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#2550069 - 02/27/12 10:54 AM Engine wear and E85
friendly_jacek Offline


Registered: 05/04/03
Posts: 5344
Loc: southeast US
or rather lack of.

Not sure if posted before.



http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=143372

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#2550080 - 02/27/12 11:03 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
cchase Offline


Registered: 11/03/09
Posts: 3998
Loc: New England
Where is the cross-hatching?

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#2550093 - 02/27/12 11:09 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: cchase]
friendly_jacek Offline


Registered: 05/04/03
Posts: 5344
Loc: southeast US
Originally Posted By: cchase
Where is the cross-hatching?


good question.

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#2550144 - 02/27/12 11:59 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
Brons2 Offline


Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 2484
Loc: Austin, Texas
how many miles on that motor?

I will agree that the tops of the pistons look extremely clean.
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#2550145 - 02/27/12 12:02 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
PZR2874 Offline


Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 499
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Did he run in that hard where it's all "worn" or is it a load and he was taking a pic at the machine shop before the honing?
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#2550151 - 02/27/12 12:07 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: PZR2874]
friendly_jacek Offline


Registered: 05/04/03
Posts: 5344
Loc: southeast US
Originally Posted By: PZR2874
Did he run in that hard where it's all "worn" or is it a load and he was taking a pic at the machine shop before the honing?


description in the quoted forum:

Quote:
Engine is SBC 4.145" bore x 3.800" stroke with SRP forged flat top pistons. This is a solid roller cammed engine that is 11.4:1 compression and has been run almost exclusively on E85 since spring 2007. It did have 6 months run time on gasoline before the switch. I was surprised at how clean everything is -- I have NEVER seen pistons this clean after 2 years of use.

There was no ridge at the top of the cylinders, and no scoring or other signs of a lubrication problem in the bores. Engine has 250+ quarter mile passes on it and 15,000 street miles. I cruise on the freeway at 3400-3600 RPM and do NOT take it easy on this thing.

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#2550152 - 02/27/12 12:10 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
PZR2874 Offline


Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 499
Loc: San Antonio, TX
So gapless rings then?
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#2550156 - 02/27/12 12:13 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
NHGUY Offline


Registered: 10/09/11
Posts: 3376
Loc: USA
Cross hatching is the marks left from cylinder honing.Its how the rings break in and make a seal.

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#2550180 - 02/27/12 12:29 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
PZR2874 Offline


Registered: 05/06/11
Posts: 499
Loc: San Antonio, TX
Correct, but I didn't realize he was using gapless rings... I was looking for the hatching and agreed with everyone else. Still, very clean cylinders.
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#2550200 - 02/27/12 12:42 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
HerrStig Online   content


Registered: 08/24/11
Posts: 3005
Loc: Boston, MA
How's the fuel consumption on E85? Just bought a new Poulan 4 cycle snowblower and the manual (I read them) says the warranty is void if more than 10% alcohol is used.


Edited by HerrStig (02/27/12 12:43 PM)

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#2550218 - 02/27/12 12:57 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: cchase]
friendly_jacek Offline


Registered: 05/04/03
Posts: 5344
Loc: southeast US
Originally Posted By: cchase
Where is the cross-hatching?


the answer is on the page 4

Quote:
cross-hatch still there just doesn't show in the pics. It was lighter than when fresh though. No ridge at top of cylinders. Remember I drove this motor a lot of miles at high RPM on the freeway (3600 RPM) so I expect some wear.


http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=143372&page=4

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#2550264 - 02/27/12 01:42 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
SteveSRT8 Offline


Registered: 10/10/08
Posts: 15130
Loc: Sunny Florida
Very nice. I agree those are some clean pistons.

I guess the camera lacked the resolution to show us the cross hatch. otherwise there should be a deep ridge.


Edited by SteveSRT8 (02/27/12 01:45 PM)
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#2550304 - 02/27/12 02:14 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
friendly_jacek Offline


Registered: 05/04/03
Posts: 5344
Loc: southeast US
I'm thinking E85 could be one of the best combustion chamber cleaners. But, not available in my area.

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#2550313 - 02/27/12 02:18 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
SEMI_287 Offline


Registered: 02/25/11
Posts: 980
Loc: Up State NY
What oil was used?
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#2556139 - 03/03/12 09:45 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
morris Offline


Registered: 08/24/08
Posts: 3681
Loc: ks, wichita
looks like it ran dry.

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#3109583 - 08/29/13 07:52 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: HerrStig]
outdoorsman310 Offline


Registered: 08/26/13
Posts: 113
Loc: DE
dont do it!

