0 weight oils?

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Can someone explain what a 0 wt oil really is? I've seen oils referred to as 0-20 wt, does that mean they are a 20 wt like a straight wt oil? I'm having a hard time understanding how a fluid can have 0 viscosity.,,
 
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.
 
A 0-weight oil would be really, really thin. But I don't think that's what you mean.
wink.gif


You seem to be talking about 0w oils, as in 0w-20, 0w-30, etc. The w doesn't mean "weight." It simply refers to how the oil works when you crank your engine at very cold temperatures. The big number (20, 30, 40, etc.) refers to how the oil acts when it's hot. They are two different numbers that mean two different things.

For example:

A 0w-20 works nicely as low as -30º C, and acts like a straight-20 weight oil when it's hot.

A 5w-20 works as low as -25º C, and acts like a straight-20 weight oil when it's hot.

A 0w-30 works down to -30º C, and acts like a straight-30 weight oil when it's hot.


Does that make sense?
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.
I f don't know the answer either why did you post such a snotty remark?. I guess it doesn't require nothing more then $20 to be a "Amsoil expert". Thanks for nothing.,,
 
Originally Posted By: Norm Olt
I know of no motorcycle that uses a 0W-XX oil...

Yet.

Cheers!

There is probably just no need. Who keeps their bike outside, starts it up when it's -30C and goes riding?
lol.gif


With that said, I see no problem using such oils in a motorcycle as long as they have proper add pack and are wet clutch friendly (limited friction modifiers, JASO MA rated, etc.)
 
The numbers themselves in the SAE system don't correspond to a specific measurement they represent a range. For 10w-30 motor oil, the 10w is a performance range at cold temperature and 30 is a performance range at hot temperature. They could signify it as "SAE Grade C-E" and it would mean the same thing.
0w-20 gets a "0w" because they started the original range designations (10w-30 etc) so low that they hit "0w" when they needed something that performed at lower temperatures than "5w".
 
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.
I f don't know the answer either why did you post such a snotty remark?. I guess it doesn't require nothing more then $20 to be a "Amsoil expert". Thanks for nothing.,,

He wasn't being snotty. Most people learn and retain information best if they make some effort to dig up that information and try to read it with understanding. That is why Pablo suggested you search for that SAE J300 table. Once you see it, it'll help you comprehend what the "0w-XX" means.
 
I can see how his remark looks snotty at first, but I don't think Pablo meant it that way. He just didn't know how to help you except by referring you to the SAE J300 table.

Now, I don't agree with his advice; based on your question, I don't think the J300 table would really help you understand what's going on. However, there's no need to attack him personally for it.
 
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.
I f don't know the answer either why did you post such a snotty remark?. I guess it doesn't require nothing more then $20 to be a "Amsoil expert". Thanks for nothing.,,


Not "snotty" at all. Why do you assume I "don't know the answer either"?

I gave some advice and I explained exactly why I did so. If you want to get all sensitive and personal, then that is a choice you decide to make.

OK here's the first hit when I Google:

http://widman.biz/English/Tables/J300.html

It's an old version from Widman's page (I wish he would post the 2008 version), but anyway - just take a look at the table rather than be the typical attack the Amsoil guy stooge. See the left columns? It very precisely shows the measured maximum viscosities for "0W", "5W", "10W", etc. If the oil is lower than that viscosity at the the given temperature then the oil can be labeled with "0W", "5W", "10W", etc.

Not so tough, huh?
 
"
There is probably just no need. Who keeps their bike outside, starts it up when it's -30C and goes riding? LOL"


Agree that it's unlikely that one would be riding a motorcycle at those temperatures but ATV engines are pretty much the same as many motorcycle engines. Maybe not quite as sophisticated as the the more complicated motorcycle engines but very similar otherwise.

I see that ATV manufacturers (Polaris in particular) recommend some strange weight oils such as 2W50 and warn not to use anything else. Well, as far as I'm concerned that has bovine feces written all over it. What ATV engine could be designed to such significant tolerances that a 2W50 oil must be used? Please????

Don't you dare use a 5W50 or a 0W50 or 5W40. You'll blow that baby right up just by bringing the oil near it!!!

Can't believe how many suckers fall for that?

Don't know how many times I've been in the bike shop watching pimply faced young fools, hats on sideways, extolling the virtues of $15.00 quart oil to each other. The shop owners love them. The mark up on those products is extremely lucrative and you can bet that they'll encourage the uninformed to empty their wallets for the ATV picture on the bottle.

