Phosphorus Volatility and Catalytic Converters

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Volatility of a base oil and individual additives such as phosphorus can be measured separately, and it makes sense to hypothesize that significantly reducing phosphorus volatility would significantly reduce catalytic convertor poisioning. An extensive 2001 study of 1,300 oils by Ted Selby of "Savant" concluded that the volatility of engine oil itself is not related to phosphorus emissions and the proper phosphorus chemistry and formulation can effectively reduce phosphorus volatility and emissions.

Selby proposes that engine oils can be formulated so that the antiwear properties of phosphorus are maximized, while the negative effects of catalyst poisioning are minimized. Selby developed the "Phosphorus Emission Index" or PEI, to compare the volume of phosphorus in volatized oil to the volume in the fresh oil. Higher PEI numbers indicate more phosphorus volatility per volume of fresh oil.

Ford recently conducted a study of 20 New York taxicabs. Each taxicab was driven for 100,000 miles, with the oil changed at 3000 mile intervals in the beginning and 5000 mile intervals later in the test. According to Milt Johnson of Ford, "Of the total amount of phosphorus that was lost from the oils during the 100,000 miles, the fraction that could be attributed to selective volatilization of phosphorus ranged from 56 to 87 percent. The volatility of engine oil phosphorus was a major contributor to phosphorus loading on the catalyst."

"Fords data suggested that up to 80 percent to 85 percent of the phosphorus that was getting to the catalyst was coming from volatile phosphorus rather than from direct oil consumption," added Rich Lee of Chevron Oronite. "But the data also showed that with high oil consumption, as found with non-detergent oil, the source of the phosphorus on the catalyst was more like 50/50 - half from the direct oil consumption, half from volatile phosphorus. While limits on phosphorus volatility and bulk oil phosphorus may be appropriate, the ideal solution would be a catalyst performance test."
 
What they don't tell you is how they do this cat. poisoning testing.

A 2.2L engine is run at 3000 RPM for 200 hrs
and 1.3 cc/min of formulated oil is fed into the intake (induction system)

At 80 cc/hr, that's 533 ounces or 17 quarts of oil consumed over this period.
 
Must be a Saturn motor!!
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Pablo,

Some oil companies have been experimenting with Zinc Dithiocarbamates as an alternative to run-of-the-mill ZDDP.
 
I think this is better science than just saying " less than 500 PPM of P" and walking.

I mean IF the stuff stays in the oil, and doesn't coat the catalyst, what's the harm? There was a pretty good article in LNG sometime earlier this year that basically made this same point. If this path is followed.....AJ MAY get off the hook for "going to big Mo in the next 2 years". The assumption in this logic really is not only volatility (or lack of) but if these compounds are good/great AW agents.

As for a car spewing oil at those nasty rates, the catalyst would be doomed even if you had less than 250 PPM P...........!
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Pablo,

The above article was copied from an issue of the Amsoil "Direct Line" newsletter, so this is the approach Amsoil/Lubrizol are taking to address this issue. They really, really don't want to reduce the # of ZDDP they use, or the extended drain performance and oxidation resistance will be compromised.

TooSlick
 
So Directline got it from somewhere else as usual...I let my subscription lapse (don't tell AJ) because for free I could get the same "news" earlier. This kind of stuff should be free to dealers........oh sorry, there I go again.
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PS Check your PM

[ November 28, 2002, 10:18 AM: Message edited by: Pablo ]
 
"...An extensive 2001 study of 1,300 oils by Ted Selby of "Savant" concluded that the volatility of engine oil itself is not related to phosphorus emissions and the proper phosphorus chemistry and formulation can effectively reduce phosphorus volatility and emissions."

In other threads, this is what I was discussing.

Cat. poisoning can be avoided in formulations using ZTDC or even ZDDP by using the proper mix of additives such as calciums, magnesiums, borates, MoTDC's, and other additives.
 
There was an article in Lubes and Greases recently that talked about this very issue.

It seems that if the gasoline makes would use an additive MMT that would prevent cat poisoning.

I believe canada and europe have been using this for years. I have a source at Ethyl that has confirmed this she is a organic chemist that worked on this project.
 
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