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#3211788 - 12/09/13 10:26 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
TiredTrucker Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 1008
Loc: Kellogg, IA
Wow. I feel a lot better using E85 in my 2013 Silverado frequently. Yeah, mpg is not like with gas, but the price differential still makes it more cost effective per mile to use. And you can tell the difference in pep via the seat dyno. E85 definitely puts regular gas to shame on get up and go.
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#3268442 - 02/02/14 08:22 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
morris Offline


Registered: 08/24/08
Posts: 3681
Loc: ks, wichita
fine if like being locked to only one fuel. get in the middle of nowhere and only reg gasoline? so what do you with 89 octane in a 11 to 1 C.R. time for MMO.

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#3268607 - 02/02/14 10:39 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
TiredTrucker Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 1008
Loc: Kellogg, IA
The link to the thread the OP referenced, the guy with the 11:1 CR started out the engine on Premium gasoline for 6 months before going to E85. It would have to be pretty "middle of nowhere" to not be able to get premium. I lived in Delta Junction Alaska for several years. More remote than most folks on this forum will see, and we had Premium available. Bit of a stretch that he would be locked into one fuel.

That is why I like my Flex Fuel Silverado. When combined with a Diablo tuner, I can set the high performance 93 octane tune and use two different fuels, premium and E85. If either was not available, just switch to the 87/89 octane program and can use regular, E10, or E85.
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#3268717 - 02/03/14 02:56 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: SteveSRT8]
Shannow Offline


Registered: 12/12/02
Posts: 26798
Loc: a prison island
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Very nice. I agree those are some clean pistons.

I guess the camera lacked the resolution to show us the cross hatch. otherwise there should be a deep ridge.


About mid bore on the RHS piston, you can see a "holograph" for want of a better word where the diamon cross hatch is giving a sort of fresnel reflector...but the vertical lines far outweigh that image.

Given that the engine is reputedly turnign 3,600 RPM on the highway, that's a pretty low MEP, which means that the time that the rings are at TDC/BDC, they have lower pressure behind them than one turning (say) 1500RPM and needing twice the torque/MEP per revolution...less impetus for a ridge to be foremed, and less "dwell" with the piston transitioning from hydrodynamic to boundary.

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#3268809 - 02/03/14 07:13 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
TiredTrucker Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 1008
Loc: Kellogg, IA
Came across this one on and engine using E85 for over 100,000 miles. Similar engine wear like the OP, but with a standard daily driver type of vehicle. They noticed no ridge on the cylinder, same as the link from the OP.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuOs1yap8mU
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#3474890 - 09/05/14 03:25 PM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
Rosetta Offline


Registered: 07/06/14
Posts: 211
Loc: Sta Catarina, Br
And those fairy tales and myths still alive? Ow E25 will ruin your engine ... Doh
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#3475492 - 09/06/14 07:25 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
TiredTrucker Offline


Registered: 01/04/08
Posts: 1008
Loc: Kellogg, IA
It's called the information super highway! confused
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#3475658 - 09/06/14 11:20 AM Re: Engine wear and E85 [Re: friendly_jacek]
Rosetta Offline


Registered: 07/06/14
Posts: 211
Loc: Sta Catarina, Br
I do use my own blends of Hydrated Ethanol (HE) HE70 to HE90's for more than a decade > I can mix any amount since the ethanol nozzle are at one foot from the regular gas, so... < My 1995 Taurus is US imported > gasoline only, original compression chamber values. It ran a lot with all the original parts and loves it! < The mileage drops about 15% at highway. City driving makes the gap wider (20% more to the thirsty side) than the highway driving. The combustion chamber (can't photo up with boroscopes) is clean and no excess carbon abrasives for the compression rings to eat up. I use K&N air filter (on original air box). It's doing 39mpg at highway cruising at 75mph. Mine came from factory with green fuel injectors, its original FFV injectors for export. Fuel pump went by last year (maybe the excess of hydrated ethanol has a hint of guilty in here) and I replaced with a 4 bar Delphy FFV, so the high amount of hydrated ethanol wont hurt a thing and the regulator makes it back to 3 bar. PCM is original gas only version though, not the FFV version. Last spark plugs are one grade hotter than the original ones.
The thing burnt about 425 gallon of pure water in its life, from the hydrated ethanol I added to the fuel mix (since in average, 8% of the ethanol I add is pure water). Ethanol fuel here is about the 92-94GL version FYI. That vapor makes my O2 sensor and catalist converter clean as a whistle, too.
Did the same in a 95 Golf GLX 2.0 8v and the Scooby. The Scooby still has the original Fuel Pump. The Subaru thing is Tough! Ethanol is about 65% the price of regular gas, so a higher consumpton still compensates.


Edited by Rosetta (09/06/14 11:29 AM)
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1995 Ford Taurus 3.0 Vulcan 78k miles Mobil 1 5w30
1993 Subaru Impreza EJ16 121k miles Mobil 1 15w50
1997 Kawasaki Ninja ZX9R 38k miles Mobil 1 15w50

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