2W50 is knarly man!! Anything else will pooch your engine dude! Rotella? Mobil? That won't work. Doesn't even have an ATV picture on the jug cuz it's fer trucks.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.
I f don't know the answer either why did you post such a snotty remark?. I guess it doesn't require nothing more then $20 to be a "Amsoil expert". Thanks for nothing.,,


Not "snotty" at all. Why do you assume I "don't know the answer either"?

I gave some advice and I explained exactly why I did so. If you want to get all sensitive and personal, then that is a choice you decide to make.

I had a friend who asked me about 0 weight oil. I didn't know the answer, so I came here where I thought someone who did, would respond.Instead I get a sarcastic response from one of the sponsors. Maybe it's my mistake. I thought this site was a place you could come and ask an oil related questions and get a good response. Now you've decided all anyone needs to do is do a Google search for the answers.Heck maybe you should contact the people who run this site and tell them to shut the site down, because all we need to do is use Google for oil related answers.Other responses posted were appreciated.Pablo do me a favour, in the future if you see one of my posts, please skip over it.

Not so tough, huh?
 
Originally Posted By: BigCahuna


I had a friend who asked me about 0 weight oil. I didn't know the answer, so I came here where I thought someone who did, would respond.Instead I get a sarcastic response from one of the sponsors. Maybe it's my mistake. I thought this site was a place you could come and ask an oil related questions and get a good response. Now you've decided all anyone needs to do is do a Google search for the answers.Heck maybe you should contact the people who run this site and tell them to shut the site down, because all we need to do is use Google for oil related answers.Other responses posted were appreciated.Pablo do me a favour, in the future if you see one of my posts, please skip over it.



My response was NOT sarcastic in the least. I was trying help you learn. Until now, you never wrote anything about helping a friend.

Quote:
I'm having a hard time understanding how a fluid can have 0 viscosity.,,


So other than attacking me what is so terrible about my answer?

I never told you to Google for an answer. I very, very specifically told you what to Google. SAE J300. That said, did you learn anything from the table? Like it or not, the table from the SAE specification is how 0W is defined. That is exactly why I want to show you how to find it and learn.And what do I get? I freaking personal and pointed attack. I find that really, really weird. You bet I won't respond to your posts.
 
Forums are a place for people to exchange opinions, ideas and experiences as well as seek and provide information and guidance. I agree that simply directing participants to alternative information sources isn't what forums are about.

Had Pablo provided a simple explanation accompanied with further reference sources, chances are that this discussion wouldn't be happening. Not saying what he did is rude. I'd use the term direct. Which I'm often guilty of.

I don't know how many times I've seen new participants ask questions on other forums only to be advised to perform a search to find relevant topics. Normally, I'll try a search first but often, the forum's search function doesn't work all that well and if it does, sometimes the list of returns is ridiculous.

In closing, all I have to say is 2W50 all the freaking way dude!!!
 
2w-50 sounds great on paper. I found 5w-50 that i think will be great for spring/fall here in Saskatchewan. I have heated gear and ride every chance I can. In the spring when the mornings it's 2 degrees I know that a 20w-50 will flow like molasses. I just went outside and pulled the dipstick on my bike and the oil dripped off,which tells me it is thin enough to flow at this temp(-5). And since the second number is 50 it's thick enough at temp to meet the spec. I am going to a straight 60 this summer and going across the mountains with my old lady for 2 weeks. I will use my dipstick temp gauge and test first 20w50 and the temps associated riding in the summer heat,then go to a 20w-60 and see if there is a difference. Since red-line makes both weights I will use that brand for testing purposes. I will start a thread on it so us regular joes can have something to refer to using real word riding experience.
Good idea. Post your thoughts please and lmk if there is a way I can qualify this as a real test.
Thanks
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.


I guess when you tell someone to learn to read a chart and get back to the group. Then follow it up with "If you haven't learned by now........" You shouldn't be too surprised when someone takes your remarks as condesending.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: OnTheFence
Originally Posted By: Pablo
Google SAE J300 table

Learn to read the table and get back to us.

This is not being terse or rude. IMHO if you have 500+ posts here and it has not been absorbed by reading, I think a visual representation via a table may just help.


I guess when you tell someone to learn to read a chart and get back to the group. Then follow it up with "If you haven't learned by now........" You shouldn't be too surprised when someone takes your remarks as condesending.


However, that's not what I wrote now is it? I explained why I wrote it that way. I suggested that maybe simply reading is not his best mode of learning.

I do however think someone who has over 500 posts, and gives oil advice to others, well maybe should be able to find the table and understand it. Just saying.
 
Wow. Alot of sensitive folks in here. My interpretation of 0w oils is they have the characteristics of a 0 weight when its winter and substantially below 0 celcius
 
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