Replacing exhaust pipe

[sifan]

My 2000 Toyota Echo with 110K miles (originated from Canada) has rusty hole on its exhaust pipe right in front of the muffler which makes some loud noise. I did some research on the Internet on fixing the hole and found the true solution is to replace the pipe instead of patching it up.

I want to have some ideas on how the replacement work with few questions:

1) Should the whole pipe from the exhaust manifold to the muffler be replaced as a unit? If so, does this include the catalytic converter even it is still good?

2) Can just the section of pipe between the catalytic converter and the muffler be replaced?

3) Should the muffler be replaced along with the pipe?

4) I called a local Shell gas station that has a garage. They said the work must be done by a muffler shop. Does anyone know a good shop in the Rockville area of Maryland? I have heard lots of bad things on the muffler chains like Midas.

Thanks,

Simon

 

[MarkM66]

Does the section in question look as though it can be unbolted, and replaced with a new section? Or all all the connections rusted?

 

[sifan]

Since I bought the car about a year and a half ago, I do not know much about its repair history. At the joint where pipe meets muffler I can see a hole on the pipe side but no rust on the muffler side. There are no clamps at the joint.

I haven't had the chance to look thoroughly at the entire exhaust pipe, just traced the sound and saw the hole. I do not know if that section of pipe can be replaced by itself.

 

[jeepman3071]

how big of a hole? My buddy's Ranger had a small hole in the pipe between the cat and muffler. I used marine grade JB Weld as a "temp" fix, but it was fine and rock solid ever since.

 

[sifan]

Probably the thumb size hole. I think I could make it bigger if I poked around the surrounding rust area of that hole.

How long has your patch lasted?

 

[eljefino]

You want a "cat back" system. Hopefully the cat has a bolt on flange. The muffler will slip over the end of the mid-pipe and a clamp will hold it all together. Edit, you look like your muffler has a bell mouth style connector with stuffing. Regardless, you'll figure it out.

If the cat has no bolt on flange you can cut it with a sawzall ($25 at harbor freight) and then still slip-on the pipe.

Odd that the garage didn't want the work; some mechanics are prima donnas and don't like exhaust work, I guess.

An exhaust often rusts out where you describe, IDK if it's because the combustion has cooled down to where water condenses and makes rust, or metal fatigue from the way the pipe and muffler hang from the hangers. If you do want to go to a muffler shop like midas this should be hard for them to botch.

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: sifan
Probably the thumb size hole. I think I could make it bigger if I poked around the surrounding rust area of that hole.

How long has your patch lasted?


Over a year and 20k miles. I think your hole might be a bit big though, especially if you feel the area around it is pretty rusted also.

 

[Virtuoso]

I *hate* rusty exhaust work. This is one of the few areas where I will let a shop handle it. Soo many headaches.


If you do replace it, heat (torch) is your friend.

 

[sifan]

I did some Internet search for muffler shops around my area. One Midas shop stands out with 40+ 5-star Google customer feed backs (I am not sure how reliable the rating is). I called and the manager seemed to be very friendly and knowledgeable. I will take my car there over the weekend and take my chance.

 

[nleksan]

You can probably get a custom mandrel-bent cat-back exhaust with a muffler of your choice made at a specialty exhaust shop for $200... At least, around here you can.

 

[kschachn]

FWIW the factory muffer is about $200 (P/N 17430-21370), plus hardware. IMHO the factory exhaust parts are much better built than most or any aftermarket ones.

It's easy to get it apart.

 

[spasm3]

I would search for an independant muffler shop. I have had better service at indenpendants than at a chain shop. I would not spent the bucks for oem exhaust parts. How long are you going to keep the 2000 model echo?

 

[sifan]

I drive less than 5k miles per year. i think I am going to retire with it or till I can no longer handle the manual transmission physically.

I am a bit concern about the part quality from the Midas chain. Many years ago I bought a slightly used OEM muffler from eBay (in those days people replaced Echo OEM muffler with an aftermarket one). Now I can take it out of the closet and use it this time. Does exhaust pipe have different qualities that matter?

 

[andyd]

Midas used to have a life time guarantee. As long as you had the original sales slip.

 

[sifan]

I always wonder how a company like Midas makes money by offering lifetime warranties on its services. Lets say I needed to use the Midas' warranty on my next exhaust pipe replacement, what would I have to pay then?

What is the catch?

 

[nleksan]

FWIW I was not talking about an aftermarket exhaust, rather a custom made one from an Indie exhaust shop. The good places can get you a stainless steel, mandrel-bent, OE or better quality exhaust for far less. It does not have to sound any louder than OE, that is part of the beauty of it... But considering it is an Echo, it could use a wee bit more power, I would imagine...

 

[PeteTheFarmer]

Originally Posted By: sifan
I always wonder how a company like Midas makes money by offering lifetime warranties on its services. Lets say I needed to use the Midas' warranty on my next exhaust pipe replacement, what would I have to pay then?

What is the catch?


The muffler is a lifetime warranty but not the pipes, hardware or labor to install them. If the Midas shop by me is any indication, you'll be paying for these every few years, at pretty good markup considering their quality. They're also pretty pushy on selling extra services. That's where they are able to make a profit.

 

[InvalidUserID]

I would take it to a local muffler shop and see what they think. I'm sure they've seen it before (and much worse) and could figure out a solution.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: nleksan
FWIW I was not talking about an aftermarket exhaust, rather a custom made one from an Indie exhaust shop. The good places can get you a stainless steel, mandrel-bent, OE or better quality exhaust for far less. It does not have to sound any louder than OE, that is part of the beauty of it... But considering it is an Echo, it could use a wee bit more power, I would imagine...

There are VERY few "indies" who can afford the $250K+ equipment which is needed to properly mandrel-bend 304 stainless.

But yes, they CAN do the 'cut-and-weld' method with pre-bent and straight sections of this material, using the proper welding rods/methods.

 

[sifan]

I brought my Echo to that Midas shop yesterday. The one piece cat back would cost around 6~7 hundred dollars according to the manager. Surprisingly he and the mechanic were very friendly and accommodating after seeing my own muffler. It turned out the mechanic was able to fabricate the mid pipe and wielded it to my muffler. Since the muffler was not an exact fit, he even customized the hangers and wielded a longer tail pipe. At the end $270 was the cost including material and labor. All was done in one and half hour while I was waiting in the shop sipping coffee and watching CNN news on a big screen HD TV. The 40+ 5-star Google customer rating on this Midas shop is for real. I will definitely give it a 5-star rating, too.