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It has to be at least semi synthetic to be 0wX, should have added "semi" for the nit pickers.
2010 Honda CR-V Wrong Oil? 5W-20 instead of 0W-20
- Thread starter Daryll
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Originally Posted By: LordAbbett
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
After he drains the oil next time, he's gonna have to scoop the
metal shavings off the bottom of the drain pan with a putty knife.
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
After he drains the oil next time, he's gonna have to scoop the
metal shavings off the bottom of the drain pan with a putty knife.
Originally Posted By: LordAbbett
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received
5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
Maybe no damage will occur, but what if it DOES create accelerated wear over time?
These STealerships deserve the reputations they get 100%.
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received
5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
Maybe no damage will occur, but what if it DOES create accelerated wear over time?
These STealerships deserve the reputations they get 100%.
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Originally Posted By: 91344George
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
Originally Posted By: Daryll
Originally Posted By: 91344George
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
I wasn't directly focusing on your situation but making a general statement.
If Honda states that 0w-20 is supposed to be used in your application and when you go in for service this is what they are supposed to use but install 5w-20, you are being defrauded, because it IS deceptive from the time you order the service and I promise you that the SW DID NOT point out the discrepancy on the receipt.
It isn't minor because while the engine may be the same in MOST ways Honda may have changed some things internally that are requiring the thinner oil. Could be anything from the ECU mapping to mechanical items, who knows.
The bottom line is the manufacturer says use 0w-20!
This is an authorized Honda store, they have NO excuse.
If I was your daughter I would return to the dealer and politely request they install the correct oil. She can say she is concerned about any warranty issues even if the dealer installed it, the factory says different.
Originally Posted By: 91344George
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
I wasn't directly focusing on your situation but making a general statement.
If Honda states that 0w-20 is supposed to be used in your application and when you go in for service this is what they are supposed to use but install 5w-20, you are being defrauded, because it IS deceptive from the time you order the service and I promise you that the SW DID NOT point out the discrepancy on the receipt.
It isn't minor because while the engine may be the same in MOST ways Honda may have changed some things internally that are requiring the thinner oil. Could be anything from the ECU mapping to mechanical items, who knows.
The bottom line is the manufacturer says use 0w-20!
This is an authorized Honda store, they have NO excuse.
If I was your daughter I would return to the dealer and politely request they install the correct oil. She can say she is concerned about any warranty issues even if the dealer installed it, the factory says different.
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I found the manual online. Clearly 5W-20 isn't correct:
Recommended Engine Oil
Oil is a major contributor to your engine’s performance and longevity. Always use a premium-grade 0W-20 detergent oil displaying the API Certification Seal. This seal indicates the oil is energy conserving, and that it meets the American Petroleum Institute’s latest requirements.
Honda Motor Oil is the preferred 0W-20 lubricant for your vehicle. It is highly recommended that you use Honda Motor Oil in your vehicle for optimum engine protection. Make sure the API Certification Seal says ‘‘For Gasoline Engines’’.
The oil viscosity or weight is provided on the container’s label. 0W-20 oil is formulated for year- round protection of your vehicle to improve cold weather starting and fuel economy.
Recommended Engine Oil
Oil is a major contributor to your engine’s performance and longevity. Always use a premium-grade 0W-20 detergent oil displaying the API Certification Seal. This seal indicates the oil is energy conserving, and that it meets the American Petroleum Institute’s latest requirements.
Honda Motor Oil is the preferred 0W-20 lubricant for your vehicle. It is highly recommended that you use Honda Motor Oil in your vehicle for optimum engine protection. Make sure the API Certification Seal says ‘‘For Gasoline Engines’’.
The oil viscosity or weight is provided on the container’s label. 0W-20 oil is formulated for year- round protection of your vehicle to improve cold weather starting and fuel economy.
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
Originally Posted By: LordAbbett
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
After he drains the oil next time, he's gonna have to scoop the
metal shavings off the bottom of the drain pan with a putty knife.
That never bothered me
Originally Posted By: LordAbbett
There is very little benefit to a 0w20 over a 5W20 as for as cold start flow in Atlanta Ga.
After he drains the oil next time, he's gonna have to scoop the
metal shavings off the bottom of the drain pan with a putty knife.
That never bothered me
the only potential issue you may have is that the maintenance minder may be calibrated for a syn-blend oil--so if they used an SM-rated dino, you may want to change it sooner.
That said, the K24 will run on grapefruit juice. A friend of mine was running 14K/2 year OCI's on bulk 5W20 (until I had an intervention with the car), all comprised of 1-3 mile trips. It ran fine, and when I did a valve adjustment @ 60K, it didn't look that bad.
0W20 oil is nice and all, but that's just not a picky engine.
