The other day I dropped the plug and drained my ATF from my sonata and replaced it with Castrol Multi Import ATF. SO far it seems pretty good the 3-4 shift was kinda rough before I changed the fluid and the new stuff seems to be doing well so far. When I pulled the magnetic plug though I was kinda worried as to how much gunk and metal shavings were built up on it and I am not sure if that would be a normal amount to have or not on a trans with 71k on it. I had the fluid flushed at 32k and now this change so i have taken pretty good care of it and I hope it doesnt give me any isues.
Changed ATF on Hyundai Sonata
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I have had great results with the Castrol Multi Import. Shifts way better than the Hyundai fluid for sure. The 1-2 shift on my 06 GLS V6 Sonata would be a little rough when cold. A flush was performed around 50k miles, at 98k the fluid was drained and filled twice. At 125k, car run's fine, although there may be a small ATF leak as the trans looks a little damp. Not too pleased, but nothing is dripping on pavement, so it's not that bad.
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From what I recall Hyundai and some Mitsubishi require a special ATF fluid available only at the dealer. I have heard plenty of horror stories where the owner changed the ATF with a generic oil and the transmission died later. Hyundai denied the warranty claim because the proper ATF wasn't used.
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Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Castrol Multi Vehicle ATF meets the spec for SP-11 & SP-111
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Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
Just what I thought Silverrat. The Castrol is a good place, I would not go cheap on the fluid and get the Super Tech brand. I'm sure the Castrol may, or may not have extra additives. For the price of the Castrol, I've been pleased with the results, as the transmission shifts much better with the Castrol vs. the dealer fluid.
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
I read your post, it does not exactly say a certain Hyundai ATF is required to maintain the warranty. Its close.
From the Magnuson-Moss federal law:
Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.
Ask the dealer to be more exact in their statement, or maybe that the dealer read 15 USC 2302(c in his spare time. Hyundai can give a spec, but if a given ATF meets the spec thats the end of the discussion.
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
I read your post, it does not exactly say a certain Hyundai ATF is required to maintain the warranty. Its close.
From the Magnuson-Moss federal law:
Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.
Ask the dealer to be more exact in their statement, or maybe that the dealer read 15 USC 2302(c in his spare time. Hyundai can give a spec, but if a given ATF meets the spec thats the end of the discussion.
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
I read your post, it does not exactly say a certain Hyundai ATF is required to maintain the warranty. Its close.
From the Magnuson-Moss federal law:
Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.
Ask the dealer to be more exact in their statement, or maybe that the dealer read 15 USC 2302(c in his spare time. Hyundai can give a spec, but if a given ATF meets the spec thats the end of the discussion.
I am sure that the Canadians don't have to obide by our Magnuson-Moss Act here in the U.S. and they can require that Canadian Hyundai autos use Hyundai specific ATF in Canada.
Whatcha think?
I am using Castrol IMV ATF in 3 ASIAN vehicles(Lexus, Mazda, Nissan) and all 3 are OK! Although I do feel some differences compared to the ATF that was in the 3 tranny prior, I can't say that the shifting is bad per/say, just different!
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Originally Posted By: Donald
Originally Posted By: silverrat
Actually Hyundai, Kia and Mitsubishi use the SP-III in some vehicles, and from what I have read Kia and Mitsubishi accept Multi ATF use.
Hyundai, however, requires that you use Hyundai fluid. If/when the transmission fails your fluid use could come into question.
That is, if it required SP-III.
I doubt your statement is true. If Hyundai REALLY requires you to use Hyundai ATF, then go to the dealer and pickup what you need for free, as the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Quoted from an internal company TSB
TECHNICAL SERVICE INFORMATION
Revision Bulletin April 24, 2012
All Hyundai Automatic Transmissions
Hyundai Canada is not recognizing the use of ANY automatic transmission fluid ATF treatment products (like Platinum ATF additive), Multi-ATF products or equivalent substitution ATF’s in place of the Hyundai SP-2 and SP-3 specific fluid applications (000HCATFSP).
