Truedelta reliability survey

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I don't believe either of these rags, both have there own agenda. Nick you don't need to defend the Cruze it speaks for itself.
 
truedelta is a "rag"?!?

I thought it was a statistical approach at looking at vehicle reliability, based upon end user responses...
 
Really? That site has a very small number of responses on which you're basing your judgement.

If it were a few thousand responses and they still trended the same-maybe. But a whole 30 or 40 responses? It's meaningless.
 
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
truedelta is a "rag"?!?

I thought it was a statistical approach at looking at vehicle reliability, based upon end user responses...


Like JD Power, garbage in, garbage out. Of course adding a little paid participation doesn't hurt your image when these companies do surveys either. SHAMtastic!
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I don't trust any of these " analyses " unless I ee hard numbers on sample size . None of them report that .
 
As long as you trust that the Consumer Reports data is not "tweaked" by the organization and represents raw data from survey takers, the small sample size is likely the reasoning for the differing results. I've taken both Consumer Reports and True Delta automotive surveys before, and they're both relatively similar. The survey taker ultimately decides for him or herself what significant issues are, what's really a problem and what isn't, etc.
 
I read the article on Consumer Reports reliability data.

They require 100 surveys minimum in order to report.

Also just because they show something as reliable or unreliable it means likelyhood(PREDICTED). Reliable cars have lemons and "unreliable" cars have stars.

I happen to own a used car to avoid (2005 Subaru Legacy turbo) and had little issues. But have know a few owners where the data is really spot on. Thankfully I beat the odds.

That is all the data reported is odds.
 
Also the difference between the other survey outfits and
Consumer Reports is that CR DOES NOT ACCEPT PAID ADVERTISING OR OFFER COMMERCIAL PAID SERVICES...unlike J D Power and Truedelta.
 
The Consumer Reports rating is a predicted reliability rating which probably takes in account of GM's track record of cars in this class/size.
 
We sent in survey to C.R. for our cars , appliances , etc.. Doubt it has much impact . Dropped C.R. , it's a joke . Not to pleased with one of the staff members that I had a discussion with . Did write a few reviews of our experience with the 2008 and 2010 Yaris ( traded the '10 , still have the '08 ) at their site when we were subsribers .
 
Consumer reports is good for raising puppies. That's about it.

They are wrong more than right, and their data is highly suspect. They don't even verify ownership!

The extreme bias they show is just another nail in their coffin for me. Garbage.
 
Originally Posted By: bruno
I don't trust any of these " analyses " unless I ee hard numbers on sample size . None of them report that .


The website is a bit awkward. It's still in its infancy, and hopefully it will grow and evolve in the future. You have to scroll over the repair frequency value to get sample info. In the case of the '11 Cruze, they have 44 vehicles participating in the survey, with an average ownership period of 4.5 months and 6100 miles.

Neither Consumer Reports nor True Delta are perfect, but they both provide useful information if you understand their limitations.

Michael Karesh, the owner/operator of True Delta, is passionate about cars and the best automotive reviewer in the business, IMO. Read some of his reviews on thetruthaboutcars and you'll see that he's not the typical journalist who writes sales brochures for auto manufacturers. He has a strong interest in accurate analysis of automobiles.

He has outlined the flaws in Consumer Reports' methodology and is trying to develop a better system. Here are a few of his articles on the subject:

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2006/06/our-reporter-reports-on-consumer-reports/

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008/10/consumer-reports-not-a-ttac-fan

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2010/11...ufficient-data/

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2010/11...coboost-oddity/

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2007/03/consumer-reports-dirty-little-secret/

A couple of JD Power critiques, in case anyone hasn't already realized the pointlessness of their results:

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2006/06/the-truth-about-jd-powers-iqs/

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2010/03/the-truth-about-jd-powers-2010-vehicle-dependability-survey
 
Originally Posted By: tgferg67
The Consumer Reports rating is a predicted reliability rating which probably takes in account of GM's track record of cars in this class/size.


Yep, CR's "current" data can be up to 17 months old, depending when you read it. If you're looking at it right now, it's about 8 months old because they gather their info in the spring and publish it annually every fall. How much info did they have on the 2011 Cruze 8 months ago? Probably not much.
 
I certainly give the for profit company data even LESS credit than that of slightly outdated CR info.
 
I contacted True Delta and hope they respond here. I'm not sure some of you even tried to understand what True Delta even does
 
Thanks for the tip, Steve.

The links to my regular critiques of CR's methods are earlier in the thread. They've been around for a few years. CR and many other people are aware of them. No one has argued that even one of them is not valid, much less successfully argued this.

The "for profit" vs. "not for profit" distinction is meaningless. I'm no more "for profit" than any of the paid employees of Consumer Reports. CR is interested in boosting its revenue at least as much as the average "for profit" company. Just check out how much advertising and PR they conduct, and how hard they push their constantly increasing number of paid services.

Now, it might matter where your revenue comes from. Most of mine comes from ads placed on my site through google Adsense. I have no direct contact with the advertisers, and have no idea if they're even aware their ads are on my site. So there's no way they could influence what we report in the slightest.

Sample size isn't everything--it's also how you use it. My methods and analysis are designed to make the most of relatively small sample sizes. Once the sample size is over 50, the results tend to be solid. And over 25 they're reasonably accurate. CR's manage to often yield iffy results even from large sample sizes. (Check the anomalies critique for more on this.)

I do my best to have everyone report all repairs they experience, whether or not they feel the repair was significant. No doubt some people still make some subjective judgments and under-report--unfortunately for both my results and theirs CR has trained its respondents to do this. If there's any bias in CR's results, this is the source.

With the Cruze, the time period of the survey is likely the big difference. If I look back in my stats six months, which aligns them with CR's survey, the Cruze appeared quite a bit more troublesome than it does today. This isn't uncommon with a new model--the first month or two of production can be buggy. CR's sample included mostly these early cars.

Our survey email for the end of the fourth quarter went out yesterday, and I'll start previewing the raw results to members soon. Maybe the Cruze has continued to improve, maybe it has taken a turn for the worse. The advantage of updating promptly four times a year is that any changes are reported much more quickly.
 
Originally Posted By: 91344George
I certainly give the for profit company data even LESS credit than that of slightly outdated CR info.


Just like a 'not for profit' charity that paid it's CEO six figures and provided a private jet at no cost?

Non profit doesn't mean much, just that they spend all their revenues! And their revenues are CONSIDERABLE.
 
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