That said, the K24 will run on grapefruit juice. A friend of mine was running 14K/2 year OCI's on bulk 5W20 (until I had an intervention with the car), all comprised of 1-3 mile trips. It ran fine, and when I did a valve adjustment @ 60K, it didn't look that bad.
0W20 oil is nice and all, but that's just not a picky engine.
Your price of $2.37 per quart for 0w-20 is less than half what Honda 0w-20 semi-synthetic costs the dealer. Even the cheapest no-name unadvertised 0w-20 that I can get at my price is more expensive than that.
The fact that the Aussie and Russian Honda manuals "spec/allow" 5W-40 oils should put aside all fears that a single grade change in your oil fill is going to harm any Honda. It's as hot in Australia as Texas and as cold as Duluth in Russia. It isn't a climate thing...it's a CAFE thing.
It also makes me think this talk of "tighter tolerances" or modern engines "designed and Spec'd" for 0W-20 oils is something of a wife's tale. How do they "back spec" and engine for 0W-20 oils if tolerances make that much of a difference?
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with modern 0W-20 oil? How do it know?
It also makes me think this talk of "tighter tolerances" or modern engines "designed and Spec'd" for 0W-20 oils is something of a wife's tale. How do they "back spec" and engine for 0W-20 oils if tolerances make that much of a difference?
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with modern 0W-20 oil? How do it know?
Originally Posted By: ammolab
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with modern 0W-20 oil? How do it know?
Best darn analogy I've seen in here!!!
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with modern 0W-20 oil? How do it know?
Best darn analogy I've seen in here!!!
Originally Posted By: ammolab
The fact that the Aussie and Russian Honda manuals "spec/allow" 5W-40 oils should put aside all fears that a single grade change in your oil fill is going to harm any Honda. It's as hot in Australia as Texas and as cold as Duluth in Russia. It isn't a climate thing...it's a CAFE thing.
It also makes me think this talk of "tighter tolerances" or modern engines "designed and Spec'd" for 0W-20 oils is something of a wife's tale. How do they "back spec" and engine for 0W-20 oils if tolerances make that much of a difference?
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with
The engine MAY be SIMILAR to that used in other markets BUT Honda and other car makers typically will "tweak" things depending on where the model is sold. It could be that the ECU is mapped differently or any number of other things as well.
Bottom line is if the manufacturer requires 0w-20 in the US spec car, then an authorized Honda dealer is supposed to be adhering to that factory spec. Not doing it's own thing.
The fact that the Aussie and Russian Honda manuals "spec/allow" 5W-40 oils should put aside all fears that a single grade change in your oil fill is going to harm any Honda. It's as hot in Australia as Texas and as cold as Duluth in Russia. It isn't a climate thing...it's a CAFE thing.
It also makes me think this talk of "tighter tolerances" or modern engines "designed and Spec'd" for 0W-20 oils is something of a wife's tale. How do they "back spec" and engine for 0W-20 oils if tolerances make that much of a difference?
Can an older engine 'tighten up' it's sphincters when hit with
The engine MAY be SIMILAR to that used in other markets BUT Honda and other car makers typically will "tweak" things depending on where the model is sold. It could be that the ECU is mapped differently or any number of other things as well.
Bottom line is if the manufacturer requires 0w-20 in the US spec car, then an authorized Honda dealer is supposed to be adhering to that factory spec. Not doing it's own thing.
Originally Posted By: Daryll
Originally Posted By: 91344George
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
I would be equally PO'd as well.
They charged you more for an inferior product.
I'd insist they change the oil and put in the specified 0W-20 oil at the dealer expense of course.
Originally Posted By: 91344George
That really isn't the point though. If your parts receipt states they billed you for 0w-20 and you ACTUALLY received 5w-30, it IS fraudulent and a crime.
No. This is NOT what happened. The receipt says 5W-20. And I believe I actually received 5W-20. There is no fraud (that I am alleging or that I know of). There is, however, a failure of the dealership to install the correct fluid that Honda requires, as it clearly states on the oil cap, 0W-20. As pointed out here, 5W-20 WAS the required oil for the same engine/same vehicle from 2007-9. And 5W-20 is, perhaps "close enough" to 0W-20 that this is only a minor issue. That's what I am trying to determine here!
But even if just a minor thing, it's annoying that a authorized Honda dealer can't get the oil right for a common late model of one of their own vehicles. But this does not extend to being a fraud issue. (Although they could have put in vegetable oil for all I really know)
I would be equally PO'd as well.
They charged you more for an inferior product.
I'd insist they change the oil and put in the specified 0W-20 oil at the dealer expense of course.
