Hemi takes 7 qts of oil. I wouln't worry about extending your OCI with that large of a sump.
2012 RAM 1500 W/ HEMI
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Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
No offense but you say this all the time yet you offer nothing other than opinion on it. Chrysler is specific about only using 20 weight. IMO I will go with what the mfg who designed and built the system says to do.
No offense taken. My 'opinion' is based on the ownership of thousands of Hemi buyers who come to our site 300CForums.com. I also hang out at many other Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, etc. sites and have personally interviewed over 100 individuals who actually own these types of vehicles.
Note that I once had lunch with the senior SRT design team at a track event in Homestead back in 2005. They specifically said that the MDS system was not harmed in any way in durability testing for over 200k miles by oils all the way out to 50w!
While it is true it is affected, the effect is so small most drivers will never notice. Ask the people who own them such as posted here.
You do realize I actually owned a 5.7L w/ MDS right?
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
No offense but you say this all the time yet you offer nothing other than opinion on it. Chrysler is specific about only using 20 weight. IMO I will go with what the mfg who designed and built the system says to do.
No offense taken. My 'opinion' is based on the ownership of thousands of Hemi buyers who come to our site 300CForums.com. I also hang out at many other Chrysler, Dodge, Ram, etc. sites and have personally interviewed over 100 individuals who actually own these types of vehicles.
Note that I once had lunch with the senior SRT design team at a track event in Homestead back in 2005. They specifically said that the MDS system was not harmed in any way in durability testing for over 200k miles by oils all the way out to 50w!
While it is true it is affected, the effect is so small most drivers will never notice. Ask the people who own them such as posted here.
You do realize I actually owned a 5.7L w/ MDS right?
Originally Posted By: chevman4life
Mine doesn't run any different on 89 vs. 87. Same amount of power and mpg. I do run 89 every 3rd fillup just for the heck of it or depending on what the price is.
Yeah, my 04 and 08 Ram's w/ 5.7L had no discernable difference between 87 and 89. Not felt power and definitely not MPG. I tried multiple tanks of both in each vehicle to compare and it just made no sense to run the more expensive 89. Now, if I towed a lot or really hammered it all the time I would run the 89 but for the average person 87 is fine in the HEMI(IMO).
Mine doesn't run any different on 89 vs. 87. Same amount of power and mpg. I do run 89 every 3rd fillup just for the heck of it or depending on what the price is.
Yeah, my 04 and 08 Ram's w/ 5.7L had no discernable difference between 87 and 89. Not felt power and definitely not MPG. I tried multiple tanks of both in each vehicle to compare and it just made no sense to run the more expensive 89. Now, if I towed a lot or really hammered it all the time I would run the 89 but for the average person 87 is fine in the HEMI(IMO).
Originally Posted By: buickman50401
They're also specific about the fuel... at least in my folks '08 RAM. The owners manual lists the recommeded fuel to be 89 octane. It goes on to state that 87 will not cause harm but will impact operation and that using more than 89 octane will provide no benefit.
I had a 2008 as well. Not being a jerk here but it doesn't actually state that 87 will impact operation in the manual. It simply states that for optimum performance run 89. My 04 was the same as well. Here is the exact wording from the 08 manual...
Originally Posted By: 08 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Fuel Requirements Page 371-372
The 5.7L engine is designed to meet all emissions regulations and provide satisfactory fuel economy and performance when using high-quality unleaded gasoline having an octane range of 87 to 89. The manufacturer recommends the use of 89 octane for optimum performance. The use of premium gasoline is not recommended. Under normal conditions, the use of premium gasoline will not provide a benefit over high quality regular and mid-grade gasolines, and in some
circumstances may result in poorer performance.
Light spark knock at low engine speeds is not harmful to your engine. However, continued heavy spark knock at high speeds can cause damage and immediate service is required. Poor quality gasoline can cause problems such as hard starting, stalling and hesitations. If you experience these symptoms, try another brand of “regular” gasoline before considering service for the vehicle.
So no where does it say 87 will hurt or impact anything. This is just an FYI and not meant as a personal attack.
Chrysler gives you the option of 2 octane grades to run in the 5.7L HEMI and eiither one is perfectly fine. One is recommended for optimum performance(89) but that doesn't mean the other(87) will cause any harm. My 2 HEMI Rams ran just fine on 87.