These would include:
Mobil Super Multi-ATF
Castrol Multi ATF
All ATF equivalents stating SP-2 or SP-3 compatibility
Historical circumstances and direct communication between Hyundai Canada and *************** have confirmed that all offered transmission services on all Hyundai products must use SP2, SP-3 or 000HCATFSP fluid as directed. No alternate or substitution will be recognized in a warranty situation.
Note: There has been no complaints from KIA or Mitsubishi which utilize the same ATF product and may continue to be serviced with Multi ATFs. These will continue to be warranted by the product manufacturer as intended.
I read your post, it does not exactly say a certain Hyundai ATF is required to maintain the warranty. Its close.
From the Magnuson-Moss federal law:
Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty.
Ask the dealer to be more exact in their statement, or maybe that the dealer read 15 USC 2302(c in his spare time. Hyundai can give a spec, but if a given ATF meets the spec thats the end of the discussion.
I am sure that the Canadians don't have to obide by our Magnuson-Moss Act here in the U.S. and they can require that Canadian Hyundai autos use Hyundai specific ATF in Canada.
I am using Castrol IMV ATF in 3 ASIAN vehicles(Lexus, Mazda, Nissan) and all 3 are OK! Although I do feel some differences compared to the ATF that was in the 3 tranny prior, I can't say that the shifting is bad per/say, just different!
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Originally Posted By: Donald
the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Yes, it requires them to provide materials for free if they require that material to maintain the warranty.
** However, this is different from denying repair under warranty when a non-Hyundai product is used!! **
That's a key distinction, and though it seems like a minor point, it's critical to the discussion. Yes, Hyundai cannot revoke or remove your warranty if you use non-Hyundai fluid. However, if you are using non-Hyundai fluid and you have a transmission problem, Hyundai can choose to not repair it.
You said later: "Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty."
Again, this is true, but it's slightly beside the issue here. You can use non-Hyundai fluid and retain the warranty, as the law provides for. But you will note that the law doesn't require the warrantor to actually repair a problem that may have been caused by non-OEM parts.
the law says if they require you to use their product to maintain the warranty they must provide it for free. Its a Federal law.
Yes, it requires them to provide materials for free if they require that material to maintain the warranty.
** However, this is different from denying repair under warranty when a non-Hyundai product is used!! **
That's a key distinction, and though it seems like a minor point, it's critical to the discussion. Yes, Hyundai cannot revoke or remove your warranty if you use non-Hyundai fluid. However, if you are using non-Hyundai fluid and you have a transmission problem, Hyundai can choose to not repair it.
You said later: "Warrantors cannot require that only branded parts be used with the product in order to retain the warranty."
Again, this is true, but it's slightly beside the issue here. You can use non-Hyundai fluid and retain the warranty, as the law provides for. But you will note that the law doesn't require the warrantor to actually repair a problem that may have been caused by non-OEM parts.
My inclination is to believe first that these multi-vehicle ATF that are marked as suitable probably are in reality. But I think Hyundai is doing a run-around of the Magnuson-Moss by not licensing their fluid and keeping it proprietary. Next Hyundai is position itself to not honor the warranty in a transmission failure if their fluid is not used (or the dealer didn't change it and possibly with even a multi-vehicle ATF).
Dirty tactics IMO.
Dirty tactics IMO.
I agree (dirty tactics). Honda does the same thing. I'm not sure they have a scare tactic TSB out, but I wouldn't doubt that you'd have significant warranty trouble when using a non-Honda fluid. I say that, but a local dealer uses the MaxLife ATF when servicing Honda transmissions, instead of the genuine fluid. They say that warranty is never an issue, but I wouldn't know for sure (and hope to never find out).
I think all OEM fluid specs should be licensed. I'm beginning to believe that these fluids are really more similar than they are different, and the only reason they exist is for parts counter profitability. Fine...but one would think they'd actually make more money licensing the fluid than keeping the specifications a secret.