No great response from Honda. Honda itself just has a person answer the phone and contact the dealership. Yawn. Then the service manager called and claimed that his tech accidentially used the 5W-20 that's their most common oil blah blah blah. He offered to rechange it, but I decided, based on what I've read here, to leave it in for 3-4K miles...maybe 5...then have it done right next time. They'll credit the cost of the oil change but that's really not a satisfactory fix. But I guess this is more of a misdemeanor than a felony so I'll let it go at that. I did document everything so if there ever is an engine problem I can show THEIR dealer goofed way back when. But again, from what I read here, the odds of anything bad happening are slim. And there is a good chance daughter will be onto another vehicle before this vehicle would get to the point where an engine would start to go bad.
If Honda DOES track dealer complainsts, at least I added a notch to this dealer's bad-boy belt.
If Honda DOES track dealer complainsts, at least I added a notch to this dealer's bad-boy belt.
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Originally Posted By: Daryll
But again, from what I read here, the odds of anything bad happening are slim. daughter will be onto another vehicle before this vehicle would get to the point where an engine would start to go bad.
There is absolutely nothing that's going to happen to the CRV with the oil they put in you daughters car, it's just heavier on start-up resulting in slightly lower fuel economy.
You've been offered a free oil change so I would consider that a satisfactory outcome.
But again, from what I read here, the odds of anything bad happening are slim. daughter will be onto another vehicle before this vehicle would get to the point where an engine would start to go bad.
There is absolutely nothing that's going to happen to the CRV with the oil they put in you daughters car, it's just heavier on start-up resulting in slightly lower fuel economy.
You've been offered a free oil change so I would consider that a satisfactory outcome.
The thing is that you are paying for service but not getting it.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
Originally Posted By: 91344George
The thing is that you are paying for service but not getting it.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
They offered to change it out--then offered to credit the oil change when he gets it changed next time. What else can they do? Seems like good service from the dealer to me. Yeah, they made a mistake. Things happen. This wasn't exactly a major mistake, and they're rectifying the situation. That's a more positive experience than I've ever had with a dealer...
The thing is that you are paying for service but not getting it.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
They offered to change it out--then offered to credit the oil change when he gets it changed next time. What else can they do? Seems like good service from the dealer to me. Yeah, they made a mistake. Things happen. This wasn't exactly a major mistake, and they're rectifying the situation. That's a more positive experience than I've ever had with a dealer...
So let me get this straight. Your daughter drives a vehicle on public roads with human lives all around her yet you don't think she would understand different oil weights. And she is gone away to school. Interesting.
Originally Posted By: JOD
Originally Posted By: 91344George
The thing is that you are paying for service but not getting it.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
They offered to change it out--then offered to credit the oil change when he gets it changed next time. What else can they do? Seems like good service from the dealer to me. Yeah, they made a mistake. Things happen. This wasn't exactly a major mistake, and they're rectifying the situation. That's a more positive experience than I've ever had with a dealer...
My sentiments exactly.
Originally Posted By: 91344George
The thing is that you are paying for service but not getting it.
if a dealer can't get something as simple as the oil change done correctly i wonder about the bigger jobs.
They offered to change it out--then offered to credit the oil change when he gets it changed next time. What else can they do? Seems like good service from the dealer to me. Yeah, they made a mistake. Things happen. This wasn't exactly a major mistake, and they're rectifying the situation. That's a more positive experience than I've ever had with a dealer...
My sentiments exactly.
Originally Posted By: Clevy
So let me get this straight. Your daughter drives a vehicle on public roads with human lives all around her yet you don't think she would understand different oil weights. And she is gone away to school. Interesting.
This wasn't a question of not being able to understand. It was a question of me not even realizing it was something I needed to tell her to understand. You do make a point, but truthfully I never educated her to even ask the question. Just "have the Honda dealer change the oil". I never even thought they WOULDN'T be competent to put the right juice in. Or perhaps it was indeed a rare honest mistake. I will, indeed, educate her going forward. I wonder how many people even check their receipts to verify the correct oil goes into their cars? And how many even know what oil SHOULD go into their car? And more "sinisterly", how many dealers use something other than what they tell coustomers they used (which was NOT my case, here, BTW)?
So let me get this straight. Your daughter drives a vehicle on public roads with human lives all around her yet you don't think she would understand different oil weights. And she is gone away to school. Interesting.
This wasn't a question of not being able to understand. It was a question of me not even realizing it was something I needed to tell her to understand. You do make a point, but truthfully I never educated her to even ask the question. Just "have the Honda dealer change the oil". I never even thought they WOULDN'T be competent to put the right juice in. Or perhaps it was indeed a rare honest mistake. I will, indeed, educate her going forward. I wonder how many people even check their receipts to verify the correct oil goes into their cars? And how many even know what oil SHOULD go into their car? And more "sinisterly", how many dealers use something other than what they tell coustomers they used (which was NOT my case, here, BTW)?
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