They're also specific about the fuel... at least in my folks '08 RAM. The owners manual lists the recommeded fuel to be 89 octane. It goes on to state that 87 will not cause harm but will impact operation and that using more than 89 octane will provide no benefit.
I had a 2008 as well. Not being a jerk here but it doesn't actually state that 87 will impact operation in the manual. It simply states that for optimum performance run 89. My 04 was the same as well. Here is the exact wording from the 08 manual...
Originally Posted By: 08 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Fuel Requirements Page 371-372
The 5.7L engine is designed to meet all emissions regulations and provide satisfactory fuel economy and performance when using high-quality unleaded gasoline having an octane range of 87 to 89. The manufacturer recommends the use of 89 octane for optimum performance. The use of premium gasoline is not recommended. Under normal conditions, the use of premium gasoline will not provide a benefit over high quality regular and mid-grade gasolines, and in some
circumstances may result in poorer performance.
Light spark knock at low engine speeds is not harmful to your engine. However, continued heavy spark knock at high speeds can cause damage and immediate service is required. Poor quality gasoline can cause problems such as hard starting, stalling and hesitations. If you experience these symptoms, try another brand of “regular” gasoline before considering service for the vehicle.
So no where does it say 87 will hurt or impact anything. This is just an FYI and not meant as a personal attack.
Chrysler gives you the option of 2 octane grades to run in the 5.7L HEMI and eiither one is perfectly fine. One is recommended for optimum performance(89) but that doesn't mean the other(87) will cause any harm. My 2 HEMI Rams ran just fine on 87.
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I find it amusing that some folks are willing to disregard the manufacturers instructions in one area yet quote them with fervor in others.
I suspect the oil recommendations are in all actuality just like the fuel. Heck, my 6.1 runs great on 87 as well, and it's recommended fuel is 91 minimum. Never a knock or ping.
YMMV. Everyone gets to do what they want. And I'm not telling ANYONE to change, just pointing out facts in the real world. But one persons anecdotal experiences are easily trumped by thousands who experience a different reality.
I suspect the oil recommendations are in all actuality just like the fuel. Heck, my 6.1 runs great on 87 as well, and it's recommended fuel is 91 minimum. Never a knock or ping.
YMMV. Everyone gets to do what they want. And I'm not telling ANYONE to change, just pointing out facts in the real world. But one persons anecdotal experiences are easily trumped by thousands who experience a different reality.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
I find it amusing that some folks are willing to disregard the manufacturers instructions in one area yet quote them with fervor in others.
I find it amusing that you would try and compare the oil requirement and the fuel octane recommedation as if they were the same thing AND that you then further imply that somehow running 87 is not following the mfg's instructions. Just untrue on both accounts.
Chrysler says to ONLY use 5W20 in 5.7L's w/ MDS. There is no mention that other weights may be used under any special circumstances/situations. Simply use 5W20 period. NO ambiguity about it. They are very clear( I will quote the 2012 manual as the OP's Ram is a 2012 but it has been the same since 06 when MDS came out in the Ram 1500 )...
Originally Posted By: 2012 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Page 626
NOTE: Vehicles equipped with a 5.7L engine must use SAE 5W-20 oil. Failure to do so may result in improper operation of the Multi-Displacement System (MDS). Refer to “Multi-Displacement System” in “Starting and Operating” for further information.
Chrysler has always said, word for word, you can run 89 OR 87 octane fuel in the 5.7L HEMI Rams since they came out in 2003. NO mention that 87 will cause harm. Just that 89 provides optimum performance. They specifically state( again I will quote the 2012 manual but it is the same as it always has been )...
Originally Posted By: 2012 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Page 530
5.7L Engine
This engine is designed to meet all emissions regulations and provide satisfactory fuel economy and performance when using high quality unleaded gasoline having an octane range of 87 to 89. The manufacturer recommends the use of 89 octane for optimum performance. The use of premium gasoline is not recommended, as it will not provide any benefit over
regular gasoline in these engines.
Light spark knock at low engine speeds is not harmful to your engine. However, continued heavy spark knock at high speeds can cause damage and immediate service is required. Poor quality gasoline can cause problems such as hard starting, stalling, and hesitations. If you experience these symptoms, try another brand of gasoline before considering service for the vehicle.
