblend.
I'm going to pick on Pennzoil Gold, seeing as how it's a good synthetic blend with all the latest specs, including dexos1. If Walmart up here got it, we'd likely never see it in a 5 litre jug. They couldn't make the space for PU, nor could Imperial Oil keep the space for Mobil Super 1000 and 2000, so I doubt there would be the room. They'd shove it with the 1 L bottles at a ridiculous price, rarely to be on sale. Local jobbers might carry it, but it'll only be in 1 L jugs, probably at $6 and up per litre. I can get 4.73 L jugs of PP for around $25 or PYB for $11.88 on rollback, so where's the incentive? Even at $5 a litre, it's a problem. It creeps down to $4, and then it starts competing with 1 L bottles of conventional (a rollback price on conventional 1 L bottles here is two for $8).
I honestly cannot think of any time I have ever seen GTX syn blend. I have no idea what the bottle even looks like. Have we ever had it here?
Canadian Tire used to have it. I can't recall what the bottle looked like, though. I do remember it's price point was perilously close to that of the Syntec at the time, so my reasoning was why bother. At least the HM synblends are routinely subject to sales, and at least they're marketed towards specific issues, so I can live with that.
I think it was back in the very late 1980s or early 1990s that Canadian Tire used to always push the differences between conventionals, synblends, and synthetics in their catalogues and other literature (like their winter driving guides).
@Dave: Well, the only readily available products that are marketed up here as a synblend (aside from HM oils) are a few HDEOs, and most never see such an animal, aside from the Rotella synblend.
I'm going to pick on Pennzoil Gold, seeing as how it's a good synthetic blend with all the latest specs, including dexos1. If Walmart up here got it, we'd likely never see it in a 5 litre jug. They couldn't make the space for PU, nor could Imperial Oil keep the space for Mobil Super 1000 and 2000, so I doubt there would be the room. They'd shove it with the 1 L bottles at a ridiculous price, rarely to be on sale. Local jobbers might carry it, but it'll only be in 1 L jugs, probably at $6 and up per litre. I can get 4.73 L jugs of PP for around $25 or PYB for $11.88 on rollback, so where's the incentive? Even at $5 a litre, it's a problem. It creeps down to $4, and then it starts competing with 1 L bottles of conventional (a rollback price on conventional 1 L bottles here is two for $8).
Syntec Blend bottles were silver.
Only time I used was a 1L bottle I got on sale at the WM TLE I worked at for $.25. It was part of the top-off on a 21k run I did on my 2002 Cavalier.
Regular price at CT was INSANE...$7.50/L last time I saw it!!!
Only time I used was a 1L bottle I got on sale at the WM TLE I worked at for $.25. It was part of the top-off on a 21k run I did on my 2002 Cavalier.
Regular price at CT was INSANE...$7.50/L last time I saw it!!!
dwnewton,
My 'peace of mind' comment was aimed at the remaining TBN being only 1.2, which is getting to the point where the oil is spent.
You're right wear is low, and the oil did do well, BUT, TBN is getting a bit uncomfortable, you have to admit.
My 'peace of mind' comment was aimed at the remaining TBN being only 1.2, which is getting to the point where the oil is spent.
You're right wear is low, and the oil did do well, BUT, TBN is getting a bit uncomfortable, you have to admit.
what about your engine warranty?
Hyundai won't honor your 10yr 100,000 mile warranty the hyundai oci is 1 yr 7500 miles or severe service 6 months or 3750
Hyundai will void your engine warranty i know how they work and in this case it would be very hard to win a lemon law or breach of warranty claim
Hyundai won't honor your 10yr 100,000 mile warranty the hyundai oci is 1 yr 7500 miles or severe service 6 months or 3750
Hyundai will void your engine warranty i know how they work and in this case it would be very hard to win a lemon law or breach of warranty claim
point taken; warranty is essentially a one year warranty in my case; i intend to have no warranty claims.
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