I think all OEM fluid specs should be licensed. I'm beginning to believe that these fluids are really more similar than they are different, and the only reason they exist is for parts counter profitability. Fine...but one would think they'd actually make more money licensing the fluid than keeping the specifications a secret.
I agree. I doubt these fluids differ that much or to put it a better way the automatics could be designed around and validated to run on Dexron or Mercon specification. They could call their branded ATF anything they want but the specification/approvals could be the same. Dexron is probably better than what they are using anyway. Same thing with all the coolant types.
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My warranty from Hyundai is up anyway so I wasnt worried about that at all, I was wondering more if the metal shavings I saw on the magnet were normal for a trans break in or if there should not have been any at all?
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I doubt these fluids differ that much or to put it a better way the automatics could be designed around and validated to run on Dexron or Mercon specification.
I agree with this. I think the major difference in them all is likely a small change in finished viscosity (actually, we know this is the case already) and differing levels of friction modifier in the lubricant. This is obviously something that should be relatively well-matched to the friction surfaces in the transmission. Most of these Asian transmissions seem to have high(er) levels of FM in the fluid. Substituting a fluid with lower levels of FM produces a firmer shift with lower clutch wear. Going the other way around produces a softer shift with higher clutch wear.
It's usually okay to go one way, but often ill-advised to go the other way. Fortunately, about the only "negative" about Dex/Merc type fluids in these Asian transmissions is a firmer shift...and that's not necessarily a bad thing anyway. A firmer/quick shift theoretically results in less wear.
I doubt these fluids differ that much or to put it a better way the automatics could be designed around and validated to run on Dexron or Mercon specification.
I agree with this. I think the major difference in them all is likely a small change in finished viscosity (actually, we know this is the case already) and differing levels of friction modifier in the lubricant. This is obviously something that should be relatively well-matched to the friction surfaces in the transmission. Most of these Asian transmissions seem to have high(er) levels of FM in the fluid. Substituting a fluid with lower levels of FM produces a firmer shift with lower clutch wear. Going the other way around produces a softer shift with higher clutch wear.
It's usually okay to go one way, but often ill-advised to go the other way. Fortunately, about the only "negative" about Dex/Merc type fluids in these Asian transmissions is a firmer shift...and that's not necessarily a bad thing anyway. A firmer/quick shift theoretically results in less wear.
Do a Google image search for "transmission magnet" and you see some nightmares. If you magnet was worse than anything you see there, then I would be concerned.
You are always going to get some metal wear, its the nature of clutches.
I did one drain and fill with MaxLife on the Optima a few months ago. I liked it, but the shifts were too soft for me. I have since done two drain and fills with SP-III, and the shifts are crisper. I loved the way MaxLife worked in my 98 Sable. Not too soft, not too crisp. Just right. Oh yeah. (in Barry White voice)
I still think MaxLife is a superior fluid to SP-III, but its not the right fluid for the car. I think I am just going to do a drain and fill once a year on the car, for the rest of its life. The drain and fills are easy on the Optima, so I don't mind the extra effort.
Currently, I am running Eneos Type SP. I am interested to see how well Valvoline's new Multi-Import fluid works. Maybe next change?
You are always going to get some metal wear, its the nature of clutches.
I did one drain and fill with MaxLife on the Optima a few months ago. I liked it, but the shifts were too soft for me. I have since done two drain and fills with SP-III, and the shifts are crisper. I loved the way MaxLife worked in my 98 Sable. Not too soft, not too crisp. Just right. Oh yeah. (in Barry White voice)
I still think MaxLife is a superior fluid to SP-III, but its not the right fluid for the car. I think I am just going to do a drain and fill once a year on the car, for the rest of its life. The drain and fills are easy on the Optima, so I don't mind the extra effort.
Currently, I am running Eneos Type SP. I am interested to see how well Valvoline's new Multi-Import fluid works. Maybe next change?
I read that some fluids that "meet all or most SP-xxx" for import brands such as hyundai/honda, etc. can mess up older transmissions that use brass bearings for the valve assembly - something similar to that extent... not all universal fluid is universal.
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