So nothing there to say using 87 is bad. Actually it says the exact opposite. Doing so is NOT "disregard[ing] the manufacturers instructions" at all.
I was actually just waiting for you to say what you did. I knew it was coming!
Sorry but your logic is just completely flawed. Chrysler allows for either/or in regards to octane but is specific on only allowing one weight for oil.
Simply going by what the mfg says to do or does not say to do. Personal experience/opinion may vary.
I find it amusing that some folks are willing to disregard the manufacturers instructions in one area yet quote them with fervor in others.
I find it amusing that you would try and compare the oil requirement and the fuel octane recommedation as if they were the same thing AND that you then further imply that somehow running 87 is not following the mfg's instructions. Just untrue on both accounts.
Chrysler says to ONLY use 5W20 in 5.7L's w/ MDS. There is no mention that other weights may be used under any special circumstances/situations. Simply use 5W20 period. NO ambiguity about it. They are very clear( I will quote the 2012 manual as the OP's Ram is a 2012 but it has been the same since 06 when MDS came out in the Ram 1500 )...
Originally Posted By: 2012 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Page 626
NOTE: Vehicles equipped with a 5.7L engine must use SAE 5W-20 oil. Failure to do so may result in improper operation of the Multi-Displacement System (MDS). Refer to “Multi-Displacement System” in “Starting and Operating” for further information.
Chrysler has always said, word for word, you can run 89 OR 87 octane fuel in the 5.7L HEMI Rams since they came out in 2003. NO mention that 87 will cause harm. Just that 89 provides optimum performance. They specifically state( again I will quote the 2012 manual but it is the same as it always has been )...
Originally Posted By: 2012 Ram 1500 Owner's Manual Page 530
5.7L Engine
This engine is designed to meet all emissions regulations and provide satisfactory fuel economy and performance when using high quality unleaded gasoline having an octane range of 87 to 89. The manufacturer recommends the use of 89 octane for optimum performance. The use of premium gasoline is not recommended, as it will not provide any benefit over
regular gasoline in these engines.
Light spark knock at low engine speeds is not harmful to your engine. However, continued heavy spark knock at high speeds can cause damage and immediate service is required. Poor quality gasoline can cause problems such as hard starting, stalling, and hesitations. If you experience these symptoms, try another brand of gasoline before considering service for the vehicle.
So nothing there to say using 87 is bad. Actually it says the exact opposite. Doing so is NOT "disregard[ing] the manufacturers instructions" at all.
I was actually just waiting for you to say what you did. I knew it was coming!
Simply going by what the mfg says to do or does not say to do. Personal experience/opinion may vary.
The word "MAY" is used. This neither confirms nor denies you the correctness you so desperately seek. It "MAY" cause a problem, but it also "MAY" not. And it has proven to be true that for almost anyone else (besides you) they cannot tell the difference!
There was no 'logic' of any kind used to formulate the response you so correctly anticipated. The recommendation for fuel says pretty much the exact same thing as the oil recommendations. I'm sure the MDS system also performs 'optimally' with the recommended oils. But it simply is wrong to try and scare everyone with a new gen Hemi into thinking they must use 0W-20 or face dire consequences! There are NONE. Period.
If you like I can pretend to agree? But I don't, and my reasons are quite clear. No ambiguity at all. And also no reason to affect you personally in any way. You still get to run whatever you want in any hole.
There was no 'logic' of any kind used to formulate the response you so correctly anticipated. The recommendation for fuel says pretty much the exact same thing as the oil recommendations. I'm sure the MDS system also performs 'optimally' with the recommended oils. But it simply is wrong to try and scare everyone with a new gen Hemi into thinking they must use 0W-20 or face dire consequences! There are NONE. Period.
If you like I can pretend to agree? But I don't, and my reasons are quite clear. No ambiguity at all. And also no reason to affect you personally in any way. You still get to run whatever you want in any hole.
All this would have been avoided if he would have simply gotten a GM V8 powered car like his two older brothers.
I am his oldest brother.
I am his oldest brother.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
The word "MAY" is used. This neither confirms nor denies you the correctness you so desperately seek. It "MAY" cause a problem, but it also "MAY" not. And it has proven to be true that for almost anyone else (besides you) they cannot tell the difference!
