Wow! Strong words from Opel

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http://vectra.opel.com/brand_sites/vectra/launch/uk/en/downloads/pdfs/Customerinfo_oil.pdf
The above link is sort of a letter to Opel owners in regards to what oil they should run. The cars have an oil condition dash light and an oil level dash light, and Opel tells them what oil to use as top-up. The say use a GM-LL-A-025 qualified oil, or if that is not available, up to one liter of an A3/B3 oil can be added. They say outright that conventional oils that don't meet at least A3/B3 can do serious damage! No mincing words here.
 
Opel specifically calls for "OPEL approved oils" with 50,000 km change intervals in normal service. They charge 2500 Euros for approval + 2500 for each relabeling or reformulation.
 
Well, it's not quite as clear-cut as it seems. I started looking into this 30k km/18k mi GM/Saab/Opel "Long-Life" oil spec this past Jan/Feb, & what I discovered of the 12 oils meeting the spec at that time was:
1) They're all fully synthetic
2) They're all European-made
3) All but one were 0W-30
4) Seven were also rated at ACEA A3, two were rated at A5, two were rated at A1, & one didn't say.

So if you can use a GM-LL-A-025 oil which only meets A1/B1, then using a more stable & durable oil shouldn't create any problems. Obviously, the OLM is programmed for a fully synthetic oil, & it won't know if Mobil 1 or Mazola is being used for up to 2yrs at a time.

-Greg
 
Longlife Pack??? Talk about wimps. They have to have gloves to add oil???? I guess only in Europe. What do you guys think about those reminder lights? I know computer systems are in cars, but to this day, I don't think there is an oil analyzer that is built into the engine. I think it keeps track of the number of miles you've driven and the time. I mean, could there be a viscosity meter in there or something like that? Pretty costly I'd think. I'm sorry, old school here, I'd still be changing every 4K (hey, I used to do it at 3K, I've come up to 4K, who says I'm NOT with the times?????
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quote:

I don't think there is an oil analyzer that is built into the engine. I think it keeps track of the number of miles you've driven and the time.

There's more to it than that, and there are oil condition sensors now availble, but I don't know if any are in production vehicles yet.

It is a fact that the computer has no way of knowing if there are high silicon levels in the oil, if it is strictly a simulation based routine.
 
Actually my folks 99 GMC 1500 pickup has a sensor that bases its change interval on the rotation of the crack shaft and temps of the motor compared to distance traveled.
 
Mercedes-Benz has what is generally considered the most sophisticated oil-quality monitor. They call it the Flexible Service System.

This system does monitor oil quality to a degree: FSS is comprised of "a special dielectric sensor in the oil pan that measures the changes in the capacity of a condenser as a proxy for the amount and type of contaminants present in the oil."

In addition to tracking different operating parameters like cold starts, mileas driven, etc.

The minumum interval is 10K miles, up to 20K miles. Interestingly, M-B "forgot" to tell owners to use synthetic oil, and actually encouraged the use of dino oil on all but AMG vehicles. Which led to a $32 million lawsuit, because dino oil was causing premature engine failure on customer cars.
 
I think people are missing the difference in the oil-life systems.

One approach is to directly measure some physical property of the oil top determine when to change it. Mercedes Benz uses that in conjunction with other parameters.

GM's oil life system doesn't directly measure anything in the oil directly. It uses a countdown mechanism, basically based on engine revolutions, with multiplications made for cold start / weather conditions. No direct measurements. It takes the approach that the condition of the oil can be inferred from the revolutions made by the engine.

Two different approaches.
 
BMW' approach is based on fuel consumption. You get to use so many liters of fuel per oil change. Makes some sense. If you drive hard and stress the oil, you use more fuel.

But, it doesn't test the oil, or take into account differences in oils.

[ July 08, 2003, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: joatmon ]
 
quote:

Originally posted by Schmoe:
I'm sorry, old school here, I'd still be changing every 4K (hey, I used to do it at 3K, I've come up to 4K, who says I'm NOT with the times?????
wink.gif
)


I wonder if you would still be changing every 4k if you had to pay about $20/qt just for oil?
 
quote:

Originally posted by Eiron:

1) They're all fully synthetic
2) They're all European-made
3) All but one were 0W-30
4) Seven were also rated at ACEA A3, two were rated at A5, two were rated at A1, & one didn't say.


I just wonder where Amsoil got their technology from?? From what I remember several years ago, they had to by the additives from Europe becuase the package was so new and high tech. I believe now it's available through the USA sources.

Good stuff.
 
quote:

Originally posted by MNgopher:
I think people are missing the difference in the oil-life systems.

One approach is to directly measure some physical property of the oil top determine when to change it. Mercedes Benz uses that in conjunction with other parameters.

GM's oil life system doesn't directly measure anything in the oil directly. It uses a countdown mechanism, basically based on engine revolutions, with multiplications made for cold start / weather conditions. No direct measurements. It takes the approach that the condition of the oil can be inferred from the revolutions made by the engine.

Two different approaches.


Actually Cadillac has been using a oil monitor in its oil system for some time now, not sure just what it measures, but it can sense a new quart of oil has been added.

CRW
 
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