There was no 'logic' of any kind used to formulate the response you so correctly anticipated. The recommendation for fuel says pretty much the exact same thing as the oil recommendations. I'm sure the MDS system also performs 'optimally' with the recommended oils. But it simply is wrong to try and scare everyone with a new gen Hemi into thinking they must use 0W-20 or face dire consequences! There are NONE. Period.
If you like I can pretend to agree? But I don't, and my reasons are quite clear. No ambiguity at all. And also no reason to affect you personally in any way. You still get to run whatever you want in any hole.
1st of all when did I try to scare anyone in to anything? When did I say to use 0W20 in it? When did I ever say I used anything but the mfg instructed 5W20 in my 5.7L w/ MDS and that I noticed a difference or had a problem? When did I actually tell the OP( in specific words )if he ran anything but 5W20 he would have mechanical issues? Man, you are really putting words and comments into my mouth that just are not things I said.
THis is all I said before you went of on your usual crusade to tell people they don't have to run 20 weight oil in MDS systems...
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Some on this site will tell you that you can run 30 weight oil BUT Chrysler wants 5W20 run in the 5.7L engines that have MDS. The MDS system operates using the oil( pressure )so IMO it is best to just stick with what the mfg says to run. Your 2012 1500 has MDS so stay with the 5W20. I would not advocate running a 30 weight while under warranty even if it would be ok mechanically( I personally disagree with those who make this claim ). Bottom line is you should follow the owner's manaul at the least while under warranty.
No scaring, no tales of forth coming apocolypse if he ran something other than the factory instructed 5W20, nothing like that. Simply a statement that I feel he should run what Chrysler says to, at least while under warranty, and that I personally disagree with those who say 30 weight is no problem.
I advocate running 5W20 in 5.7L's w/ MDS because that is what the mfg of the vehicle/system says to use. I advocate it for mechanical reasons( I believe they say use it for a reason )but also for warranty reasons. That has nothing to do with scaring anyone in to anything. IMO it is just common sense. I have seen you tell people to stay with what the mfg says to do while under warranty before as well so don't call me out for it now.
MDS operates( properly if that makes you happy )using the oil under pressure as I am sure you know and according to the mfg you MUST( their word not mine )use 5W20 or you MAY( happy )experience problems with how MDS operates. Now, why would they say that if there was no chance of their being issues using anything but the mfg instructed 20 weight oil? If 5W20 was only for CAFE reasons they wouldn't bother say MUST re: 5W20. MDS operates properly on 5W20 so why would anyone use anything else?
It is not the same thing as the either/or re: 87/89 octane either. NOT even close. Sorry you can't see that difference. Chrysler says the vehicle will operate properly on either one with 89 being optimum. IF Chrysler said 5W20 was optimum for MDS but 5W30 was acceptable then your claims would be valid and I would be saying the same thing. Not how it is though.
Again, I am talking about what the mfg specifically says to do. You do as you wish. And just FYI I am far from alone in saying not to run weights other than 20 weight in MDS 5.7L's as you keep saying. You can try and make it out like I am the only one, out alone on an island, and that you have legions of people running other weights if it makes you feel better. I honestly could care less. I respect your knowledge and especially that about MOPARS but I am sorry I completely disagree on running other than 20 weight in MDS systems.
I think it is foolish, if for no other reason than warranty issues, for anyone with a Ram 1500 5.7L w/ MDS still under warranty to run any oil but 5W20( 0W20 probably ok ). Due to the Lifetime Powertrain Warranty that covers models starting with 2006( purchase date dependant )the overwhelming majority of them on the road still have warranty to preserve. The OP has a brand new 2012 so he really has it to worry about. JMO.
The word "MAY" is used. This neither confirms nor denies you the correctness you so desperately seek. It "MAY" cause a problem, but it also "MAY" not. And it has proven to be true that for almost anyone else (besides you) they cannot tell the difference!
There was no 'logic' of any kind used to formulate the response you so correctly anticipated. The recommendation for fuel says pretty much the exact same thing as the oil recommendations. I'm sure the MDS system also performs 'optimally' with the recommended oils. But it simply is wrong to try and scare everyone with a new gen Hemi into thinking they must use 0W-20 or face dire consequences! There are NONE. Period.
If you like I can pretend to agree? But I don't, and my reasons are quite clear. No ambiguity at all. And also no reason to affect you personally in any way. You still get to run whatever you want in any hole.
1st of all when did I try to scare anyone in to anything? When did I say to use 0W20 in it? When did I ever say I used anything but the mfg instructed 5W20 in my 5.7L w/ MDS and that I noticed a difference or had a problem? When did I actually tell the OP( in specific words )if he ran anything but 5W20 he would have mechanical issues? Man, you are really putting words and comments into my mouth that just are not things I said.
THis is all I said before you went of on your usual crusade to tell people they don't have to run 20 weight oil in MDS systems...
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Some on this site will tell you that you can run 30 weight oil BUT Chrysler wants 5W20 run in the 5.7L engines that have MDS. The MDS system operates using the oil( pressure )so IMO it is best to just stick with what the mfg says to run. Your 2012 1500 has MDS so stay with the 5W20. I would not advocate running a 30 weight while under warranty even if it would be ok mechanically( I personally disagree with those who make this claim ). Bottom line is you should follow the owner's manaul at the least while under warranty.
No scaring, no tales of forth coming apocolypse if he ran something other than the factory instructed 5W20, nothing like that. Simply a statement that I feel he should run what Chrysler says to, at least while under warranty, and that I personally disagree with those who say 30 weight is no problem.
I advocate running 5W20 in 5.7L's w/ MDS because that is what the mfg of the vehicle/system says to use. I advocate it for mechanical reasons( I believe they say use it for a reason )but also for warranty reasons. That has nothing to do with scaring anyone in to anything. IMO it is just common sense. I have seen you tell people to stay with what the mfg says to do while under warranty before as well so don't call me out for it now.
MDS operates( properly if that makes you happy )using the oil under pressure as I am sure you know and according to the mfg you MUST( their word not mine )use 5W20 or you MAY( happy )experience problems with how MDS operates. Now, why would they say that if there was no chance of their being issues using anything but the mfg instructed 20 weight oil? If 5W20 was only for CAFE reasons they wouldn't bother say MUST re: 5W20. MDS operates properly on 5W20 so why would anyone use anything else?
It is not the same thing as the either/or re: 87/89 octane either. NOT even close. Sorry you can't see that difference. Chrysler says the vehicle will operate properly on either one with 89 being optimum. IF Chrysler said 5W20 was optimum for MDS but 5W30 was acceptable then your claims would be valid and I would be saying the same thing. Not how it is though.
Again, I am talking about what the mfg specifically says to do. You do as you wish. And just FYI I am far from alone in saying not to run weights other than 20 weight in MDS 5.7L's as you keep saying. You can try and make it out like I am the only one, out alone on an island, and that you have legions of people running other weights if it makes you feel better. I honestly could care less. I respect your knowledge and especially that about MOPARS but I am sorry I completely disagree on running other than 20 weight in MDS systems.
I think it is foolish, if for no other reason than warranty issues, for anyone with a Ram 1500 5.7L w/ MDS still under warranty to run any oil but 5W20( 0W20 probably ok ). Due to the Lifetime Powertrain Warranty that covers models starting with 2006( purchase date dependant )the overwhelming majority of them on the road still have warranty to preserve. The OP has a brand new 2012 so he really has it to worry about. JMO.
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I have a 2010 Hemi and when I was having some issues the first thing the service manager thew in my face was the vehicle requires 5W-20 oil, no if ands or buts.
Lucky that is what I have been running.
Not sure technically if the weight matters but if you are under warranty and plan to take it to the dealer you may want to save yourself the hassle and run what the manufacture tells you.
My MDS seem to like the Amsoil XL 5W-20.
Lucky that is what I have been running.
Not sure technically if the weight matters but if you are under warranty and plan to take it to the dealer you may want to save yourself the hassle and run what the manufacture tells you.
My MDS seem to like the Amsoil XL 5W-20.
I have run 0w20 and 5w20 in my challenger. When I installed my bypass filter I blended 50\50 PU 5w20 and T6 5w40. Hemi tick alot quieter. Seems to also run in 4cyl mode more on small hills. Almost seems like engine has more compression. MDS works fine with oil blend.
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